Irish Setters:Are they any good?
02-25-2006, 09:04 PM
#26
Typical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location:
Posts: 860
RE: Irish Setters:Are they any good?
My suggestion would be possibly check out different trialing venues as each will have different requirements. Then join an affiliated club so you actually see the dogs that compete work. Then really polish the dog's training. You do have one thing going for you, you're competing with an Irish setter. You'll surprise alot of judges and they'll look hard at whether it can hunt or not. Even possibly letting a few unproductives go. The more attention you bring upon your dogs, the better. But it could also go the opposite way, if the judge already made up his mind then changing it is gonna be real hard.
BTW, is your dog a true Irish setter? Any red setter blood?
BTW, is your dog a true Irish setter? Any red setter blood?
02-27-2006, 06:30 PM
#28
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 32
RE: Irish Setters:Are they any good?
Stylish point IMO and I have been around quite a few dogs.......different hunting organizations have different standards when it comes to what the tail should be doing.....a lot of them are full of balogna and overlook the hunting ability of the animal...it is important to be stylish but a 10'oclock versus 12 o'clock is splitting straws...more importantly is the race and hunt desire. I have hunted behind a couple of Irish setters and IMHO the Irish red and whites tend to be a little more field oriented...not saying that you can't find a good Irish Setter....just odds seem better with the red and whites........The field trial Red Setter is probably more English Setter than Irish but in some ways they may have saved the hunting prowess of this once fantastic hunting dog. It saddens me that you just don't see that many really good ones around because I love their personalities. If you have a good one congrats and that dog is pure gold
02-27-2006, 07:43 PM
#29
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Maine
Posts: 12,564
RE: Irish Setters:Are they any good?
Thank you for the comment I have e-mailed a club and yet to hear
from them. I have problems that is on another post and if I can get through those issues I know he'll go far very quickly. I've never been around any like this one. I also think you do not find many is because
of the misunderstanding of the Irish, because of the show dogs. He is quite active withrunning down the road between
15 and 18 miles an hour for 3 to 4 miles whenever we can get a chance. Even at this distance he still wants to keep
running.
from them. I have problems that is on another post and if I can get through those issues I know he'll go far very quickly. I've never been around any like this one. I also think you do not find many is because
of the misunderstanding of the Irish, because of the show dogs. He is quite active withrunning down the road between
15 and 18 miles an hour for 3 to 4 miles whenever we can get a chance. Even at this distance he still wants to keep
running.
02-27-2006, 10:01 PM
#30
Typical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location:
Posts: 860
RE: Irish Setters:Are they any good?
Here is a re-post from an old-time trialer. I only know him as Herb but his handle is Hhanderson so I assume it's Herb Handerson:
"Yes, I have seen Irish setters at times over the sixty years that I have been going to field trials. Not many it is true and I don't recall any that placed in an AF trial. Yes, I think your friend should enter his dog and start attending field trials. Would judges be willing to place an Irish? I have for a number of years been attending about 12-14 major circuit trials every year and riding every brace and I have served as reporter, judge, handler and scout. While I have a professional who handles my dogs in open stakes, I handle them in Amateur events and hope to be competing in the National Amateur Chukar Championship in Aprll and regional amateur championships. In all these contacts in AF trials I have never seen anything to indicate to me that an Irish or whatever would not be placed if his peformance merited it. In fact my belief is that most judges would be extremely pleased to be able to place an Irish. But to get placed the dog must perform and the lack of placement for failure to perform cannot be attributed to anything but the lack of performance. To bring out the best in the dog he needs experience and that is obtained by exposure to wild birds regularly, three times a week, week after week, month after month., not on occasional weekend hunting trips. In AF trials there will be many dogs which have that kind of experience. Many will get it from a professional who works the dogs regularly because that is his full time job. He has the grounds, the knowledge and the work ethic to get the job done. Most of us amateurs have a job which iis our primary concern and everything else, including dog training, has to take a back seat. There are of course some amateurs who have the wherewithal, the time, the grounds and the money to do the same job, but most of us don't. In the past there have been some fine Irish. Horace Lytle had Smada Byrd who did well. But that was eighty years ago. Then there was Askew's Carolina Lady almost sixty years ago. She is in the Pointing Dog Hall of Fame along with the setters and pointers and had a substantial lead in the popular voting by Pointer and Setter people. She was 100% Irish with no outcrosses and she was a "Blue Hen" who produced winners from whatever bred to and was used by Ned La Grande in the establishment of the Red Setters. Truman Cowles is an English Setter man and a good writer and if your friend does not have Cowles "The Red Setter" I think he would enjoy it. While as the title indicates it is about the development of the Red Setter, the early part of the book discusses pure Irish and has a lot about their competition in field trials. I don't know much about Irish but I think your friend should subscribe to the Irish Setter publication "The Flushing Whip" and get acquainted with other Irish setter fans. The dog looks good in the picture. He may find the AKC trials to his liking. Herb "
From another post from Herb:
"You might want to check out the red setter championship next month. I believe to enter a dog must first qualify, but it would be a good place to see what AF red dogs do. Try www.nrsftc.com or google national red setter field trial club. Those folks could probably help you to find AF trials in your area.
Other'n that, try www.akc.org to find irish setter club trials in your area. Click on 'events' then 'pointing breed field trials' then you can search by breed or state or month.
High tails and happy trialing. Good luck!"
"Yes, I have seen Irish setters at times over the sixty years that I have been going to field trials. Not many it is true and I don't recall any that placed in an AF trial. Yes, I think your friend should enter his dog and start attending field trials. Would judges be willing to place an Irish? I have for a number of years been attending about 12-14 major circuit trials every year and riding every brace and I have served as reporter, judge, handler and scout. While I have a professional who handles my dogs in open stakes, I handle them in Amateur events and hope to be competing in the National Amateur Chukar Championship in Aprll and regional amateur championships. In all these contacts in AF trials I have never seen anything to indicate to me that an Irish or whatever would not be placed if his peformance merited it. In fact my belief is that most judges would be extremely pleased to be able to place an Irish. But to get placed the dog must perform and the lack of placement for failure to perform cannot be attributed to anything but the lack of performance. To bring out the best in the dog he needs experience and that is obtained by exposure to wild birds regularly, three times a week, week after week, month after month., not on occasional weekend hunting trips. In AF trials there will be many dogs which have that kind of experience. Many will get it from a professional who works the dogs regularly because that is his full time job. He has the grounds, the knowledge and the work ethic to get the job done. Most of us amateurs have a job which iis our primary concern and everything else, including dog training, has to take a back seat. There are of course some amateurs who have the wherewithal, the time, the grounds and the money to do the same job, but most of us don't. In the past there have been some fine Irish. Horace Lytle had Smada Byrd who did well. But that was eighty years ago. Then there was Askew's Carolina Lady almost sixty years ago. She is in the Pointing Dog Hall of Fame along with the setters and pointers and had a substantial lead in the popular voting by Pointer and Setter people. She was 100% Irish with no outcrosses and she was a "Blue Hen" who produced winners from whatever bred to and was used by Ned La Grande in the establishment of the Red Setters. Truman Cowles is an English Setter man and a good writer and if your friend does not have Cowles "The Red Setter" I think he would enjoy it. While as the title indicates it is about the development of the Red Setter, the early part of the book discusses pure Irish and has a lot about their competition in field trials. I don't know much about Irish but I think your friend should subscribe to the Irish Setter publication "The Flushing Whip" and get acquainted with other Irish setter fans. The dog looks good in the picture. He may find the AKC trials to his liking. Herb "
From another post from Herb:
"You might want to check out the red setter championship next month. I believe to enter a dog must first qualify, but it would be a good place to see what AF red dogs do. Try www.nrsftc.com or google national red setter field trial club. Those folks could probably help you to find AF trials in your area.
Other'n that, try www.akc.org to find irish setter club trials in your area. Click on 'events' then 'pointing breed field trials' then you can search by breed or state or month.
High tails and happy trialing. Good luck!"