Money mismanagement at PGC???
07-02-2009 | 05:00 PM
#21
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RE: Money mismanagement at PGC???
Bowtruck, it doesnt have to be MY hunter dollars. I think most hunters if not ALL would appreciate having GAMELANDS managed for GAME.
Jim, the only thing that comes as "a shock" is the fact that you figured you needed to tell me where to find deer. lol
I also see no point. The average deer densities per wmu pretty much statewide are relatively very low. The average deer densities found on gamelands are far lower yet. Doesnt make a bit of difference if those few deer are living side by side in the thicket with the grouse or out in the middle of the pasture with the groundhogs. lol
Jim, the only thing that comes as "a shock" is the fact that you figured you needed to tell me where to find deer. lol
I also see no point. The average deer densities per wmu pretty much statewide are relatively very low. The average deer densities found on gamelands are far lower yet. Doesnt make a bit of difference if those few deer are living side by side in the thicket with the grouse or out in the middle of the pasture with the groundhogs. lol
07-02-2009 | 05:09 PM
#22
Giant Nontypical
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From: PA
RE: Money mismanagement at PGC???
I don't start grouse hunting PA till the second season, by then I've heard that all of the deer are most certainly dead or very rare, a fact I'd like to dispute, If I find grouse you can bet there are deer there also.
07-02-2009 | 05:51 PM
#23
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RE: Money mismanagement at PGC???
I know deer are left post season. But just like preseason, fewer than there should be! lol
As for grouse and deer preferring similar habitat, Id say thats a given and something only a fool wouldnt acknowledge. I probably see more grouse in a season of bowhunting while sitting in trees than most grouse hunters see.
As for grouse and deer preferring similar habitat, Id say thats a given and something only a fool wouldnt acknowledge. I probably see more grouse in a season of bowhunting while sitting in trees than most grouse hunters see.
07-02-2009 | 06:17 PM
#26
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RE: Money mismanagement at PGC???
ORIGINAL: Cornelius08
As we all know pgc has been begging for money singing the same old song.... But it is hard to accept that they need more money when you look at the facts.
The facts being that the license fees are right in line with other states. Lower than some, but higher than others, as in the example WVgino gave us. $33 dollars in WV for a hunting license +fishing license + muzzleloading and archery opportunity included along with trapping!!! WHich would tally well over 100 bucks here in Pa.
Not only that, but when you compare the money being spent, its astronomical. And what are we getting for it beside a good hosing? The deer program being kept alive and in place is nothing more than a huge money sponge for one thing. The extreme amounts of PR attempts to sell it as well as all the manpower and equipment etc. used to maintain it.
Compare to a "normal" state for example. In Virginia, a state similar in size to Pennsylvania, the Dept of game and inland fisheries budget for 2008 was 49,169,152. That is for the management of FISH AND WILDLIFE!
Here in Pa, on the last annual report, the revenue added to the game fund in the one year was 75,031,189.... JUST FOR WILDLIFE, NO FISH MANAGEMENT!!
And these guys are crying poor mouth?!!?! Unbelievable.
Does anyone know if there is any state in the nation that spends more than Pa on wildlife management? Or one where it benefits hunters less?
As we all know pgc has been begging for money singing the same old song.... But it is hard to accept that they need more money when you look at the facts.
The facts being that the license fees are right in line with other states. Lower than some, but higher than others, as in the example WVgino gave us. $33 dollars in WV for a hunting license +fishing license + muzzleloading and archery opportunity included along with trapping!!! WHich would tally well over 100 bucks here in Pa.
Not only that, but when you compare the money being spent, its astronomical. And what are we getting for it beside a good hosing? The deer program being kept alive and in place is nothing more than a huge money sponge for one thing. The extreme amounts of PR attempts to sell it as well as all the manpower and equipment etc. used to maintain it.
Compare to a "normal" state for example. In Virginia, a state similar in size to Pennsylvania, the Dept of game and inland fisheries budget for 2008 was 49,169,152. That is for the management of FISH AND WILDLIFE!
Here in Pa, on the last annual report, the revenue added to the game fund in the one year was 75,031,189.... JUST FOR WILDLIFE, NO FISH MANAGEMENT!!
And these guys are crying poor mouth?!!?! Unbelievable.
Does anyone know if there is any state in the nation that spends more than Pa on wildlife management? Or one where it benefits hunters less?
Comparing the funding or hunting license costs for Virginia’s or West Virginia’s wildlife management to Pennsylvania is an apples to pumpkins comparison because both Virginia and West Virginia have State tax funds to manage most of their wildlife while Pennsylvania does not receive any State tax dollars.
Here is a lead into how West Virginia gets their funding.
For most of this century, the sale of licenses and permits to hunters and anglers and matching Federal grant-in-aid programs have been the principal source of revenue for most state fish and wildlife agencies. Today, while license sales and percentage of traditional users are declining, in many states there is an increasing demand on state wildlife agencies for more products and services. As a result, agencies are finding it necessary to search for alternative sources of revenue to fund their fish and wildlife management and conservation efforts and provide services to their constituents.
Virginia is one of only a handful of states in history that has come into a
significant source of alternative funding for fish and wildlife management .
Through House Bill 38, a state code amendment passed in early 1998, the
Virginia Department of Game and Inland Fisheries (VDGIF) will soon begin to
receive a portion of the state’s sales tax on hunting, fishing and wildlife-related
equipment.
Here is the link to this and more:
http://scholar.lib.vt.edu/theses/available/etd-04162000-20160025/unrestricted/etd.pdf
It appears that in West Virginia their Game and Fish Department only has to manage the species that are legal to take from sport hunting and fishing. All other species are managed through other funding venues of the Wildlife Diversity Program and Natural heritage Programs.
Here is a link:
http://www.wvdnr.gov/Wildlife/Wildlife.shtm
In Pennsylvania though the hunters have to pay for the management of all species of wildlife through Legislative mandate.
Therefore, the hunting license dollars have to spread out into a lot more areas of usage then occur in either of the states you listed.
R.S. Bodenhorn
07-02-2009 | 06:21 PM
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RE: Money mismanagement at PGC???
"Comparing the funding or hunting license costs for Virginia’s or West Virginia’s wildlife management to Pennsylvania is an apples to pumpkins comparison because both Virginia and West Virginia have State tax funds to manage most of their wildlife while Pennsylvania does not receive any State tax dollars. "
LMAO! Rsb, do you actually read and think about what you post???....what the hell makes the difference??? Does state funds buy you more than sportsmens dollars do?LOL. Pa has MORE FUNDING. Virginia had LESS THAN HALF and it doesnt make one differnce WHERE or who it came from when speaking of having enough money or not!
Would pgc be better off financially if they had half the money they do now if it came from alternate funding source???
Im not being a wiseass, you honestly are making zero sense.
And I DO NOT see pgc as having to spread ANYTHING further.... other than their bullchit. lol. Virginias budget which i posted as being half of pgcs , ALSO covered FISH MANAGEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
LMAO! Rsb, do you actually read and think about what you post???....what the hell makes the difference??? Does state funds buy you more than sportsmens dollars do?LOL. Pa has MORE FUNDING. Virginia had LESS THAN HALF and it doesnt make one differnce WHERE or who it came from when speaking of having enough money or not!
Would pgc be better off financially if they had half the money they do now if it came from alternate funding source???
Im not being a wiseass, you honestly are making zero sense.
And I DO NOT see pgc as having to spread ANYTHING further.... other than their bullchit. lol. Virginias budget which i posted as being half of pgcs , ALSO covered FISH MANAGEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
07-02-2009 | 06:44 PM
#28
Giant Nontypical
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From: PA
RE: Money mismanagement at PGC???
ORIGINAL: Cornelius08
Should I quit bowhunting for my one deer (which is a buck only) a year?[:-]
Or should pgc do the responsible thing and cut the antlerless allocation?
Should I quit bowhunting for my one deer (which is a buck only) a year?[:-]
Or should pgc do the responsible thing and cut the antlerless allocation?
07-02-2009 | 06:57 PM
#29
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RE: Money mismanagement at PGC???
Ive taken the first rational step loooong ago. Ive also taken the second & third .
Ive quit shootin' doe years ago. I also let pgc know what i thought. When I saw that was a complete waste of time, as sportsmen were being ignored all along, I made and continue to make my feelings known to legislators and encourage others to do the same regularly. I also like to dispell myths, halftruths, misconceptions and outright lies on message boards.
Ive quit shootin' doe years ago. I also let pgc know what i thought. When I saw that was a complete waste of time, as sportsmen were being ignored all along, I made and continue to make my feelings known to legislators and encourage others to do the same regularly. I also like to dispell myths, halftruths, misconceptions and outright lies on message boards.
07-02-2009 | 07:07 PM
#30
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RE: Money mismanagement at PGC???
ORIGINAL: Cornelius08
. I also like to dispell myths, halftruths, misconceptions and outright lies on message boards.
. I also like to dispell myths, halftruths, misconceptions and outright lies on message boards.
I too would like to see some changes, refinements and more deer but my neighbors think less of me than you think of the PGC. These idiots own one acre lots and bitch about "my deer" eating their shrubs, I tell them to plant cornits better for the deer.