Saturday May Be The Best
12-13-2009, 05:41 PM
#51
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW PA USA
Posts: 7,220
Well lemme tell you something about this neanderthal buffoon....I can go downstairs in the gun room, where I have several crates full of spikes and Ys. I can pull every single one of those racks out of that crate and remember the exact circumstances that led to my possession of that rack. And to tell you the truth, I place as much value on the hunt that those racks produced as I can any bigger racked buck that I harvested. And I place those small racks far above any doe that I've ever shot.
It ain't about the effin rack. It's about the hunt.
It ain't about the effin rack. It's about the hunt.
What you just said in the first part of your post is that it IS about the effin rack. We just seem to differ on the size. It's just that the effin rack you want is less than the efffin rack a "trophy hunter" may want but certainly more than a doe hunter would.
settle for.
Now please tell me, and I'm trying to ask here without making this a fight. I happen to respect you and mean you no disrespect and apologize for the neanderthall buffon crap. I'm asking sincerely. Why is a spike or a forkie more important to you than a doe?
12-13-2009, 05:47 PM
#52
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location:
Posts: 2,978
"If they would just put the effort to a balanced herd through out the WMU, instead of hunt them to extinction in one area and leave the population grow in the less accessable areas. Things wouldn't be that bad for some hunters."
And cutting the allocation would do just that. Pressure would be somewhat lessened on the "huntable" areas, and those off limits... Theyd still be off limits... And as most would agree, smaller wmus sure wouldnt hurt one bit either towards better management.
And cutting the allocation would do just that. Pressure would be somewhat lessened on the "huntable" areas, and those off limits... Theyd still be off limits... And as most would agree, smaller wmus sure wouldnt hurt one bit either towards better management.
12-13-2009, 05:49 PM
#53
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location:
Posts: 2,978
Btb, I think whether its about the "big effin" rack (LOL) to a hunter, the small "effin rack" or not about the rack at all....
The doe harvest effects us ALL significantly.
Whether you support ar, as some of us do....or if you dont... The answer is not to "shoot a doe instead" . Plenty more than enough are being harvested as is.
The doe harvest effects us ALL significantly.
Whether you support ar, as some of us do....or if you dont... The answer is not to "shoot a doe instead" . Plenty more than enough are being harvested as is.
Last edited by Cornelius08; 12-13-2009 at 05:56 PM.
12-13-2009, 06:07 PM
#54
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: PA
Posts: 8,167
I know our buck to doe ratio is not as bad as my sightings seem to show and thats why I don't buy the folly that an old doe is smarter than any buck. I certainly see 5 or more shoot able does for every racked buck I see.
I haven't shot a doe in a long time, and the last of those were with my bow, I just find it merit less to kill them now days.
Maybe its my age or my ability or some of both but I don't believe it would take me an hour on any given day to kill an antler less deer with a firearm.
Of course I'm pretty choosy about the bucks I shoot also.
I haven't shot a doe in a long time, and the last of those were with my bow, I just find it merit less to kill them now days.
Maybe its my age or my ability or some of both but I don't believe it would take me an hour on any given day to kill an antler less deer with a firearm.
Of course I'm pretty choosy about the bucks I shoot also.
12-13-2009, 06:11 PM
#55
Spike
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 55
yea too bad about saturday being good, well not for me. did not see one deer, not even a freakin tail. this is rediculous i have seen 4 deer this whole rifle season and shot a six point the first day and 4 during archery thats 8 in probably 8 times i went out.
12-13-2009, 08:18 PM
#56
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW PA USA
Posts: 7,220
Btb, I think whether its about the "big effin" rack (LOL) to a hunter, the small "effin rack" or not about the rack at all....
The doe harvest effects us ALL significantly.
Whether you support ar, as some of us do....or if you dont... The answer is not to "shoot a doe instead" . Plenty more than enough are being harvested as is.
The doe harvest effects us ALL significantly.
Whether you support ar, as some of us do....or if you dont... The answer is not to "shoot a doe instead" . Plenty more than enough are being harvested as is.
I don't know how else to say this but I'm still seeing good numbers in all 3 units where I hunt and hear similar stories from the guys that I know. Sure, some of 2F aint what it used to be but it's more about the habitat having graduated into pole timber(IMHO). 2D and 2B are good as ever.
It has to be acknowledged that
this site is second only to the USP site for complaining. Most folks I run into in person are happy. Even my friends who hunt 2G. Cant help it but thats been my experience.
Someone mentioned the 80's as being the best. In 1981, I shot a basket rack 6 point on the first day of rifle season. It was the best buck in the cooler at Tionesta beverage when I dropped it off for storage on Monday and still the best buck in the cooler when I picked it up Friday. I saw hundreds of deer that week dogging for dad and my uncle and never saw a better one. I have no desire to go back to those "good old days".
I work hard at my deer hunting. Always have. Scout, schmooze landowners, watch deer, study deer all year long. I mean no disrespect to anyone here but the guys I see beechin loudest in person are the guys who spend maybe 4-24 hours total a year on their deer hunting.
On here the biggest beecher tells us theres no need to scout the off season and that he shouldnt need to change hunting spots. Well, real life just aint like that and the worst complainers I see in person fit the description I just gave to a T.
I know some will disagree but I'm telling it like I'm seeing it from my corner of PA and I'm trying to say it without disrespecting anyone.
12-13-2009, 08:48 PM
#57
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location:
Posts: 2,978
"I just aint seein the gloom and doom a few of you are seeing."
What doom & gloom??? Things are either as they should be or they are not. I and many other contend they are not. Im not predicting the end of days here, just addressing a significant problem as i see it. And my contention is based on many things including what i see with my own eyes, what others are saying & also of course, the statewide data coupled with all the things going on where pgc is concerned. Its not as simple as well, I saw the buck I needed to shoot and zapped him through the heart at 25 yards with my bowtech. Its about everything that is going on, has gone on last few years and what we have to look forward to for the future based on what we know. As bad as some may think alot of areas of Pa are currently, its not gonna get better anytime soon, and significant portions of the state are gonna get worse, no doubt about it to anyone who has been following these issues closely. Make no mistake about it, the goal IS extreme biodiversity and all that goes along with it... And good levels of deer and great deer hunting are not one of those things. Thats not conspiracy theory either. I could easily links clearly showing the biodiversity agenda, even from pgcs own website.
"It has to be acknowledged that
this site is second only to the USP site for complaining. Most folks I run into in person are happy. Even my friends who hunt 2G. Cant help it but thats been my experience."
Id say this sight represents a much lower percentage of "nonsupporters" of the deer plan than the "real world". Even though Ive seen the majority here no supportive of current levels of hr, I see a MUCH higher majority basically everywhere you may go in this area. I can only imagine in the worst areas of the state. I know of NOONE happy with the pgc plan. Very few "indifferent" and a helluva ton who'd like to see current crew at pgc shown the door. Thats reality. Pgc has even addressed the extremely high level of discontent on many occassions. Cant speak for your friends, but to me, id say they are the extreme minority. The exception, certainly not the rule. Btw, currently there is far more complaining on hpa. Seems its temporarily permitted for the moment, to put on a show that they arent the intolerant tyrants every claims I guess. Lots of important people see the postings dont you know. Anyway, currently, theresa helluva lot more threads in their ar forum complaining than currently here. TONS of them. Of course they are kept in place, and the same few who are permitted to bully the opposition into submission have been doing their thing.
"Someone mentioned the 80's as being the best."
The 80's werent bad here. But i guess that depends on your wmu. I killed my best bucks from the later 80's through the 90s. As for strictly numbers, they were by far the highest in late 90's. Admittedly a bit too high.
" I mean no disrespect to anyone here but the guys I see beechin loudest in person are the guys who spend maybe 4-24 hours total a year on their deer hunting."
And i know guys that hunt nearly every single day with seasonal employment that beech. I know guys that hunt every available during 2 or 3 week vacations plus saturdays + after work when possible... And I hunt a helluva lot....maybe more than that.lol, during archery season. The disgust doesnt discriminate from what Ive seen. As Id said before, success isnt the sole deciding factor for alot either....For some, it is.
"I know some will disagree but I'm telling it like I'm seeing it from my corner of PA and I'm trying to say it without disrespecting anyone. "
Thats fine. but there are alot of people from your corner of Pa that dont support the deer plan as is. A helluva lot. I say that because im from the same general corner, as are most i know. I also see quite a few on this board, on 2 or 3 others as well including hpa that have their home areas listed as this corner and one of the 2 or 3 wmus that it encompasses, and there is alot of discontent. Perhaps as much as any year id seen in the last several and thats saying alot.
What doom & gloom??? Things are either as they should be or they are not. I and many other contend they are not. Im not predicting the end of days here, just addressing a significant problem as i see it. And my contention is based on many things including what i see with my own eyes, what others are saying & also of course, the statewide data coupled with all the things going on where pgc is concerned. Its not as simple as well, I saw the buck I needed to shoot and zapped him through the heart at 25 yards with my bowtech. Its about everything that is going on, has gone on last few years and what we have to look forward to for the future based on what we know. As bad as some may think alot of areas of Pa are currently, its not gonna get better anytime soon, and significant portions of the state are gonna get worse, no doubt about it to anyone who has been following these issues closely. Make no mistake about it, the goal IS extreme biodiversity and all that goes along with it... And good levels of deer and great deer hunting are not one of those things. Thats not conspiracy theory either. I could easily links clearly showing the biodiversity agenda, even from pgcs own website.
"It has to be acknowledged that
this site is second only to the USP site for complaining. Most folks I run into in person are happy. Even my friends who hunt 2G. Cant help it but thats been my experience."
Id say this sight represents a much lower percentage of "nonsupporters" of the deer plan than the "real world". Even though Ive seen the majority here no supportive of current levels of hr, I see a MUCH higher majority basically everywhere you may go in this area. I can only imagine in the worst areas of the state. I know of NOONE happy with the pgc plan. Very few "indifferent" and a helluva ton who'd like to see current crew at pgc shown the door. Thats reality. Pgc has even addressed the extremely high level of discontent on many occassions. Cant speak for your friends, but to me, id say they are the extreme minority. The exception, certainly not the rule. Btw, currently there is far more complaining on hpa. Seems its temporarily permitted for the moment, to put on a show that they arent the intolerant tyrants every claims I guess. Lots of important people see the postings dont you know. Anyway, currently, theresa helluva lot more threads in their ar forum complaining than currently here. TONS of them. Of course they are kept in place, and the same few who are permitted to bully the opposition into submission have been doing their thing.
"Someone mentioned the 80's as being the best."
The 80's werent bad here. But i guess that depends on your wmu. I killed my best bucks from the later 80's through the 90s. As for strictly numbers, they were by far the highest in late 90's. Admittedly a bit too high.
" I mean no disrespect to anyone here but the guys I see beechin loudest in person are the guys who spend maybe 4-24 hours total a year on their deer hunting."
And i know guys that hunt nearly every single day with seasonal employment that beech. I know guys that hunt every available during 2 or 3 week vacations plus saturdays + after work when possible... And I hunt a helluva lot....maybe more than that.lol, during archery season. The disgust doesnt discriminate from what Ive seen. As Id said before, success isnt the sole deciding factor for alot either....For some, it is.
"I know some will disagree but I'm telling it like I'm seeing it from my corner of PA and I'm trying to say it without disrespecting anyone. "
Thats fine. but there are alot of people from your corner of Pa that dont support the deer plan as is. A helluva lot. I say that because im from the same general corner, as are most i know. I also see quite a few on this board, on 2 or 3 others as well including hpa that have their home areas listed as this corner and one of the 2 or 3 wmus that it encompasses, and there is alot of discontent. Perhaps as much as any year id seen in the last several and thats saying alot.
Last edited by Cornelius08; 12-13-2009 at 09:15 PM.
12-14-2009, 02:54 AM
#58
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,879
Also not true and I challenge you to produce any link to that effect. The one type of hunter I have zero use for and criticize openly is the neanderthal buffoon who somehow places more value on a spike or a y than on an adult doe. It's a warped mentality that has no place among hunters and one that you seem to subscribe to. Happily it is slowly eroding in PA.
Oh and even lower yet is your claim that I have insulted your wife, sister or sister in law. I did no such thing and you have exposed your convoluted sense of logic once again.
Oh and even lower yet is your claim that I have insulted your wife, sister or sister in law. I did no such thing and you have exposed your convoluted sense of logic once again.
I don't have to go any further than your most recent post to prove my point, since you just called every member in our hunting group and thousands of other PA hunters,neanderthal buffoons. That as about insulting as you can get.
Furthermore, the only reasons any hunter needs for choosing to harvest a spike or Y rather than a doe is personal preference and tradition.Then , I could also list the negative impact of harvesting too many does has had on the quality of hunting and the size of the harvests, but you are in total denial about that ,so it wouldn't do any good.
12-14-2009, 03:29 AM
#59
Typical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Westmoreland County PA.
Posts: 735
Another case of the pot calling the kettle black. You constantly criticize and put down hunters who were satisfied with a spike or a Y and judge other hunters by the size of the rack they harvest.
Obviously BP carefully planned that hunt so they would find two bucks fighting that would let them walk up and kill one. There obviously was no luck involved.
Obviously BP carefully planned that hunt so they would find two bucks fighting that would let them walk up and kill one. There obviously was no luck involved.
knows all the details. He knows, we saw "a" nice buck in that creek bottom on a couple occasions in archery season.He knows, we watched a good buck chase a doe in that area the day I helped my buddy move and re-hang his stands.He knows, my buddy and his brother caught a glimpse of a good buck in that bottom on opening day of the gun season.He knows, he got a quick look at him again this past Thursday, only he cut off short while coming down the tree line and took a triangular piece that cut below his neighbors barn.He knows, that's why on Saturday we where on the ground and up closer to the corn field. He knows, no thought went into why we chose that spot. Thanks BB for pointing it out how lucky we where.
He knows,that the two buck just let us walk right up to them so my buddy could whack one of them.
Last edited by blkpowder; 12-14-2009 at 03:32 AM.
12-14-2009, 04:08 AM
#60
Typical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location:
Posts: 659
Well...here it is. My slice of humble pie. I predicted a good Saturday and man, was I off. My buddy and I hunted our a$$es off and didn't see a tail. Covered every inch of a 700 acre farm in York county (open to public)...didn't see one other hunter, and not a tail. Some old frozen tracks in the mud, and some decent rubs from bow season. Granted, it's alot of open fields with no cover for most of it, but it actually narrows down to where the deer could be, and we had it all covered...drove out every patch, every swamp, every creek bottom, every brushy draw. Sickening. I know they killed some there the first week...but we should have seen SOMETHING besides one red fox for our efforts. Tried another spot in the afternoon that is a thick, woody area of about 75 acres between big fancy homes. usually 30-40 deer crammed in there. Nothing...but atleast lots of fresh sign, tracks, droppings everywhere, but also fresh boot tracks. I think someone beat us to the punch. In all, that is honestly the hardest I've ever hunted in one day and not seen atleats a tail waving goodbye. Very little shooting, and what their was wasn't close at all. Didn't see another hunter anywhere in the woods, only the four guys standing around a truck at one parking lot while we were driving between spots. Well, flintlock/ late archery is all that's left. Not a quitter, so 'll be back out again. Still hoping I see some horns at some point. Haven't seen a single buck, spike or anything, since rifle opened.