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The fat lady has sung in PA
http://www.pgc.state.pa.us/pgc/cwp/view.asp?Q=170978&A=11
Release #002-07 GAME COMMISSION HAILS COMMONWEALTH COURT'S RULING TO THROW OUT CHALLENGE TO DEER MANAGEMENT CASE HARRISBURG - Pennsylvania Game Commission Executive Director Carl G. Roe today hailed a Commonwealth Court ruling that dismissed, with prejudice, the Unified Sportsmen of Pennsylvania's challenge to the agency's deer management program. The decision to throw out the case was made "with prejudice," meaning that the lawsuit may not be re-filed. "Today's court ruling is a strong statement that the Game Commission's deer management program is being conducted in a sound, methodical and scientific manner," Roe said. "We believe that most hunters and the general public recognize that the need to reduce and stabilize our state's deer herd is a short-term pain that we must endure in order to achieve long-term gains. "Our hope is that this ruling will cease the unnecessary expenditure of sportsmen's dollars and tax dollars fighting frivolous and ill-conceived lawsuits." Roe noted that, since 2000, the Game Commission has worked to implement a deer management program that takes into account the concerns of all Pennsylvanians, and the agency has been consistent and open in its approach. "The deer management plan, which is available on our website, was developed with public input to improve the health of the state's deer herd; to encourage healthy habitat, which deer and all other wildlife depend on; and to reduce deer-human conflicts," Roe said. "We believe this deer management program will improve the health of our deer herd and the habitat that supports it and other wildlife. "Yes, hunting has become more challenging in many areas. However, the benefits from our program changes are unmistakable, as hunters have reported seeing and harvesting larger deer; land managers and foresters are seeing some regeneration recovery in our forests; and farmers are telling us that they have seen less damage to their crops. "We have reduced deer herds in many of our more rural Wildlife Management Units, and our focus has been to stabilize deer herds in those areas over the past two hunting seasons. However, we continue to focus our efforts on reducing deer impacts in our most urbanized WMUs - 2B, 5C and 5D - in the southwestern and southeastern portions of the state." Created in 1895 as an independent state agency, the Game Commission is responsible for conserving and managing all wild birds and mammals in the Commonwealth, establishing hunting seasons and bag limits, enforcing hunting and trapping laws, and managing habitat on the 1.4 million acres of State Game Lands it has purchased over the years with hunting and furtaking license dollars to safeguard wildlife habitat. The agency also conducts numerous wildlife conservation programs for schools, civic organizations and sportsmen's clubs. The Game Commission does not receive any general state taxpayer dollars for its annual operating budget. The agency is funded by license sales revenues; the state's share of the federal Pittman-Robertson program, which is an excise tax collected through the sale of sporting arms and ammunition; and monies from the sale of oil, gas, coal, timber and minerals derived from State Game Lands. [/align] |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
No that wasn't the fat lady, that was three LIBERAL JUDGES :D
Give her time she is just getting warmed up.  |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
IHEAR MUSIC, SWEET ,SWEET MUSIC !!!!
Sorry had to do that. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
No that wasn't the fat lady, that was three LIBERAL JUDGES :D |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
liberal judges Oh, by the way, what is a liberal judge? lib·er·al Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation –adjective 1. favorable to progress or reform,[/align] |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
It doesn't matter.They burned up all their ridiculous conspiracy theories the first time around.
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RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
Bailey, once again you state something with nothing to back it up.
I don't pretend to know something I don't but my information about a "prejudice ruling" is that the court is informing the plaintiffs that they: MAY NEVER AGAIN BRING FORTH A SUIT AGAINST THESE SAME DEFENDANTS THAT INVOLVES THE SAME SUBJECT OF THE DISMISSED COMPLAINT. If you have one shred of documentation to show otherwise, I'll glady learn from your expertise. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
Happy to see it.
I do not have a real problem with the new regs. Hunting 4c for years and recently (past 3 years) shot the 3 biggest deer over the past 31 years. Only the attorneys and the guys raising money(Unified Sportsmen of Pennsylvania's ) profit from such stuff. IMHO just follow the money trail ad see who benefited from the lawsuit. Everything in nature works to a balance. No doubt, you wont see deer in the parking lot anymore, but the woods will be better for it. I am sure most of those USP's shot many many doe over the past 5 years. In my little world in 4C I shot none and the runs I hunt on still have deer coming by every day. Can't have it both ways. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
Each WMU has it's own antlerless allocations.Some get more and some get less.Saying the whole state is managed the same way it totaly off base.
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RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
I have noticed one poster who would normally be all over a thread like this one had vanished since the decision.
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RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
The whole state is managed differently but some WMU's need changes.I still think in some places especially the more populated SGL's and some other public land will need to be managed seperate from private land.Or vice versa.
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RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
ORIGINAL: BaileyHill the "world" is a big place ...one size doesn't fit every WMU. That's a fact too many seem to have forgotten!! 1A 42,000 1B 30,000 2A 55,000 2B 68,000 2C 49,000 2D 56,000 2E 21,000 2F 28,000 2G 19,000 3A 29,000 [/align] 3B 43,000 3C 27,000 3D 38,000 4A 29,000 4B 31,000 4C 39,000 [/align] 4D 40,000 4E 38,000 5A 25,000 5B 53,000 5C 79,000 [/align] [/align] 5D 20,000 Totals 859,000 [/align] Doesnt look like a one size fits all strategy to me! |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
ORIGINAL: TRYKONOISSEUR I have noticed one poster who would normally be all over a thread like this one had vanished since the decision. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
NO SPORTSMAN would kill doe/fawn in wmu2g when there is very few deer.. no SPORTSMAN would harvest 5 deer when he knows very well that kids and older adults and others that dont have a lot of time to hunt have not seen or had opportunity to harvest a deer.. Sadly....More guys are not sportsman in PA than are. Listen to the stories told around the work place, listen to the stories on these message boards, you can see it for yourself. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
Sproulman,
I wanted to give you a field report from WMU2G for today. In only 2 seperate locations ON PUBLIC LAND in a STATE FORREST, my friends and I saw 23 deer collectively. 3 of which were bucks that offered no shot w/ a flintlock. Just a monthh ago I spoke w/ several gun hunters who would swear there were no deer in those same locations. People in the woods,weather,wind direction and available food changes a deers daily travel and bedding. I wonder if that could account for our sightings or thee lack of someone else's. As far as the guy having his kids get liscence's for him...well, you must live among alot of outlaws. I've never seen or heard that in my neck of the woods. Good luck next season, and maybe you should find a new spot to hunt, or 2 or 3. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
archer58, glad to hear you had a good day. If you went out in this crap, you deserved to have a good day!
I dont hunt 2G but we hear the same things about there being no deer over in 2F and yet my gang still finds lots of deer when we hunt there. I guess we must both be those liars that Sproul keeps talking about. Oh wait, I know, you hunted WAYBACK;) |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
"...ON PUBLIC LAND in a STATE FORREST, my friends and I saw 23 deer collectively. 3 of which were bucks that offered no shot w/ a flintlock. Just a monthh ago I spoke w/ several gun hunters who would swear there were no deer in those same locations."
Now hold on there: It's obvious that you don't understand The Problem. It's not that there reallyare no deer,it's thatmany ofthose who say there aren't any deer now,became used to seeing those 23 deer all at one time, all inone place, multiple times per day. Preferably onopening day andin the same place they'd huntedfor the past 15-20 years. :) I believe those days are gone in many places, now that deer numbers are becoming morebalanced with their habitat,like they should've been years ago. It was fun while it lasted, now it's time for some seriousness. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
After reading all of the posts on this thread, I have learned one thing......anybody who CLAIMS to have seen more than 4 deer in a single county is a liar.
Since I now understand this point, I have a question..... If there are only 4 deer in those counties, why would a hunter NOT drive to another county where ther is more than 4 deer? Hey, now I have a second question...... If there are only 4 deer in these certain counties, why would hunters attempt to kill the last 4 deer? |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
I took a walk through game lands 4C yesterday afternoon a saw 7 deer. 3 different sightings and certainly different deer. Did a little 2007 scouting and was very hapy with what I saw. Although it was a 45 minute walk from the giant parking lot accessible to anyone.
One problem we have is that our society has become too fat to walk 45 minutes to shoot and drag a deer. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
Amen to that Chip. The guys that complain the most don't get in the woods very far. They think if a road goes back 1/2 mile and they walk 100 yards they're WAY BACK IN.
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RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
I also think the same people who complain so much, never shot any deer in the past and now tey just have another thing to become involved with.f
Everyone has to be honest. The deer of the past were skinny and had undersized antlers and bodies and showed all of the signs of not being healthy. I used to love to see 30-40 does a day on the 1st day of rifle season. Interesting note - in "the good old days" the camps nearby always had big drives going and deer were moved all day long. Now they don't do that anymore becuase their is "No Deer". I think they just got lazy. Maybe we don't see as many deer because they are doing the work as they used to. Chicken or the Egg question. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
ORIGINAL: Chipcz I also think the same people who complain so much, never shot any deer in the past and now tey just have another thing to become involved with.f Everyone has to be honest. The deer of the past were skinny and had undersized antlers and bodies and showed all of the signs of not being healthy. I used to love to see 30-40 does a day on the 1st day of rifle season. Interesting note - in "the good old days" the camps nearby always had big drives going and deer were moved all day long. Now they don't do that anymore becuase their is "No Deer". I think they just got lazy. Maybe we don't see as many deer because they are doing the work as they used to. Chicken or the Egg question. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
ORIGINAL: huskerdo ORIGINAL: Chipcz I also think the same people who complain so much, never shot any deer in the past and now tey just have another thing to become involved with.f Everyone has to be honest. The deer of the past were skinny and had undersized antlers and bodies and showed all of the signs of not being healthy. I used to love to see 30-40 does a day on the 1st day of rifle season. Interesting note - in "the good old days" the camps nearby always had big drives going and deer were moved all day long. Now they don't do that anymore becuase their is "No Deer". I think they just got lazy. Maybe we don't see as many deer because they are doing the work as they used to. Chicken or the Egg question. I have 34 years of hunting under my belt in PA, and all I have to offer here is.................................. GOODBYE!:D |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
ORIGINAL: huskerdo ORIGINAL: Chipcz I also think the same people who complain so much, never shot any deer in the past and now tey just have another thing to become involved with.f Everyone has to be honest. The deer of the past were skinny and had undersized antlers and bodies and showed all of the signs of not being healthy. I used to love to see 30-40 does a day on the 1st day of rifle season. Interesting note - in "the good old days" the camps nearby always had big drives going and deer were moved all day long. Now they don't do that anymore becuase their is "No Deer". I think they just got lazy. Maybe we don't see as many deer because they are doing the work as they used to. Chicken or the Egg question. You seem quite knowledgeable on the whole deer issue. By chance are you on the USP's legal team? |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
ORIGINAL: BTBowhunter ORIGINAL: huskerdo ORIGINAL: Chipcz I also think the same people who complain so much, never shot any deer in the past and now tey just have another thing to become involved with.f Everyone has to be honest. The deer of the past were skinny and had undersized antlers and bodies and showed all of the signs of not being healthy. I used to love to see 30-40 does a day on the 1st day of rifle season. Interesting note - in "the good old days" the camps nearby always had big drives going and deer were moved all day long. Now they don't do that anymore becuase their is "No Deer". I think they just got lazy. Maybe we don't see as many deer because they are doing the work as they used to. Chicken or the Egg question. You seem quite knowledgeable on the whole deer issue. By chance are you on the USP's legal team? there you go badmouthing the USP again..get a life!! |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
there you go badmouthing the USP again..get a life!! I think I am getting the hang of this place now![8D] |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
The fat lady may have sung the last chorus, but someone will turn and the page and find the rest of the lyrics...if you believe the deer herd in this state is in better shape today than it was 5 years ago.. I have a bridge I'd like to sell you...it's in sad sad shape, except for those who have their private land under armed guard and behind a 1000 posted signs..open and public land is in sad shape overall.. what's that..she's clearing her throat for a good bellow !!
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RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
ORIGINAL: Frank in the Laurels The fat lady may have sung the last chorus, but someone will turn and the page and find the rest of the lyrics...if you believe the deer herd in this state is in better shape today than it was 5 years ago.. I have a bridge I'd like to sell you...it's in sad sad shape, except for those who have their private land under armed guard and behind a 1000 posted signs..open and public land is in sad shape overall.. what's that..she's clearing her throat for a good bellow !! That being said......this lawsuit was going to achieve that end how? I am with you on needing changes, but on the plaintiffs of the dismissed lawsuit.........you take that org. completely down to ground zero, and start fresh, then we can have a discussion about the USP. Until that time, they are beyond irrelivent.:) |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
yep, we have some things that need fixing. But fixing things the USP way is kinda like amputating the patients head because he has a headache.
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RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
Does anyone in the USP have a headache?
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RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
ORIGINAL: Big Country ORIGINAL: Frank in the Laurels The fat lady may have sung the last chorus, but someone will turn and the page and find the rest of the lyrics...if you believe the deer herd in this state is in better shape today than it was 5 years ago.. I have a bridge I'd like to sell you...it's in sad sad shape, except for those who have their private land under armed guard and behind a 1000 posted signs..open and public land is in sad shape overall.. what's that..she's clearing her throat for a good bellow !! That being said......this lawsuit was going to achieve that end how? I am with you on needing changes, but on the plaintiffs of the dismissed lawsuit.........you take that org. completely down to ground zero, and start fresh, then we can have a discussion about the USP. Until that time, they are beyond irrelivent.:) freezer full of meat crowd are ones backing the PGC.. USP has guts and is out looking after the deer.. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
USP has guts and is out looking after the deer.. We're from the government and we're here to help! I did not have sex with that woman, Miss Lewinsky. The check is in the mail. Rosie Odonnell isn't fat, she's just big boned. No honey, that's not a NEW bow. No doubt about it, Mitch Rompola's deer is real. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
All those and this:
Go ahead..., It's safe. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
"USP wanted 1 deer and your done, others want FREEZER FULL OF MEAT..
freezer full of meat crowd are ones backing the PGC.. USP has guts and is out looking after the deer.." I beg to differ. Supporting "one and done" only came up once deer numbershad declined and the membership started to complain. What was their position on bonus tags, back when deer numbers were too high andmany werebusy killing all the does theyhad tags for? The real"FREEZER FULL OF MEAT" side of the equationwere happy as clams when we stillhad oodles of deer to shoot.Perhaps they werethe ones that ridiculed antler restrictions andwanted any buck, be it spike or 6"forkhorn...you know, the manly thing to do: shoot any buck because it means you're a real hunter kind of thing? :) The problem turned about after HR reduced the herd in many areas, to the point that the F-F-O-M people could no longer roll two deer by noon on the second day of the season, (one of which would've been the aforementioned spike) and begain to keen and wail about no longer being able to see lots of deer on Day One. If I had an accuratelist of USP members and lots of time, I'd go over to PGC HQ and check report cards for the past 10 years to see who was killing lots of does in the old days and who wasn't...assuming they'd actually sent in report cards, or have a membership list. Those records are available for anyone that wants to spend the time. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
ORIGINAL: BTBowhunter USP has guts and is out looking after the deer.. We're from the government and we're here to help! I did not have sex with that woman, Miss Lewinsky. The check is in the mail. Rosie Odonnell isn't fat, she's just big boned. No honey, that's not a NEW bow. No doubt about it, Mitch Rompola's deer is real.  |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
boy, you are really sticking to TOPIC HERE..
Yes, Sproul, you are correct. I am sticking to the topic. The USP suit is the topic and USP's credibility is an integral part of that topic. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
Sorry guys,
I have been hunting SGl for the past 31 years and I still think it is the best hunting I have ever had. The spikes have seemed to disappear and every deer that comes my way gives me the feeling that it could be a nice buck. I have shat a better than 6 point buck every one of the past 6 years. I see enough deer to keep me happy, and I am thrilled that the volume of hunters("complainers") has gone down in my WMU. Before that I had what we called the wall of shame. I certainly do not sit on the same runs as I used to, but that is called HUNTING. Alt was right and many of you guys just cant stand it. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
freezer full of meat crowd are ones backing the PGC.. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
ORIGINAL: TRYKONOISSEUR freezer full of meat crowd are ones backing the PGC.. |
RE: The fat lady has sung in PA
What's this "freezer full of meat" crap?
I fully support deer management but I've killed one buck and three, maybe four,does in the last ten years in PA. The guys I know who support deer management are the same guys who are willing to pass on baby bucks, not take a chance on shooting a button buck and generally hunt like someone who cares about the resource. It is the "give me a deer" guys who blast away and then whine when deer numbers drop. Slinsky himself bragged to me about going to South Carolina and killing six deer in one week. I know what he is about!!!! |
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