Something else I forgot t tell you that we saw on our walk Saturday.

Acorns and beachnuts everywhere.

Nothing there to eat them- no deer, no turkey either.

Thanks for the info Rick and seig.I know a fellow who has a camp near the lake and there's a combo of parks,resorts,private land,etc.I could have sworn the DCNR said state forest land only.

That was my original response to RJ. I didn't put him don't ,I simply raised questions about his harvest data. Very few if any hunters in PA were holding out for 3.5 buck six years ago and we still have very few 3.5 buck today. With only 100 acres it is simply impossible to mange for 3.5 buck and that is what he implied.

Sieg3006,

I hunt Raystown lake every year and i also believe that the 60 dpsm is probably a little high. But then again, i see alot of deer out there. Earlier this year in the early muzzleloader season i saw 7 bucks in one day, nothing real big but i think thats still good.

germain, I cant afford to hunt over there, last time I was over there your kids stole my windsheild wipers and hubcaps.

Bawana, If I called you Dale SR. that would be a compliment. Pike

I agree that 100 acres is definitly not enough to control a deer heard in your area. Perfect example: The family property I hunt is almost 600 acres. This property is surounded by thousands of acres of Rockview Corrections ground. About 10 years ago, we select cut about half our property to improve habitat. Also, being that my uncle is rather wealthy to say the least, he spends between 8-10 grand a year on seed and food plots. Needless to say, we have a lot of food all year for the deer. But, a lot of the bucks and deer for the matter make daily trips on and off our property from Rockviews ground. For one reason or another, the like that ground across the line, especially for bedding. We manage our property and other than the couple kids the hunt with us, we only try to take decent 8 points. The last few years, we have killed on average of about 14 or so decent 8 points, a scrub rack or two and usually one or exceptional animals in the 140 class or better. I attribute this only to use being surounded by no hunting ground of Rockview mostly. Without it there, 600 acres would be hard pressed to have the success we have IMO.

Another point I would like to make. We hunt and harvest most of the bucks during the rut. These bucks are roaming, sometimes miles in search of does. Sure the does will mostly be concentrated around food and bedding for the most part, but once the rut kicks into high gear, who knows were they will turn up.

i have about 500 acre i hunt on on about
410 is a farmer who plants pleaNTLY and doooent hunt it i got about 80 and there is
a 10 acre pie shape that comes up between us
that 10 acre is what the deer follow its a funnel
last year seen many deer no big bucks a 7
and about 25 doe this year it took me a week
to see 1 deer this is northern bradford co
so i say it is getting worse
and just to say there is about 4 ppl that
hunt that property

You've hit the nail on the head. If people would understand that trees are a renewable product that needs to be managed and that doing so helps ALL WILDLIFE then we wouldn't be in the predicament that we are with the deer herd. Clearcutting, selective cutting, etc., does attract many forms of wildlife. Not only for food, but for bedding and escape. Yes, it is somewhat ugly to the eye. The city slicker would look at a clearcut and say "what are we doing to the forest." The animals would respond , thank you, you've give me a haven for food , shelter, and easy access to escape predators. Good luck this season, you'll find over the years that by managing your land while other property around you do not that your property will be a magnet for deer, roughed grouse, turkey and anything else that lives in the woods.

I definately understand that 100 acres is not enough to effectively manage all of the buck population that crosses our land from time to time. What we have done however seems to be working, although not to the degree that it would if we had 1000 acres managed this way. This is why we did the logging this year, to make the small patch we have even better. I don't know what to say to ddear when he claims that we are not shooting only 3 1/2 year bucks, and that we don't kill them consistently every year, that truly is all we kill other than does except for one small 5 point I shot in 2000 that showed up with a blown off leg, and it has been 6 seasons now that we have done it. We collectively have killed at least one 3 1/2 year buck per year this way although I have personally only taken one myself. We had one year that we killed 3 (2002), that was the year I killed my buck down there that was a 115" class 8 point.

Our land is a funnel that includes a cedar swamp, apple orchard, and heavy bedding cover between all the major farms and crop areas that surround it. It also has a bit of open mature hardwoods around it as well to the south. The deer consistently use our property as cover for moving from place to place during the day and for bedding. I wish I had pics of all the bucks taken, however I don't because I am not always down there when they actually kill bucks since I only archery hunt it and sometimes manage to get in the second weekend of rifle season.

So far in this thread, we have learned the following:

-There is no fresh deer crap in PA
-There are no fresh deer tracks in PA
-There are only 3 grouse in PA
-There are no live mammals in PA
-There are deer left and some good bucks
-Deer management means more than AR and HR
-Selective logging is good for deer
-Deer plots don't help anything if your neighbors slaughter everything
-A safe haven is good to have on your property
-The New England Patriots didn't sit and cry in the superbowl
-My property doesn't have anything to do with Sieg's thread
-I don't have any control over the deer population since I only have 100 acres
-Hunters harvest 1x 3 1/2 year buck a year off my property per year on average
-Hunters have only harvested 1 or 2 bucks in 6 years off my farm and shoot bucks younger than 3 1/2 year bucks
-I own a deer farm
-ddear knows my property better than I do and what is taken off it every year
-Anytime someone claims they are only harvesting 3 1/2 year buck in PA, they are liars
-Raystown lake has 60 deer per square mile
-Raystown lake has no deer at all
-Rick James is directly responsible for the dinasaurs dissapearing
-jpike and ddear can't track a hippo in a snowstorm
-bawana jim can track a hippo in a snowstorm
-bawana jim is the dale jr. of hunting
-bawana jim is the gordon of hunting
-jpike hates gordon
-Rick James is a liar because he claimed to only shoot 3 1/2 year bucks, that is impossible in PA
-germain hates gordon too
-gordon sucks
-Matt Kenseth won his title fair and square

I guess you learn something new every day. ROFL.......