Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

To add frustration to a bust of an opening weekend. My buddies and I learned from a neighbor that prior to our arrival upstate (and prior to the opening on gun season in New York's southern zone) a local "hunter" and no less that 14 of his boys were driving our hunting property real hard.
The property is clearly posted and gated. The neighbor estimates roughly 8 bucks were taken. I saw a few gut piles to confirm his report. He also added that this "hunter" (aka poacher) is known for shooting anything that moves and hunts with the "If it's brown, it's down" ethic.
I immediately called the DEC. They were very polite and understanding on the telephone. They also said that there was little they could do if they do not catch him in the woods.
I would love to hear from anyone else who has dealt with or is dealing with a similar situation. I am now on the war path to get this criminal caught. It will be a little bit of a challenge seeing as how I do not live in the area, but I am determined to press charges against him. Thanks in advance for your input.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

The DEC recently arrested 5 in Wayne Co. for deerjacking using airplanes/helicopters... at least that's what the D&C said this weekend. So, maybe you can convince them to catch the crookswhen they do it again.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

Trail Camera's may be an option. Ifyou rig them high in a tree in a unique way, they would probably work to collect evidence.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

I agree with Airborne. If your not around it much, trail cameras are the way to go. I'm in the same boat you on property. We had alot of trespassers the first couple yrs owning it. We had to keep on them, we started taking back tags, names not knowing whom they were. We called the law a couple times. Then we put trail cameras up, and got a couple that way.
I'd also recommend not letting them know you are there. For example close up your gates once there, hide yourvehicle.
You can also go to your closest NY State Police barracks, and ask to fill out a patrol area form. Explain your problem, and once you fill out the form NYSP has a reason to specifically patrol your area. Also ask for their personal State Police Patrolled trepassing signs to post up. They are usually real good about this. It gives them a reason to patrol new spots!
Eventually the word will get around your serious, and they should back off. Least if they have any brains. If they don't you'll catch them sometime, and prosecute. Good Luck.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

Maybe you could grant hunting priviledges to a local cop? That might get the job done.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

If you go with the cameras, make sure they are protected well from being stolen:eek:

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

It's become so ridiculous during gun season that I gave up fighting it. I dont' have the time or energy anymore to battle these morons. I've been begging and pleading with the DEC for 5 years to get after a known poacher in my area. Told them I would give up my hunting season to do whatever I could. It all fell on deaf ears. I've never seen an officer anywhere near my area.

Trespassers? Seems like every other hunt I see orange someplace there shouldn't be orange. Had a guy walk 2 yards under my stand at 7:30am opening morning last year. He didnt' know who owned the 5 pieces of land around him.

I hate to give in, but it seems like a hopeless battle. I find myself not hunting too much for the first week and a half or so. Wait untill all the yahoos get bored of hunting and give up. I get back at it pretty hard for the last part of gun season when most everyone is out of the woods.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

I understand your frustration, but I want to nip this in the bud as soon as possible. My complaint to the DEC was handled very much like yours with the officer explaining that there are really just a handful of agents in the field to respond to such complaints. He suggested calling the state police if a DEC officer was unavailable or calling the "poaching" hotline 1-800-TIPP DEC (1-800-847-7332).
I do believe that there is no way to completely stop trespassing. Even the best neighbor is not going to patrol every acre of your property in your absence.
It is the "problem" trespassers, those with no regard for the law, your property, or the ethics of a safe, legal hunting season, that need to be stopped. I can't stand by to let the total abuse of my land take place.
I know that threats and warnings mean nothing. Action needs to be taken to let these criminals know I'm serious. I will prosecute.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

Bring some food, coffee, donuts, etc.. to the nearest state police barracks and strike up a conversation with them. When I owned land, I had a problem with dumping, and got to know the police in the area, brought them some NYPD gear, and the dumping stopped. They started checking the area a lot. Never caught anyone, but whoever was doing it got the point.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

Mostly a lost cause for those that own land but live far away. When you are not around all the time these idiots treat your place like their own hunting preserve. It almost takes hanging around during the season to hammer these guys down. You always hear "I have been hunting hear for 20 years-blah, blah, blah" Tough Sh!t now as you arent paying the taxes.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

If a carf/truck is on the property check with your lawyer and ask him if he would write a letter . Leave his card on the windshield of the vehicle with the words CALL ME on it. Take down the license plate # and ask the police or game warden to run it for you.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

there is only 1` way to stop tresspassing, you have to put wire fence around property..this ius what is being done here in my area and landowners say its working..

they put up about 4 strands about 8 ft high total..i caugt guy on my land trying to kill a doe.. i hate doe killers..

i said, didnt you see the signs,he said, george bush allowed me to hunt here, i said, george bush died 20 years ago and sold land to me..

he said, oh thats sad, poor george.. i said ,get your lying a off my land..they are bold as hell, some run when caught..others they shoot a deer on my land from stateland line then run into my land, grab deer and run with it..

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

For tresspassing At least where I hunt the LEO would be the sheriff not the state police. DEC may on rare ocasion do something about poachers but I am not sure that tresspassing is thier bag and there way to over streched as it is. So if I was going to cort a LEO it would be the sheriff.

I have thought about asking a lawyer about how far off the road it becomes my property and if some one parks on my land I could have them towed or maybe I could get a Wheel boot and boot there vehical. Leave a note on the booted vehical that the vehical can be unlocked byappearingat my office 80 miles away on the next business day.. that should get the point across.

I did find that this year it was bad in NYS this year as the warm wearther brought out lots of goodweather hunters

NoKnees

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

anyone not living on/near the property, can only hope that the poaching is kept to a minimum. it's a fact of hunting when you hunt far from home. it happens everywhere. make more frequent trips to your ground,if feasibleor listewn to the advice about bribing some cops..'cuz that's all you're really doin', but may be your best option.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

heres my story

this location is a nursery which is on the side of a main rd on the outside of my town. the two black dots in the back represent two stands my uncle was in the right one .. the other one sucks because they come from every which way and its tough to not be seen

the 3rd dot is where i have been sitting lately but decided not to go there yesterday morning the reason is the deer come from the woods and hang around the pines/that feild and they cannot be shot from the right stand.

my uncle earlier had seen a buck go into the pines .. area later he heres a shot from by the rd no one else was hunting.. but he figured it was his father inlaw who owns the land (sometimes he sitsin his truck..hes eldery)
later he calls him and he saidhe never ended up going hunting

my uncle gets down.... to find the gut pile next to his truck .. nice huh but i was thinking i would have had a bullet shot in my direction if i went to were i usually sit
we are pretty sure it was the guy who lives right acroosss the street as you can see he would just have to stand in his front yard behind the bushes/trees

any way [:@]i didnt even feel like hunting this morning

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

I was talking with one of the local highway dept. workers the other day and he told me the state,county,and/or local highway dept own from the center line of the road back 20 ft.Which would in most cases would be to the guardrails.So if he is parked off the shoulder you can nail him.
When my family was still farming.We left the electric fence on high,even though the cows were in another field or barn.Of course we ran 4 course of wires which would be about 4' high with an electric line on top and one sticking back a foot from the fence about 2 foot high.Made it a little hard to get over the fence to retieve a down deer.You know we had people try to cross them.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

Question for all of the people who have their land posted. If an honest, concientious hunter requested permission to hunt on your land would you grant it?

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

i have land which i do not post. I have some local neighbors as well as people that live downstate like meand I let them know I'm always up for the first week of gun season and i'll have 3 or 4 friends with me. I've asked they not hunt the property when i'm there. when i'm not there it doesn't bother me if they or any locals want to hunt it. i've never had a problem and have a great relationship with my nieghbors. (except one guy that's quite paranoid andposts his property with enough signs to make you think you're on 42nd st in nyc). I respect his silly signs but I know the local guys just laugh at them. Unless you post 24 hour security you're probably not gonna stop guys from wandering onto your property.

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Depends.If the season has already started andyou drive by the place then come back 10 minutes later to ask cause you seen a deer up the road,Then answer would be NO.But if happen to stop by during the summer or the early fall and asked nicely and willing to work with you on different projects you might have going on or if somebody else will be hunting the property.Willing to hunt another day in case of the later.Then my answer would be Yes.Most property owners feel the same way I think.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

No.

Steve

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

I wouldn't let anyone hunt on my land either, because I am a hunter and that's the purpose of the land. If I wasn't a hunter, I would have no problem with it because I wouldn't care if some guy walked onto my land and shot a 10 pointer. But why allow someone else the chance to take that 10 on your land when you are a hunter?

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

on my other property people where using my land as the shooting range for deer drives... i kicked them out but i guarantee they will be back[:@][:@][:@]but when they are ..i do know a few troopers cops...maybe a sheriff or two

i dont own the land but if i did and someone asked i would politely say no just because they spots are small enough for 3-4 guys like my parrty has

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

Posting land creates more problems than it solves. It creates hard feelings among local hunters (especially when the person posting the land is not a "local"). I'm not saying it's right or wrong.... All I'm saying is that if land is posted, there are going to be problems. I think a better way is to post signs that say "Hunting with written permission only" and have your name and phone number on the sign. That sends a very different message than "No Hunting or Trespassing.....Violaters will be prosecuted", and signs with similar language.

Some friends have a hunting cabin that was being broken into continually and vandalized. They finally took the lock off the door and put a sign up that said, "You are welcome to use this cabin....please leave it as you found it". End of problems... Go figure. People are funny.

Also, remember that when you post property you are posting it from a lot of people who you may need something from some day. That person you turn down could very well be an EMT on the local volunteer ambulance or a volunteer fireman. Something to think about........

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

Give me a break!! It's called respecting someone elses property!! Even if the land is not posted you still need permission by the land owner to hunt on the property!!

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

So an EMT isn't going to care for me if he happens tobe called to an accident I may have because I didn't let him hunt the land I bought and pay taxes on? A firefighter is going to watch my house burn to the ground? Give me a break.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

Maybe you need more names - some local groundswell to bring to the law. If there's community concern beyond just yours, maybe that'll help.

My neighbor recently caught some kids jacking deer the Wednesday before gun opener. In their strange bid to sound innocent, they bragged about another kid who's even TWICE as bad. (A 17 yr old pathological redneck who leaves the carcasses in the woods. Doesn't take meat, nothing.)
So, armed with this kids name he goes to the cops and DEC. The DEC asked permission to patrol his land. They said they'd been tipped to this kid before, on account of how bad he is.
So maybe get some names together, draft a group letter.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

I never said that.....you jumped to conslusions. The point I'm trying to make is that in the small communities we all are there for each other in many different ways. We not only have the volunteer ambulance and fire departments, but we have little league coaches, soccer coaches, 4-H volunteers, etc. We also have doctors, school teachers, etc. who maybe live in the smaller rural communities for the outdoor opportunties. Is it really asking too much to respectfully ask for permission to hunt on property that is posted?How would you like it if your son or daughter was told that they couldn't play on the little league baseball or soccer team because "We already have too many kids participating"....

What I'm feeling here is that good old American greed......Posting land is nothing but a very selfish, self-centered act.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

I am the most selfish , self centered person you will ever met. You trespass you go to jail its that easy.

Just maybe if you spent as much time at work as I do then you could pay the taxes on your own land , then you would not have to sneak onto mine !

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

Tatonka, with all due respect, I don't see how you could say that and have ever owned land. If you did, you would udnerstand. It costs a LOT of money to own land nowadays, and if you care about it, it also requires a lot of upkeep. Owning land is no joke. It is 100% the equivelent of lending your car out. Not to mention the threat of lawsuits if someone gets hurt on your land, which almost anyone would turn around and sue EVERYONE nowadays to make a quick buck. Why should I, a landowner, local or not, pay taxes, a mortgage, and upkeep expenses, and then feel like a I have to allow other people to hunt on MY LAND or else be considered selfish? How is purchasing something, anything, and then expecting other people to respect your ownership of said item (land or not) a selfish act? If Joe Redneck living down the county road doesn't like that I am from the city and own "his" land, then he should have bought it before I did, or offered a higher price.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

i used too leave my land open too hunting with permission..i said, you are allowed , no bucks under 3 points to side and NO DOE hunting..

well, they shot my doe, i went from 23 down to 7 deer..that was it, no more..THE NEW HUNTERS have no respect for anyhting, my neighbors kid calls it NO FEAR..

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

Get too know the neighbours real well, especially the ones that live there!

We had a problem with trespassing until we made deals with the family that lived on the access road,, they now watch our property.. in exchange they cut theyre firewood, trap the ponds for beavers, teenagers do some work for us some in the summer, hunt property for grouse, gifts for all 9 kids for xmas and birthdays, pay the wife for baked goods and breads when we are there, over pay the husband for cut firewood... dont have anyone coming in down that road anymore!

Had continuing problems with people coming in on the opposite side of the property by boat. We caught them one year openning day of gun season... surprise surprise it was 3 guys who were part of a huge crew that hunt a neighbouring property... a property owned by the brother of the person who we had the deals with. Threw them out and went right to the guy we made the deal with and told him... we caught your brothersleasee's coming in by boat this morning. You better get on the phone and tell him it stops today! He did and all tresspassing has stopped, the 1 brother has a real good deal going and he knows it.... make a neighbouring property owner want too keep you happy, and they will!

Also helps too get one local police officer who likes too hunt,, give him written permission too hunt the property.. He will make it a point that all officers keep and eye on that property.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

I obviously have hit a nerve here, Bawanajim... What I'm seeing is two very different generations of hunters and landowners. I'm guessing I'm quite a bit older than the people making the last few posts here and I'm guessing you all haven't grown up in small rural communites. I've worked all my life and recently retired.

Years ago landowners were farmers (where I grew up). No one bought a chunk of land just for hunting. In the small rural communities everybody knows everybody and hunting was just part of the yearly cycle. There was no posted land. If you were out hunting and happened to see a farmer on a tractor, you walked over and visited for a while. People hunted where they lived......no one went went to another part of the state, out of state, etc. With the completion of the interstate system travel to the small rural communities was much easier. People with money from the cities started buying up land for weekend retreats....not for hunting at first, but for weekend getaways to ski, just enjoy the country, etc. With the influx of the people from the cities came the posting of the land and with the posting of the land came a lot of hard feelings and resentment. Sure, those people paid taxes (like everyone else), but they contributed little else to the community. They didn't buy much there other than a little gas and food when they were there for the weekends or on vacation. In effect, they contributed little of nothing to the local economy. Then there were those who decided to move up from the city and "get away" from it all. Usually what happened was after a year or two they started trying to make things just like it was where they came from....they wanted better roads, better schools, etc. Along with all of
this came higher taxes, higher real estate prices, and more resentment. So, you ad "No trespassing" and "No Hunting" signs on top of all of this and you can see why things became the way they are.

If you understand human nature you will know that lack of control creates anger. Just take a look at some of the things we read about with sporting events when parents, coaches, etc. get upset with a ref, umpire, etc. When a ref makes a bad call, people have absolutely no control over the situation and they sometimes get angry and lose it. Posting land creates a similar situation....people have lost control and become very angry and sometimes do things they normally wouldn't do.

I'm just trying to provide a little understanding here of why posting land creates the problems it does. You also need to understand the type of people you are dealing with. The people who sneak onto posted land, jack deer at night, etc. are not your conscientious sportsmen. These guys are derelicts and to put it mildly they are not very nice guys. I'm not saying they just be allowed to do whatever they want to do because they are how they are.....what I'm saying is that you'd better be prepared to deal with some pretty rough characters.

I don't know what the answer is, but I can assure you that posting land will always create problems..... I'm just trying to shed a little light onhow things have developed over the years and why things are the way they are...

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

My land is open to all hunters. If someone shoots a nice buck, a doe or even a button-buck, great for them...all I ask is "give me a steak". They are not MY deer, I do not own them, I only own the land they are passing through on. People that post their land tweak me to no end, and what really flames my rear are people that post their land and then have the nerve to hunt other people's land that is not posted.

The problem here in NH is people moving in from out of state, buy big tracts of rural land (that has been open to hunting for decades) and immediately post it...FRIES MY CAN!!!

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

I agree with the permission to a police officer. I am a police officer and have permission to hunt a tract of land owned by some people from out of state. They don't want anyone on thier land. Well one day I caught a group of people driving it, and asked if they had permission, they said yeah but couldn't give me a name of the landowner. I told them I was a police officer and had exclusive permission to be there, and the landowner didn't allow anyone there, asked them to leave and not return unless permission was given to them. No further problems.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

...the most intellegent thing I've read so far.... ;)
and....

I can relate,bro... I can relate...only here, they bulldoze the trees and plant homes.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

It all pretty much boils down to a couple of things. Number one, development nationwide is taking out millions of acres of land that was once available to hunt. We now have more deer in the U.S. than any time in history and a fraction of the land to hunt them on.

The second problem (that I see as a problem) is the incredible boom in deer hunting popularity. Before 1980 there were nomagazines devoted specifically to deer hunting. You had Outdoor Life, Field and Stream, and Sports Afield....the big three. You'd see deer hunting articles in the fall and fishing articles in the spring. Now there are several speciality magazines devoted to deer hunting only and the whole emphasis is on the score of the deer. You rarely see a photo without all of the scoring statistics along side of it. For most hunters it's not about getting together with friends, putting up some venison for the winter, etc......it's about who can shoot the biggest buck. We're all guilty of it, myself included. There is absolutely nothing wrong with wanting to shoot a big buck. The problems arise when greed rears its ugly head and it becomes the sole reason for hunting.

I think we are seeing all of the posting of land, land leased out to outfitters, etc. becasue of this obsession to constantly shoot more and bigger bucks. There are landowners here who lease their land to outfitters, but will let "the locals" in to shoot does. In a sense they are throwing their neighbors the crumbs while letting the outfitters skim the cream off the top. I personally fill my doe tags on land that landowners let me hunt bucks on. I feel it's my responsibility to help them manage the deer on their property. We have way too many antlerless deer here. My neighbor on the east side of me leases 1200 acres out to an outfitter. Deer season closed yesterday. This morning there were over 97 deer feeding in his field...... 94 does and 3 small bucks.Pathetic. Guess who's going to be crying to the Fish & Game with they start attacking his haystacks.......

Allowing a police officer exclusive rights to hunt posted property to keep others out is one of the most disgusting things I've heard. That's total abuse of the position you hold and you should be ashamed of yourself, and you definitley should not be in law enforcement.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

its not because i am a police officer, its because i am a neighbor and I didn't solicit them.....they asked me. My whole family has exclusive rights, not just me.If i'm approached and asked by someone to hunt their land I should refuse because I am a police officer and its an abuse of my position....I think not. I think offering a police officer permission to hunt on land is a good idea.After all they are always on duty whether in uniform or not. And sworn to uphold the law. Hunting on someones land without permission because you are a police officer, and stating so would be an abuse of the position you hold.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

I myself was dealing with the same problem in Ellington,NY. I was told to call the local state troopers and they went down to resolve this problem. The first offense does nothing but a small ticket second is abigger ticket and third is a felony charge.Trust me they probably won't be trespassing any more when the police talk to them. Bottom line is call your local state patrol office and let them handle it for you.

RE: Dealing with trespassers in New York
 

"...what I'm saying is that you'd better be prepared to deal with some pretty rough characters."

Luckily, I am a police officer also, so I am ready to deal with rough characters. As a matter fo fact, I found that when I owned my land supposed "rough" characters with guns usually are much quicker to flash them than they are to use them. After showing a few"locals" that I was not of the same persuasion as they were, my problems stopped, which were mostly dumping of trash actually.

Tatonka, like it or not, this is a free-market, capitalist economy. Non-Locals will be buying land in rural areas, and the supposed "locals" have no right what-so-ever to demand any use of said land. As a matter of fact, if we want to get technical, can I demand that NYC gets its fair share of taxes returned considering we pay WAY MORE than the more rural parts of the state, but see more of it spent up there than down here? It's apples and oranges, but the fact remains that a land owner has every right to do whatever they want on their land, whether the locals like it or not, as long as it is legal.

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Your absolutely right. Landowners can do anything they please with their property. What's legal and what's right and wrong can sometimes be two very different things. Man's laws and God's laws are sometimes in conflict with each other.

Apples and Oranges? Yep....city folks and country folks. Apples and Oranges.