Scent ban in Pa?
08-23-2015, 10:16 AM
#31
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Southampton Pa BUCKS CO
Posts: 2,492
HJ, the PGC's veterinarian advised against baiting in the special regulations areas after he came on board, and for banning urine based scents. You have to remember, the Board of Commissioners are not the professional staff, the board doesn't have to follow the advise of the staff, and many times, they don't.
08-23-2015, 10:46 AM
#32
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Allegan, MI
Posts: 8,019
One of the testimonials on the website is a from a guy that probably paid at least $5.5K for a big buck he's pictured with and he said the place isn't that easy a "hunt" because after he saw the one he wanted it took him a second day to kill it, LOL! The website also says a guide takes you out and I guess that's so they can tell you how much you owe before you squeeze the trigger on a big one!
Last edited by Topgun 3006; 08-23-2015 at 10:50 AM. Reason: Spelling
08-23-2015, 11:45 AM
#33
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: south eastern PA
Posts: 15,437
HJ, they re-allowed bating so they can kill more deer in an area where they need to kill them. Problem is, it isn't going to do the job, it didn't do it the first time. What is needed in those WMUs is more access and the landowners in those areas have historically not allowed hunting and they cannot be forced to allow it. They will never kill enough deer in those WMUs.
08-23-2015, 11:49 AM
#34
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Illinois
Posts: 3,695
I know I never had a problem gaining access in Bucks or Chester. Guess things have changed in the last few years? Of course I was always polite and gave the owners a share in the harvest if I harvested. Was always lucky with that.
08-23-2015, 12:39 PM
#35
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: south eastern PA
Posts: 15,437
Super, the reason the population is so high in those counties is because of very limited access. I have a friend who hunts with his son and a couple of other guys on a farm in Chester Co. He always kills 5 or 6 deer a year and so does his son. Some of those deer are used for our club's youth pheasant hunt where we roast a whole dr on a spit and for Hunting and fishing day where we do the same, this year we are doing two to give to people who attend the celebration at Middlecreek. The farmer wants the deer killed but does not just allow anyone to hunt his land. Consequently, every year the population is about the same as the year before. Those who do allow hunting do not allow what you would call public hunting and while one landowner may allow hunting the neighbors do not so it is just a never ending battle. you can go the the Co Treasurers office and buy as many license as you want over the counter, however it doesn't matter how many license you can have if you have no place to use them. That is why the commissioners decided to allow baiting in those areas, however it failed to do much the first time and there was an expiration on the number of years it was legal, now with CWD in the state I believe it was flat out stupid to reinstate baiting. One of those lets do something even if wrong. The only saving grace may be, there are few deer propagators in those areas for CWD to start.
Last edited by Oldtimr; 08-23-2015 at 12:42 PM.
08-25-2015, 05:27 AM
#36
Spike
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 62
You appear to be against darn near any regulation whether for the good or not. CWD or the spores for it has been found in feces, saliva, and urine. While most biologists believe in the lateral transfer of the disease it is still unknown exactly how it has spread but these are the methods most simulations point to. Now you say there is no science to back this well how about this. All these deer scent farms use practically the same method to collect the urine and that is by getting the deer into the area with grated floors and they do what they do. Now while they are pissing in this grated floor, they are also drooling, and also crapping. All three fluids are found in the collection systems when tested. From the time a deer is infected to the time you might see symptoms can be anywhere from several months to 18 months that means there is a very long time that these deer can go unnoticed and continue infecting other deer. I applaud the states for taking this action to protect our resources and I would hope you would see them as making an effort.
Other things to consider:
CWD was first found in captive deer in the 60's and wild deer in the 80's. Kind of gives you an idea where this disease may be most prevalent.
The only test for CWD is by examining the portion of the brain stem. So not sure how these farms are testing there animals, but if an infected animals is found several months later, a hunter could have then used his bottles many times in many areas throughout a season before even a recall notice will go out.
I dont care if the deer are individually taking in for a bottle or not, the risk outweighs the reward by a long shot.
Other things to consider:
CWD was first found in captive deer in the 60's and wild deer in the 80's. Kind of gives you an idea where this disease may be most prevalent.
The only test for CWD is by examining the portion of the brain stem. So not sure how these farms are testing there animals, but if an infected animals is found several months later, a hunter could have then used his bottles many times in many areas throughout a season before even a recall notice will go out.
I dont care if the deer are individually taking in for a bottle or not, the risk outweighs the reward by a long shot.
08-25-2015, 05:35 AM
#37
Spike
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 62
vapahunter, you are starting to remind me of my kids when they were 2 years old and throwing a little temper tantrum with no amount of reasoning settling them down. You have been told in no uncertain terms that the prions that cause CWD has been found in bodily fluids including the urine of infected animals. Now, being as the most common occurrences of CWD are in captive whitetail deer and elk, how does this not compute for you? A) CWD is commonly found in captive animals. B) Scent lures (doe and buck urine) are collected from captive animals. C) CWD is KNOWN to be transmitted through bodily fluids such as urine. D) Until an animal starts to show the symptoms of CWD it cannot be detected at this point and time without the killing of the animal.
Now, it has been spelled out for you as simply as I and others can possibly spell it. If you don;t get the problem by now, you never will.
Now, it has been spelled out for you as simply as I and others can possibly spell it. If you don;t get the problem by now, you never will.
08-25-2015, 05:43 AM
#38
Spike
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 62
To be a deer farmer you are certainly misinformed WildOutdoorWhtl. So far there has been no way that's been found to kill prions, so, with that being said, mind telling me how "sterile" even factors into the discussion? It's a protein. There are proteins in urine. And no, urine isn't "sterile" anyway. All kinds of bacteria can be in it even BEFORE leaving the body. If it was sterile, or had sterilizing properties, you think there would be any bladder infections? UT infections? Your just another deer farmer trying to shush the truth. Not a very smart one either judging from the nonsense you just spouted off. Has it wiped out the herd yet? Of course not, it isn't a fast acting disease for one, for two it isn't wide spread YET which is why the PGC is doing all they can possibly think of to contain the spread.
Oh hell, you are one of them canned hunt operators. You certainly wont get a warm and fuzzy welcome around here. LMAO@ calling your operation "wild outdoors"! Aint nothing wild about those poor whitetail you have idiots coming to shoot. You have already shown your extreme lack of knowledge about a disease you should be extremely familiar with since it's morons like yourself that has let this disease loose in the wild!
Oh hell, you are one of them canned hunt operators. You certainly wont get a warm and fuzzy welcome around here. LMAO@ calling your operation "wild outdoors"! Aint nothing wild about those poor whitetail you have idiots coming to shoot. You have already shown your extreme lack of knowledge about a disease you should be extremely familiar with since it's morons like yourself that has let this disease loose in the wild!
08-25-2015, 06:16 AM
#39
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: south eastern PA
Posts: 15,437
No, the joke is your post BT1, the government started CWD, now that is a hoot. Additionally, we have had EHD in PA, it is not contagious, it is caused by biting midges. I recommend you do not pretend you know a thing about CWD, because it is apparent you don't. Somehow I suspect another high fence operator or a deer farmer.
08-25-2015, 06:38 AM
#40
Spike
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 62
No, the joke is your post BT1, the government started CWD, now that is a hoot. Additionally, we have had EHD in PA, it is not contagious, it is caused by biting midges. I recommend you do not pretend you know a thing about CWD, because it is apparent you don't. Somehow I suspect another high fence operator or a deer farmer.
Home
Contact the Alliance
Where and How Did CWD Originate?
The origin of CWD is unknown, and it may never be possible to definitively determine how or when CWD arose. It was first recognized as a syndrome in]captive mule deer held in wildlife research facilities in Colorado in the late 1960 but it was not identified as a TSE until the 1970s. Computer modeling suggests the disease may have been present in free-ranging populations of mule deer for more than 40 years.
Scrapie, a TSE of domestic sheep, has been recognized in the United States since 1947, and it is possible that CWD was derived from scrapie. It is possible, though never proven, that deer came into contact with scrapie-infected sheep either on shared pastures or in captivity somewhere along the front range of the Rocky Mountains, where high levels of sheep grazing occurred in the early 1900s.
It may be possible that CWD is a spontaneous TSE that arose in deer in the wild or in captivity and has biological features promoting transmission to other deer and elk