PABuck_HNTR

I've got an idea why don't we use the USP members homes and or businesses for check stations. As we all know oh so well the Secretary cares so much about our deer harvest system I'm sure he could get his booming membership to step up and volunteer their time to do the job.

R.S.B.

As has already been explained the states that have check stations were hunters bring deer harvest about as many deer during a good harvest day as are harvested per hour on the opening day of the Pennsylvania deer season.

We simply don’t have the capacity, even if all of the Ma/Pa gas stations and sporting goods stores wanted to do it, in a manner that could possibly cycle hunters through in a timely manner. If hunters have to sit in line for even a couple of hours they simply aren’t going to do it, they are going to just take the deer home, process it and keep their mouths shut. Now ask them to sit in line for five or six hours or more and how well do you think it is going to work?

You make it sound like it would work in the other parts of the state even if the indications are that it wouldn’t work here in Elk County. But, the fact of the matter is that most of these northern tier counties no longer have Ma & Pa gas stations because they have been put out of business by places like Sheetz, Uni-Mart and a host of other stop and go shopping places. Those places have no interest in checking deer. We have three small sporting goods stores in the entire county and two of them have no parking except paid parking meters in the City of St. Marys. We have one small sporting good store with a one man operation that has a parking lot capable of handling more then ten cars at a time. We have one small country general store in the extreme northern part of the county that is a one man operation. We have four or five other small stores or gas stations in the county and most of them wouldn’t have the capacity, the interest or the manpower to check deer through half of the night.

Elk County is not alone in not having the facilities to find check stations, most of the other counties around the northern tier are very much in the same boat. In all of neighboring Cameron County I can only think of about four or five places that might have the capacity even if they had an interest in running a check station. You also have to remember that most people around these areas are hunters and they are not going to give up their opening day of deer season so they can volunteer to check deer that other hunters killed.

The really big thing though is that the states that do have deer check stations will tell you flat out that they probably don’t have a much better hunter reporting rate then states like Pennsylvania were hunters send in cards, report via phone or on line. Many of those states don’t have any handle on what their reporting rate really is even though they know it is not a good reporting rate. At least in Pennsylvania we do have a pretty darn good idea what our reporting rates are each year.

The Pennsylvania deer reporting and harvest estimating system has been evaluated by a professional accounting group that found the method and results to be very accurate and reliable.

You and the other detractors as just grasping at straws to find anything to discredit the Game Commission, the deer program, the officers and anyone that supports scientific management practices. Fortunately more rational people are no longer listening to your nonsense as much as they once did. That is presently a positive for the future of good wildlife management, the hunter and hunting. I have seen things on a positive course before only to once again have the whole program derailed so I would not be surprised if it happened again. But, one thing you can be sure of; I will be doing the best I can to debunk your nonsense and provide what information I can toward having more informed hunters in our ranks. Better informed hunters generally support good scientific management practices like those the Game Commission is trying to maintain with the minimum funding available.

R.S. Bodenhorn

archer58

John,
Do you realize that you are contributing to the very issue you and your USP friends are complaining about. By not sending report cards in, it makes it harder for the GC to get a handle on the deer herd in any given area.You can surely see why. If no cards come in they must determinethat most huntersdid not harvest a deer and based on a formulato the best possible means,theyattempt to accurately issue doe tags for the following year.
In essence you have created the very problem you blame others for. If you and your friends all fail to send reports in the problem is compounded exponentially.
Look in the mirror for John. Be honest with yourself.

BTBowhunter

I guess one of us gotta get one of those USP decoder rings.

Better get it soon though, before long it'll be as useful as confederate money.

Now to be serious, I can think of only two possible reasons as to why someone who openly criticizes the report card process for its lowsubmission rate wouldnt send in those report cards.

Either he hasnt shot a deer in years........ or he's deliberately violating the law to further the warped cause of the USP whose goal seems only to be diruptive whenevr and wherever possible when it comes to PA wildlife management.

DennyF

Back in October at thePGC's deer kill calculation open house,USP's avocational deer mgt. expert Woody Shields,challenged Dr. Rosenberry, head of the PGC deer management team, to explain why they don't "go after" those who don't send report cards in. It was explained to him, that it's not worth the effort, since many magistrates will accept as a defense, that the hunter had sent it in, but "it musta got lost in the mail".

Mr. Shields alsoclaimed to know ofsomehunters that didn't send in reports and possibly some that sent in false reports and continued to berate Dr. Rosenberry about how they could accuratelytrack deer kills with only a 40% reporting rate. Someone from PGC law enforcement then asked Mr. Shields for names, places and dates on these people he knew who had not sent in reports. I think he just babbled after that, said he didn't actually have that info. Whereupon the LE representative said, then it's just more gossip and hearsay, is it?

They ask for answers, then dismiss the answers when they get them. One of the components of their late-great lawsuit, was that the PGC will not discuss issues with them or provide data when they demand it. Why bother, when all they do is distort data and spin answers to their questions anyway?

Windwalker7

I've hunted West Virginia for over 15 years. The Ma and Pa stores do it. West Virginia towns are noted for not having lots of money. The store we usually go to has about six employees that all work to process the deer. Some years students from WVU are their to collect data. Weight, antler size, teeth, etc... I don't really see them needing to hire extra workers.


As mentioned above, hunters browse the store and but snacks. No one seems to mind. It gives hunters a chance to tell their tale and check out other deer. The system works and somehow the low income towns of West " By God" Virginia pull it off.

Look at it this way. If someone doesn't have the checking station tag on their deer. The PGC can fine them. Make the fine steep enough that slob hunters won't "forget" to get them checked.

States like west Virginia and maryland don't seem to have the divided hunters like PA has. They don't bash their game Officials like PA hunters do. Maybe they have a better handle on things?

Windwalker7

RSB,



How many times have you been to a deer check station?

From personal experience, I've checked at least 50 deer into a West Virginia check station over a period of 17 years.

You don't like it when people spin things about the PGC but that is exactly what you are doing about check stations.

You claim that hunters wait hours, not true.

It only takes 2 or 3 minutes. All they do is check off if it is a male or female and write down what area you got it. They take your license number and name.

I think you should ride down to WV and watch the process........OOOhhh....That's right, you guys are all crowded around the bear check stations making an easy job of checking in a bear last an hour.

You guys could learn alot from the WV CO's

Windwalker7

In 2003, i bagged a bear in Somerset Co. I took it to the check station.

There were only 3 guys there with a bear. there were at least a dozen PGC guys there. It took at least 45 minutes to get my bear checked in. The other two guys were done and just hanging out. I was the only bear to be checked.


I think RSB is comparing this to how other states operate their check stations. It isn't that complicated.

I'm not sure what the WV Game officials did to get college students to take the information but maybe the PGC could get Penn State students that are studying a wildlife field to help.

In WV the students had 3 or 4 places set up at one station to take down info. They even weighed deer and took jaw samples. There were also 2Game officials there.


When I checked in my PA bear I had to go into a room and sit down with a lady on a computer. She would ask all kinds of questions while Charlie May,the Fayette head Game official and Rod Ansell, the head Westmoreland Officialchimed in with their questions. I felt it was an interigation but anyhow it took a while. I had to take my license out of the holder while they inspected it and looked at my duck stamp. You would have thought I committed a crime by getting a bear.

Fletch NY

In NY york here you used to have to send in a report. Now for the past few years it is just a phone call. I have never failed to report a deer ever and have no respect for anyone who can not. They complain that the phone system is too hard!! It takes like 5 to 8 minutes give me an f in break! They are the same guys who keep saying the DEC does not know what it is doing!! How about follow the law and report your deer and help them have a better idea than figuring mythical formulas. I feel if you do not report your deer once it should be a $250 fine, second time $1000 and third strike you lose your license for a decade. Freakin slob hunters I have no use for em!!

Windwalker7

And another thing


One of the check stations we went to was a BP station. Another was a Grocery store. The other was a gas station.


They don't all have to be a Ma and Pop store.


Heck, the PGC could set up a few like they do for bear and elk.

There is a lot of spin being put on this issue.

Just have the tags made out where you color in the little circle for the appropiateanswer.


0ANTLERED MALE

0 ADULT DOE

FAWN
0 MALE

0 FEMALE

LICENSE #__________

NAME_______________

AREA OF KILL______________