walks with a gimp

No matter which cam system you have on your bow, it must be tuned or rotated to factory spec for the system to operate the way it was designed. Modern string materials are very good but sooner or later, which ever system you are shooting will need maintence to keep performing the way it was designed. I don't think the statement that single cams are faster with heavy arrows that duals can be proven until a bow is built that can be set up with a single cam and dual cams with the exact same force draw curve, draw length, brace height, axle to axle length and have the same amount of inherent friction in the system. Marketing is the largest driving force to get people to buy new bows. New systems, colors, weights, performances and promises, etc is what keeps selling bows. Thay are all good otherwise they wouldn't be selling.

Orions_Bow

Here are some information that is stated from various companies on their cams.

Hybrids have straighter nock travel thank solo cams - True & False so neither is the better option it all depends on the cam in question. Some cams such as the Cam 1/2 by Hoyt & the Straightline Max Cam by Mathews have very level nock travel. Is one better than the other? Not really. People have shot bows with very poor nock travel very well so in general repeatability of the shot sequence may be more important in the long run.

Single Cams never go out of sync - another True & False statement. Technically they never go out of tune but they can go out of time when the cables stretch. The hybrid helps this by using a shorter cable length BUT a single cam like the model Pearson made 3 years ago & the one Hoyt made before the hybrid cam will do a similar job. The idler on those systems terminated the string in the idler which gave shorter strings & where less likely to stretch. I think this is a moot point with any cam system anymore, good strings by Winners Choice, Stone Mountain, etc. will eliminate this problem anyway.

Dual cams and Hybrids are faster - True & False again - it all depends on the bow & how it is designed. Hoyts IBO speeds are right in line with the speeds they had with single cams, mathews speeds on the black max are fatser than some dual cams. This another point that is rather silly in my perpective. a bunch of marketing BS on all sides of the fence. You see speeds for all 3 styles anywhere between 290-330fps so I don't see compairing speed traights as an honest answer either.

Which cam is honestly better? The one you shoot better is the only true answer!

Pinwheel 12

"For those of you who understand, no explanation is necessary."

"For those of you who do NOT understand, no explanation is possible."

Well, maybe it's not THAT bad,[8D] but I see alot of loyalty and posts on here simply based on emotion and flat-out brand preference. It would honestly take me about 3-5 hours to detail the overall inherent properties of hybrids that thus makes them so much superior to the conventional solocam technically, and I do not have the time nor inclination to get into this that deep yet again. Much smoke has been blown over the last decade over the C Solo, but people are FINALLY figuring it out--TRUE hybrid designs such as the CPS, Omega, Tru-Arc, and now others have it all over a conventional solocam in so many ways it's difficult to find a place to start, let alone explain it all, LOL.[8D] And guess what? Twin cams they have beat also! (IMHO) So yes, I'm going to leave you all hanging on this one because it will only turn yet again into another spitting contest so this is just "MHO"--- But I'll leave you with this--- think about "set and forget" tuning, level nock travel at all drawlengths and what that means when shooting and tuning fixed blade heads, limbtip travel of equal distance during the shot (and what the effects on bows that do not offer this would have during a shot sequence), and overall shootability and handling. The best of these is only a limited example of what you get from the true hybrid designs, and make no mistake, they will soon take over as the #1 eccentric option everywhere, like 'em or not--- I guarantee it-- don't even have to look into the crystal ball this time![8D] Why? Simply because they ARE a better mousetrap, no matter what the solocam loyalists or twin cam loyalists(of which I was until my own eyes were opened) scream--the bottom line is that they have effectively combined the best attributes of both into one system and thrown out the poor qualities of each. And most REAL industry techs who are worth their salt agree. As stated , "JMHO".) Good shooting, Pinwheel 12

Matt / PA

Silent,
A bit to general for my tastes.......also every cam system has it's own efficiency levels regardless of single, dual, or hybrid and will react differently to varying arrow weights even within the same cam system.

For example.....you state that duals lose 40-50fps from a 350-450gr jump.
My 03' Patriot Dual Cam did not bear this out.

374gr= 318fps
474gr= 289fps

Net loss over 100gr jump in weight= 29fps. That's 1fps for every 2.9grs.

Food for thought.

Orions_Bow

Pinwheel 12 - I am sure from some technical aspects the Hybrid might show some positives over the other styles but they as well show some positives over the hybrid. No doubt I agree that the hybrid is here to stay as well as the single cam & dual cams. I like options and it was great seeing Bowtech, AR, and Merlin having all types of cams. It adds to a wider market to appeal to more shooters which is a good thing. Now I would ask this. Can you show me how any cam version is vastly superior to any other? Be as technical as you want but offer a fair comparison of each type to show the stengths & weekness of them all. Speed alone is not a good comparison as to which system is more efficient.

This is an interesting topic so I would love to see the details form an engineering standpoint.

Arthur P

Orions_Bow, my man, you're asking for a 500 page book minimum, filled with charts and graphs on each and every cam system on the market! Very definitely something I'd like to see done, but it would be obsolete by the time it left the printer's shop.

Orions_Bow

LOL Arthur you are right! Maybe a best of 5 or 6 cam systems report.

Hoyt Cam 1/2
Darton CPS System
Mathews Straightline Max Cam
Bowtech Dually Cam
Merlins Dually Cam
Mathews HP Cam

Now that would be a cool report!

silentassassin

Matt,

That was a pretty generalized statement and I am sure that you would know more about it than me. I was using the generalized 2:1 and 3:1 statement. I actually had you in mind or at least I thought it was you that had previously posted this 2:1 - 3:1 "rule". Obviously, it doesn't hold true in every case but generally speaking solos are more efficient than duals.

Pinwheel 12

OB--

Variety is good yes, but only to the degree that it does not hamper an archers' ability should there be something else that will help said archer improve score or be more accurate on game. I will try to get back here to get more in-depth with this as I know my last post was unfair to leave you guys hanging like that. Difficult when running three businesses, ya know.[8D]

Art-- You are exactly right! At LEAST 500 pages![] Lots of work.

INDEPENDANT Testing is the only way to pull the rabbit out of the hat to be honest--- all done in a facility with state of the art equipment, all models tested in the same place, at the same time, with the same equipment, same arrows, and by the same NON-biased testers who have no affiliations to any manufacturer and who do not accept bribes or cower to threats![8D] THEN we could get to the bottom of it all, even tho I do this same sort of stuff myself and already know the outcome.

More later when time permits. Pinwheel 12

Mike from Texas

I certainly don't pretend to be able to jump into this conversation and add any input, but I'd like to ask this. For the guy who just wants a good dependable bow that he can take to the deer stand and kill a deer when the opportunity presents itself, does it really matter what type of cam system he shoots as long as he can put it in the kill zone when it counts? Personally I could care less about knocking fletching off my arrows at 40 yards because I have yet to shoot a deer (or at one for that matter) beyond about 30 yards. Some are 20 yards, most are less. As far as I'm concerned, as long as I can put the first shot in the kill zone every time, I'm a happy camper. It's very rare you will get that second shot if you goof the first one.

I agree these conversations are good for picking up the technical aspects of each system, and I feel they are necessary but are we being just a bit picky here? Chances are we will all never agree on what is truly the best system.