if you believe that your vote counts than we would have a different president, after all Gore had the most general public votes.........now lets not start a presidential debate because i am happy with the pres we got, for better or worse.
i am jsut saying that the majority in a vote should win, surely you agree with that and that is what i was trying to convey to you in my last post. everyone is brought up with that basic understanding that the majority rules.
so with that i say let the members vote by poll and the majority wins, seems logical to me........that is what is great about this country and why so many want to come to it.
by the way, calm down a little, apparently it is easier for you to find someone elses shortcomings(inyour eyes of course) to make yourself feel better. but someone of your intellect i won' t even try to match wits with........

Polls are done but when you only get 8 to 10% response on a good day whose fault is it, so my question is what is the right way to do a poll. They have been put in programs and handed to shooters as they register I am looking for ideas that would get at least a 50% response you are the shooters what would get you to fill them out and return them?

Without getting out of hand, would it be possible to put just a few questions on an IBO registration card for people to fill out when they renew their membership? I agree that the response on polls are usually very low, but if it was kept to 3-4 questions it might be accepted well. However, the work would be on the receiving end of the poll. And I do feel sorry for that person.

Great move making Snowshoe a 4 day shoot. I just hope people realize that changes to shoots like this are no easy decision and they are all meant to try and improve the quality of the shoot for the shooters.

Until all the changes are published to the membership a poll would solve no purpose unless you ran a poll on future issues. A poll of the Forum would not cover enough members it would seem. Polls on future changes of rules or locations could be published when the board makes such changes but the changes should not be made until the following year so that the members can be made aware of any changes and have time to make suggestions or accept or reject such changes. There are many ways to do a poll, mass mail, score cards, ballots, telephone call in to an 800 number using membership number, sample surveys, polls sponsored by manufactures, etc. If the IBO does not have an 800 number maybe it would be worth installing one.

Moving forward should be the goal, looking back should teach us.

All this talk about polls makes me laugh. Let me explain something to ya, This country is a democracy and therfore you have the right to vote in it. The IBO is a PRIVATE non profit organization ran by a president and a board of directors. It is NOT a Democracy. No where in anything you signed up for in your membership package does it say ANYTHING about you getting to vote on ANYTHING at all. The board of directors and the president will make the decisions whether you like that or not that' s the way it is. They don' t have to ask you how you feel about anything if they don' t want to. So far it seems like they have at least tried to do what they feel is what most of the membership wants. They are being nice. They don' t really have to. So to anyone who DEMANDS a say in how things are run and they MUST be heard I say no you don' t really need to be heard at all. After they tell you what decision they make THEN you can voice your opinion by either choosing to be part of the IBO or dropping out. All the moaning and complaining aint gonna help no one. Either accept the decision or not those are your REAL choices. Now I know some of you won' t like my post and probably will flame me for it. I tell things the way they are not neccessarily what you want to hear.

Punchmaster,
What do you think keeps this organization an organization?????? Do you think it is monetarily supported by the President and the BOD?????? I dont think so. It' s true you cannot please everyone and the deal with the weather is almost forcing them to extend the days. I dont think people are going to have a problem with that...lose the attitude will ya! Are you having a hard time harvesting a deer or something???

I agree the four day event will hopefully be better. I just get tired of reading posts that DEMAND a vote or that I should have a say in things going on. They AREN' T entitled to it. They also don' t give enough credit to Ken and the others who run the event who in my opinion have a very difficult job without hecklers from the sidelines. Ken and the leaders do carry the burden of keeping the membership up and the people happy to a certain degree so they will keep coming back but they also at times have to separate themselves from that and do what is in the OVERALL best interest of the organization no matter how unpopular that decision is within the membership.

Make suggestions, offer an opinion, that' s fine: But thinking that we are all gonna vote on something that' s just crazy talk.

Punchmaster,

I don' t think that I have ever heard it explained quite that way. I' m sure that you must have some knowledge of the organization or else you would not be posting with such authority. Just who do you represent when you blat out this information.
During the short time that I have been in the IBO I have never got that impression entirely on any of the " moaning or complaining" that I do. I may not be at the top of the popularity poll but I think that if what you are saying is entirely true than you should explain this to the IBO BOD and the President and have them back up your story. On some occassions I have seen unpopular explanations and rulings come down but I have never seen or heard a complete disregard for the entire membership. Any organization that has total lack of interest in the goals of the membership shall not last long. This organization has a twelve month agenda and a 3 Month schedule of events that to date has gone quite a ways but I will assure you that they did not do it with an attitude such as you are trying to spread.

Your enthusiasm for the Organization is overwhelming but your visions of the future make you nearsighted.

You want me to ask the IBO to backup what I wrote? They would never do that. I' m way too politically incorrect. I' m blunt and tactless. But I ask you this. Tactlessness aside, EXACTLY what part of what I wrote has INCORRECT information in it in your opinion?

I apparently read Punchmaster' s post differently than some. I see nothing which would promote or suggest a disregard for the opinions of the membership on the part of the IBO. Quite the contrary. He points out that although The BOD is under no direct obligation to obtain input from their members, they choose to do so in a variety of ways. Polls have been attempted. (with less than enthusiastic results) This very forum has been established to provide for a source of input. They have established a network of State Representatives from across the country to act as a direct liason to the organization. The office staff have provided an open door policy to encourage questions and offer answers. And Ken and various Board members personally monitor this forum and provide insight into the decision process. ( at least when they are not being personally attacked.)

I have been giving this poll business a great deal of thought. You have to know that mail in polls are basically a huge waste of our resources. The cost is extreme when you factor in the 5 to 10% responce that you will recieve. AT that point the results are no more a mandate than is this forum. A survey was taken at Erie this year which saw less than a 25% return on forms handed to shooters at registration. In my mind that qualifies as less than enthusiastic. A further complication of the mail in polls is that once they are complete, no one wants to believe the results. My opinions and information presented have been questioned and dismissed recently by fastfletch simply because I' m a State Rep for the organization. With that as the guiding mindset, any possible benefit from a membership poll will largely be nullified. I have, however, come up with a possible solution to offer for discussion.

Reasonable progress demands that the BOD and IBO staff continue to function as they have been doing. However, if a given situation is such that 25% of the membership petitions for a general membership vote, then the opportunity for such a vote to occur could be provided. Concievably we could establish a yearly convention or some other venue to act as a gathering point. Due to the cost of providing such a resource, we would need pre-registration with a non-refundable fee to cover the rental of facilities adequate for the event. At that point a 2/3 majority vote could overturn a Board decision. If we are unable to obtain at least a 2/3 membership attendance, then the meeting and vote would be cancelled indicating an absentee vote in favor of the boards decision. Operating in this manner could work in several ways. First, the results would not be so quickly questioned because you were actually present for the vote. Second, the resources would only be dedicated to such an event when the membership displayed sufficient concern or interest to make it happen. At the point when a vote would be called, everyone would know that in fact a large concern was present, and not just a few disgruntled individuals beating a drum and trying to drown out the support of the quiet majority.

Please keep in mind these are just my thoughts presented for discussion purposes only at this time. As always, your thoughts, opinions, and ideas are always welcome.