possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

heard this evening (from a friend that works for the state - been talking with some DEC folks) that they may be changing the season in a bit less (actually a ton less) drastic way. he says that they may go with this:

early ML for 3 days starting Oct 12th (primitive only - no inlines)
Archery - Oct 15th to day before 3rd Saturday in Nov
Gun - 23 days
late bow - same as now (?)
late ML - 9 days

I say big whoop. doesn't really do much of anything to make ML more equitable (not even an extra weekend). don't mind the primative 3 day opener (wouldn't mind being able to use my inline though). bow hunters lose a prime weekend of bow and no early season.

I don't know how accurate this info is or if this will happen. If it does it doesn't really seem to reflect much of the sentiment that I have heard. Maybe there was much more comment similar to the above than I thought???

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

Interesting, first I heard of this.

As far as gut/ first impression.....

It does not seem to reflect what has been brought to the state's attention by the NY hunters.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I'm sure after the public meetings the DEC is looking at other possibilities. Least if they listened to the public at all. Seems from what I saw, and read here the general concensus wasn't for ml in the middle of archery. But was for expanded opportunities. If what you heard has any truth thats not expanding much of anything. I personnally wish they'd make a decision soon. It'd help me on my time-off decisions from work.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I think if they want a Muzzle season they should put it first Oct. 1-7 then have bow start the 8th. That way the deer calm down and get into a pattern again. Besides there are so many leaves still on the trees that I don't think the take will be that high,well I hope not since last year I saw the least amount of deer ever.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

Well her it is ...NUMBER 1000. I'm so proud of myself. (pat, pat, pat)

I have been advocating the October 1st ML (if they have any early ML) and a large expansion at the end of the reg season for ML. The end expansion seems to be the easiest. I hope that the non-hunter griping isn't going to ruin this for us. I know that there are concerens out there, but I really don't think many are too valid - look at all the other states that have longe seasons. Late hunting won't effect snowmobilers much - they don't look much like deer and are going too fast to get a bead on ;)); hikers and skiers don't look much like deer, and if hunters don't want to be disturbed by those and other recreationists, they can find a more secluded hunting spot. Also, the other winter recreations have a good 3 months to enjoy themselves after deer season (Jan-March).

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

3 months to enjoy themselves after deer season (Jan-March).



Hey this is Central new york.....they also have a good part of April:D

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I got this from a DEC officer over the weekend. He said the dates will be announced March 15th. And he, without committing himself with a quote, led me to believe that the whole plan will be put on hold for further review. So who knows, I'm sure there are more rumers out there than cougar sightings. We will all see in a week.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I just cant say enough how much Im against a later MZ season! When they see how many bucks without antlers are shot as does, theyll see theyve again shot themselves in the foot. From what Im seeing, or should I say, NOT seeing, many folks dont realize how many big bucks shed early. Id rather see the MZ season stay the same, but if it MUST expand, start it at the beginning like SpikeHorn said. It makes me wonder just how much the "powers that be" know about these deer!

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

not buyin that arguement Bill. More deer keep their antlers thru Dec then lose them. Yes, some may drop them, but does it really matter?? Deer in the frezeer is deer in the freezer. 2 extra weeks at the end of current ML isn't going to deeplete the buck population.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I thought that the changes were to make the oportunities in the southern tier same as the Northern. This is not fact just what I'm hearing. No changes for the Northern Tier. I'm not sure about bow because I don't have one and I didn't pay much attention. Opening day in the ST will be on a Saturday(shotgun). There also may be a week before and after shotgun season for ML. I didn't hear any thing about traditional vs. inline. That is just what I heard. I will try to get some info off the DEC website. Good Luck

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

This May Help. Bold and the Strikout didn't show up sp I will post the Web address
Proposed Deer Season Restructuring For 2005
More information from this division:

Fish, Wildlife and Marine Resources
Bureau of Wildlife
More information on the Proposal:

Deer Season Proposal and Timeline
Supporting Comments and Justifications
Schedule and Location of Public Meetings

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This document was modified in late January. Text in strikeout has been removed from the original and text in bold has been added.

In the summer of 2000, the Department initiated a public outreach effort entitled "The Future of Deer Hunting Initiative" to solicit input from hunters and other members of the public regarding changes that might be made to New York's deer hunting programs. The intent of this effort was to increase hunter satisfaction and participation, and increase the antlerless deer harvest where needed to better manage deer populations. Over two dozen meetings were held and thousands of comments and suggestions were received. In 2002 DEC began implementing changes to hunting license structure, issuance and use. Expanding and revising the structure of deer hunting seasons was considered to be the next major area of focus.

Restructuring of Southern Zone deer seasons has been under review and consideration for several years. Outreach efforts continued in the fall 2003 with a solicitation for suggestions included in the 2003-04 Hunting and Trapping Regulations Guide. A follow-up solicitation in this year's Guide continues to receive attention and promote hunter awareness of potential changes. Extensive input has been and continues to be received pertaining to deer hunting season changes that increase hunter participation and enhance hunter satisfaction.

Suggested changes include creating special deer hunting opportunities for youths, changing the opening day of the Southern Zone regular season from a Monday to a Saturday, expanding currently existing seasons, creating new special implement season opportunities, adopting different harvest regimes, and a number of other excellent proposals.

Guiding Philosophies when considering season changes:
There are several important considerations that must serve as the guiding principles during any consideration of proposals for creating, changing, or modifying existing deer hunting opportunities:

Specifically:

Changes must provide reasonably equitable distribution of opportunity and access to the deer resource for all of the subgroups of hunters.
Changes should increase the ability to manage deer, more specifically to obtain needed antlerless harvests in areas of chronic overabundance by creating additional opportunities and fully using the flexibility inherent in the new hunting license structure.
All changes should focus on overall hunter satisfaction, specifically on changes which ultimately can influence hunter recruitment.
All changes and modifications should enhance overall recreational opportunity.
Specific goals for 2005 include:
Addressing a need for increased opportunities for young hunters by establishing weekend opening day opportunities.
Addressing a need to create new and innovative opportunities for special implement hunters, specifically muzzleloader hunters who can currently purchase season-specific muzzleloader hunting privileges, however these licenses are currently limited to a one-week late season in the Southern Zone.
Target additional antlerless harvest by expanding opportunities for DMP use, along with greater use of DMAP and Either Sex and Antlerless Only Bow/Muzz 3/2 tags.
Adopt a season structure in the Southern Zone with opportunities similar to those that are available in the Northern Zone.
Establish clear, simple opening day rule structure for better hunter understanding and future planning.
Create a pilot program for antler restrictions.
This page was last modified January 28, 2005

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

http://www.dec.state.ny.us/website/d.../2005back.html

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

Congrats Dough on your 1000. I will be flaming mad if it the extra muzzleloader season is just for traditionals because I just purchased an in-line.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

:D

But........... Schoolboy's post reminds us that the DEC is at least trying to listen to us BEFORE they make new laws.

I have no problem if they decide to lay off a year before making changes -especially if over that time they are examining scientific studies to back up the proposed changes - whatever they may be.

FH

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

Doughboy, while I respect your opinion, Im a bit involved in that end of this industry, and can assure you that it happens often. The result you describe isnt the concern I have...I have already stated we do indeed have too many deer. My concern is the AGE of the buck I see killed as a doe. Its almost always a true mature buck. Larger deer that get locked early in the season and shed early, bucks that stress from doing a large amount of breeding, and big visible bucks that seem to have been shot at by a good number of hunters and have been hit. I cant tell you how many "does" Ive seen shot that were good sized bucks with injuries, with large pedicle scars which suggest at least large antlers. As a shed antler enthusiast I see some of the largest antlers being found in December by guys still out hunting. Even captive raised deer are often seen shedding early. Every year I get deer in my studio for mounting that have shed one or both antlers in late November as well as December. For every button buck you guys cringe upon hearing get killed, heres a mature buck that beat so many odds, only to be shot as an antlerless deer. That to me is worthy of NOT extending the season any later. A guy can use his MZ, modern or otherwise, for the whole gun season as well as (primitive) in the MZ season. Im one of them. Thats the point Im making, based on MY observation, not just heresay.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

Hey Yox's. I'm not denying your claims, or your knowledge on late season sheds. I'm wondering if this has anything to do with certain parts of NY. I've been doing taxidermy for almost 20yrs. Not on a fulltime business basis, but small time out of my residence. Anyways I've never had a single shed antlered buck for mounting. I've only heard occasional stories of a buck shot, and lost a antler. Would you have any input as to a difference between Northern NY over southwestern NY by chance? On the flip side I've also heard more stories the past couple yrs on bucks holding their antlers into March.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

Buck, Ill admit this...we probably hear more about the extremes, that is, early and late shed antlers, as opposed to the "norms". Ive seen bucks still holding on as late as April while others have new growth at that time. These extremes are most obvious, of course.

The experts still are not 100% sure as to why bucks shed at certain times anyway. It does correlate with social stress, the drop of testosterone levels, which of course is based on the pituatary gland, and so, photoperiodism. Early antler shedding is a sort of barometer to the bucks over-all condition too. You raise a good point asking if this might be unique to my area vs "out there". Unfortunately, I dont know how accurate an answer I can give you. First off, my work comes from different places, only about 60 or so percent is local. Secondly, as another part of what I do for a living I speak to a great many taxidermists from around the region, as well as other states. I believe the early shed stressed buck incidence happens wherever theres deer numbers and age structure. I can honestly say I pin sheds back to skulls every year here.

I sure dont have any theory on northern zone vs southern zone. I think its simply condition, not where theyre from. I can tell you that as a taxidermist yourself, youre actually lucky not to run into this much, reattaching antlers is a pain, lol!

I can see by the comments made that some here probably feel Im making a mountain out of a molehill. Think of it this way...if someone shoots a great buck that does shed early, and trust me, many do, and its in one of you fellas hunting area, youll definitely think that its one too many. Give them another week more of chances to have that happen with an extra week of MZ, and then perhaps some of youll hear my complaint as more valid. Trust me, Id love to be wrong on this, believe me. Thanks BuckAlley, I enjoy the exchange.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I too respect your opinion and experience Bill. But really, what does it matter?? Say someone in my area shoots a big buck that has dropped his antlers (first we really won't know how "big" it was) anyway, yeah I may be a bit bummed because I won't have a chance at him next year, but oh well, there are more. That deer has passed on his genes and his sons will be runnin' around next year. The only people that would be "really" p*$$*d are horn hunters. To me a deer is a deer. I love to see the horns, but you can't eat 'em.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

Doughboy, I guess I just assumed the theme these days is quality, genetic gains, and at the very least, a healthy pride for taking a trophy class animal. If we are truly just meat hunting, lets shoot 6 month old buck and doe fawns, that is THE best management tool. Then we wouldnt care whether its during October, November, December or bow season. No you cant eat the antlers, but you can admire them!

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I think Dough is like the majority of hunters, and I am in the same boat. We like to have a chance at a nice buck, but there's a certain line that we just want to enjoy the sport as well. It is a medium that is not easily defined, but I get what Dough is saying.

And Bill, we don't expect any less of you!:D You wouldn't be the same if you did not play devil's advocate at least 50% of the time!:D

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I still want a longer late season .;)

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I'm with ya there Charlie!

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I don't care if we get a longer season. I would take advantage of it if i could - but I more would like to see a set of season's that keeps things legal.

Sounds like a stupid statement I know - But I got to tell you, I know ALOT of guys that I wouldn't trust NOT to shoot a buck w/BP in the proposed early season sandwiched in Bow. Maybe I don't give everyone enough credit for restraint - but why tempt?

We'll see how it goes - but once that season is in place - it will be hell pulling back out if it don't work out.

FH

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I THINK TOAY IS THE DAYTHAT THE NEW SEASON IN THE SOUTHERN TIER IS RELEASED. i CHECKED THE DEC SITE AND IT DIDN'T SAY ANYTHING. DOES ANYONE KNOW.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

Well, all things considered, I still will always grumble about it, so we will agree to disagree, I suppose. You wont catch me out during the late season if it ever does come to be. I stand by my principles, which to some of my buddies means being bullheaded, hahaha. I do hope it all works out as best as it can. I wouldnt want to have the job of managing this deer herd state-wide, with the many intricacies involved. Just to keep it fair, I STILL have one more buck in the pens that hasnt shed, and he shed in December last year...go figure!

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I would not want to manage the state deer herd...because of us!!!!!!!

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

Bingo! I was trying to be tactful, lol. You got it, though. Of course Im just as bad. I guess we need to be able to laugh at ourselves too!

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I think "we" are pretty mild and, for the most part, "level headed" when we discuss our deer management (always extremes) especially compared to some of our southern comrads (not too for south). I think that the DEC has a thankless job and are doing a pretty decent job.

with that said I think the possible "new" seasons (as I posted here) are a joke. They don't seem to adress many or any of their original points/agenda. The problem is the DEC probably has too many special interest groups tugging at them.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

comeing from a game warden october 1 bow run for 3 weeks the muzzleloader for week the bow and southern teir open saturday.. dont qoute me but this game warden is a friend and very reliable the truth is the state has made up its mind and now they just want us to think we have a say on things.. what gets me peta is launching a 90 million dollar attack on bow hunting witch the fund will probable going up and were arguing over when the season opens.. :eek:

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

Glad to see we have the inside scoop now...! I'll make sure to make plans accordingly!:D

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

was in a hurry last night southern tier gun season will open on a saturday..... not bow;)

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

At the risk of sounding like a jerk, do you realize you spelled your screen name wrong? Its Oneida, not Onieda. If you misspelled it due to the correct spelling already having been taken, well, then we can blame it on Phade or something, ok?

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

HA!

I'm innocent.....


I was wrong once.....but....it was a mistake......

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

nope i knew it was spelled wrong just did it so it was diffrent.. i live right on oneida lake.. so it was phade fault;)

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

Aaaahhh, so its kinda like me living close to Lake "Onetario" then, huh? I figured it was Phade's fault...

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I heard this from a guy who is deeply involved with hunting NY and attends meetings that southern and northern will open at the same time BUT there will be 3 days of muzzleloader before bow opens in southern. YOU CAN NOT use inlines! ONLY ball/patch muzzleloaders. Good thing i have one rotting away in my garage that i couldnt sell so now i can sight that it in. Thats what i heard and i know its another "hear say" but thats what i heard. If im correct you can all say you heard it from me!:D

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

It's funny, not saying anybody is wrong, but this is the 3rd post from a reliable source. All with different outcomes of the season. I was told it would be set March 15th, so my post is not looking to reliable, even though it was from a Conservation Officer. Has anybody heard when the DEC will be telling and put all the speculation to rest?

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

A friend of mine had something printed, in hand, that he said came from a DEC officer, which said that "primitive" muzzleloaders are being considered for the early muzzleloading season. I saw this document. "Primitive" was taken to mean sidelocks without scopes. The season would run from October 10th to October 12th. You could hunt only if you had a DMP permit, or a deer deprivation (damage) permit, and then, only antlerless deer. The archery season would still start on October 15th. As for rifle/shotgun season, that would start on November 19th, or whatever date the Saturday is then. It would run until December 13th. I really didn't pay attention to the other seasons--there were five changes in all, and I think I've only gone over three of them.

Bear something in mind, fellow deerslayers--these are proposed changes.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

i had heard the same as leo.

RE: possible changes for NY deer seasons
 

I'm going to add to the mayhem here. My brother just told me yesterday he recieved a letter in the mail Friday from the DEC. Basically reading they are not going ahead with their season proposal, and the 05 season dates will be announced, and posted on the websight 3/30 or 31. I'm not sure why he recieved a letter, and I haven't heard of anyone else recieving such a letter. He left it at his job where he showed fellow hunters he works with. I told him I'd like to see it first hand. He's not known to b.s. on hunting related issues. Him & I both mailed letters to the DEC on our season views, and attended a public meeting on it in Watertown. He figured one of those reasons was why he had recieved this letter, and was surprised when I hadn't. So it all beats me!!!!