RE: What you all think about this BS..
 

The bad part is, all they had to do was show up the next nite and stake out this farmer's property. These poachers were coming every nite and driving in the fields, spotting and shooting. I'm sure the PGC was busy but they would have had a good chance of catching these guys.

I realize there is little the PGC can do, after the fact, and they almost have to catch a poacher redhanded, but they had a chance to catch these guys and didn't even bother to come investigate.

This farmer was a good friend of my father's and passed away some time ago. He was enrolled in something with the PGC,where he opened his land to hunting, had the Game Commission signs, allowed pheasant stockings, got a subscription to Game News, etc... After this poaching thing and the PGC not responding, he was PO'd. He posted his land after that. I was actually glad, because he still let us hunt.

I actually got my license checked and questioned for being in the woods with a video camera. This was back when VHS cameras were first put on the market. I bought one and took it out to get some pictures of deer. I had already gotton one with a bow earlier in the season but wanted to still enjoy the outdoors by using a camera. The two deputies acted like I was breaking the law when they saw the camera.I had to hand it to them while they started pushing buttons trrying to eject the tape. Why? I have no idea, why they needed to inspect the camera. Why did I have to show ID and let them inspect my license. I wasn't hunting with a weapon. By the way, this was on private land also.

Its a good thing I was wearing my own jacket with my license on it and not my buddy's or father's. It shouldn't have mattered whose license I had on my back, just to take pictures.

I buddy of mine had an episode with a deputy PGC one time that was funny.

Him and a few friends were hunting doves on his farm. They had two trucks parked in a field under a big oak tree. They were standing around the trucks shooting at doves as they'd fly by. ( lots of doves on his farm)

As they were standing there, a PGC vehicle came ripping down their 1/4 mile long driveway and whipped it up to their trucks. He jumped out and started giving an attitude right away. First he checked everyone's license. All were legit. He then started yelling about them being parked in the field and started writing them up. The hunters just looked at each other with a sorta smile. When he got to my buddy, he ask where he lived. My buddy pointed across the field to his house. The deputy ask if he owned the field they were parked in. My buddy let him know that he certainly did.

It was my buddy's turn now. He flew into that deputy, asking who he thought he was ripping down his driveway and driving in his field acting like a smarta$$. He told him, if he would of just ask he would have been informed that he was the owner of the property and all was well, but in stead he wanted to jump out of his PGC and make a fool out of himself. The deputy appologized and left.

RE: What you all think about this BS..
 

I know of no other state where their Fish and Game Dept. has such a bad reputation or is as hated by its hunters. They certainly deserve the bad rep.

I've never been arrested or ever paid any fines for breaking the law. I am an ethical hunter.

I have a very limited experience with the PGC, but what experiences I've had weren't good. They always treat everyone like a criminal.
I've hunted in West Virginia for many years and had the oppertunity to talk to their Game officials several times. I walked away very impressed at how proffessional they were. They would shake you hand and introduce themselves. They always seem interested in how your hunt is going and what you've been seeing. Not here in PA. You're guilty until proven innocent in the PGC's mind.

I have a buddy that has been a police officer for about 18 years. He did work in PA for a while but now is a Delaware State Trooper.

Once in a while they would get involved in helping out the PGC with something and always said how arrogant they were to work with. He even said that most police officers don't hold the PGC in very high regard. They seem to throw their weight around in a manner that they would get in big trouble for.

RE: What you all think about this BS..
 

I personally know the three WCO's that have districts surroundingthe area where I live.I know for a fact that these guys all take their jobs very seriously and go way beyond working a 40 hour week.Ihave a hard time believing any of them would be arrogant or not respond to a hot tip,consisting of 50 deer skulls.That's a crock.Are they perfect?No.Has the PGC made mistakes?Sure,but they're the best friends we have.It's a shame most don' t realize it.Eventually they'll regret it.

I had a less than pleasant experience with a deputyback in the 90's in Wyoming county.The guy was a pompous jerk but I know better than to label all law enforcement officers in that manner.Besides,I doubt he lasted very long.

It's funny how someone can label another person without meeting them.I used to be on the same side of the fence with alot of the complainers on here.I thought this was all a big conspiracy to ruin hunting.I argued with R.S.B all the time.I know of an area near my house with excellent regeneration,despite having a large deer herd.R.S.B took time out of his day to check it out.I also had three other foresters take a ride and give me their opinion.After hearing what they had to say,it started to make sense.Last year R.S.B took a whole saturday out of his day to show me all around his district.he also drove 45 minutes to speak to our sportsman's club at 9:00pm on night.The man puts more into that job than anyone could imagine.He hosts habitat tours and does alot of it on his own dime,providing lunch and drinks.The sportsman of this state couldn't ask for a better guy to educate the public and protectthe resources.For someone to question his intergrity without knowing him is slanderous.

RE: What you all think about this BS..
 

Maybe your buddy is a nice guy but the WCO's I've delt with weren't.

Like I said, I was out with a video camera and had two deputys treating me like I was breaking the law. I was young back then and just purchased that expensive camera. It was hard to stand there and watch them pushing all the buttons, not knowing what they were doing. I felt they had no right to do that.

I have to admit, that experience left and bad taste in my mouth ever since.

I had produce ID and let them look at my license. I could have been wearing my father's jacket and it should not of mattered whose license was on my back. Heck, I didn't even need a license to take pictures.

There are many stories I have heard by trusted friends that are similar.

When I was 12 and just started hunting, we had a family friend that had a brother that was a Deputy WCO. He would hunt with us sometimes and tell us stories.

Must be something about being a WCO, because he was full of himself. Looking back now, I can see that he wasn't that " nice guy".

He enjoyed intimidating people and accussing them of something they didn't do

I watched him when I was pheasant hunting with his brother one time. He made a car pull over and harrassed the guys inside. They weren't doing anything wrong and he was just showing off for his brother and us. Even then, at 12 years old, I knew it wasn't right.

RE: What you all think about this BS..
 

Had something similar happen when I was with my brother and a friend of his out at the local range on the gamelands back in Late 90. The WCO went right into the "what are you doing? You hunting?" routine. Saw camo UTs in my brothers truck, etc, etc. Gave us a hard time. THEN when he started asking if we had any firearms concealed on us, like it was something wrong considering we all had some form of CCW permit, that WCO reallyticked off my brothers buddy. My brothers friend calmly told him "not that it is any of your busines, but yes I am carrying". Oh that WCO got all jumpy and started up even worse, he was going to write us up for it and everything, then Mike (buddy) produced his ID/Badge. See the WCOs problem was that Mike is a State Trooper, and then HE proceeded to dress that WCO down.ThenMike started onhis problem with those camies and stuff in the truck, which were a set of my brothers BDUs and gear since he was in on his leave from Desert Sheild and hadn't taken them out of the truck yet since he just got back the day before.
You'd think that that would be enough to put some sense into that WCO, but no, he still had to make a stink about"doing my job" and "you aren't exempt". Iheard that Mike made a bit of a deal about it then he got back to the Troop HQ.

I'm sure there are some WCOs that are great and resonablepeople, but there are way TOO many that are plainjacka$$es.

RE: What you all think about this BS..
 

I've known a few deputies over the years that were total clowns.However,the WCO's thatI know around here work hard and take their jobs very seriously.Iwas at meeting with one last night.We're dmap'ing a bunch of property and he showed up to clarify a few things.He even offered to help us hang some signs.He didn't act like a hard ass or arrogant at all.

RE: What you all think about this BS..
 

Well with their fiancial problems,You can bet more people will be getting harrassed in order to give them a fine to increase their revenue...I am sure if you looked over the last few years if there is a site,You would see an increase of fines over these years...They have to get the money from somewhere....

RE: What you all think about this BS..
 

The Deputy was lucky, they could have had him arrested.


Deputy stories most always tend to have some humor. Every year when I go to camp, I get a friend of mine (that bought two of Grandad's farms) to re-tell the story of him, his cousin,andone of hisbull's (with deer guts on his horns) chasing Fat George the Deputy !!

RE: What you all think about this BS..
 

I reported poaching last year,actually it was illegal baiting.I found out through a guy who hunts on my property that the WCO was investigating and rode a mountain bike back to the area of the baiting.The WCO even asked the hunter if he had permission to hunt the land which I appreciated.So in this case I know the WCO did follow up on my report.There is also poaching in this place done by the same asses that were baiting.
I do know that WCO's have too large of an area to patrol.I wish we had more.

RE: What you all think about this BS..
 

First off I will say right up front that tryran74’s story about calling the Game Commission about finding any dead deer carcasses, let alone a large number of carcasses, is just another make believe story that never happened. If he did find anything he never reported it, just like he never reported a dead mountain lion or helped pull one off the road.

I don’t know where you guys are coming up with these stories but I suspect that is just what the majority of them are, stories. I have had people telling me the stories about me harassing them and arresting them, while I was in civilian clothes and they didn’t know who they were talking too. They always tell the story to make it out that I was the bad guy and they were the hero that really told that SOB a thing or two. Then when they find out that the guy they are talking about in the story is the guy they are talking too the story always changes to, "well that is what they heard happened to a friend of theirs". In other words they had just made up a totally “bull corn” lie to make it sound like the Game Warden was an a$$ and they were a hero. Many of the stories that get told about Game Wardens are told by a person that never even had an encounter with the Officer and the ones that did have an encounter don’t tell the real story, just their fairy-tail version of it.

Now for some facts about the methods in which this states Game Wardens and their Deputies deal with the public and with citations and warnings.

In the first 11 months of 2004 (the legal updates training manual that provides those annual statistics is printed before December can be included) there were 5,971 charges filed and 9,063 warnings issued. Of those charged 95% either pled or were found guilty by the court. A total of $1,035,160.00 was issued in fines by the courts.

That is over 15,000 law enforcement contacts were a person was in violation of the law and dealt with by a Game Commission Officer yet for the entire year of 2004.

In the first 11 months of 2005 WCOS and Deputies issued 6,354 citation and 7,249 warnings. Once again that was a 95% conviction rate with $1,097,460.25 in fines.

For last year I also have the number of citizen complaints that filed against Game Commission. During that time there were a total of nine complaints submitted. Three were still under investigation with no conclusion at the time the information was released. Of the six remaining, only one was sustained with the Officer having acted in appropriately. One didn’t have enough facts to establish one way or the other and in the remaining four it was found that the Officer had been exonerated of any wrong doing.

Now I throw out a challenge to all of you. Find one other law enforcement agency in this state, or for that matter any other state, with as good of record per law enforcement contact where people are actually getting investigated and charged with a crime.

If you can find one be sure to come here and tell us all about it, but I don’t think you will find any with as good a record.

The reason we have so few complaints is because we have a longer and more intense training period then any other law enforcement agency in the state. We have updated legal training, for both WCOs and Deputies every year, which covers changes in legal methods and the most recent court opinions on legal procedures. We have regular and highly structured training for all of our officers, including the deputies and that even includes mandatory verbal communications training.

As for all of the horror stories about the abuse of power, that too is just so much BS; we live by the exact same constitutional limitations that every other law enforcement officer in this state lives by. We have no more power then any other law enforcement officer. The only real problem is the one of the public perception that we aren’t real law enforcement officers, but that too is wrong.

In my years as a WCO I have arrested two murders, two fugitives from justice, wanted for crimes in other states and two armed robbers, all while I was performing my duties of apprehending people violating the game laws. I have drawn my firearm to prevent being shot on several occasions. I have had a couple of guys that tried to kick my butt and all of them have ended up in handcuffs and under arrest within a matter of minutes.

I take it all very seriously and do the best I can at both protecting our resources and even our public when the need arises. I also work hard at trying to educate people about good wildlife management principles and the responsibilities of Game Wardens.

Now, how about some of you telling us about what you have done for the betterment of the resources, society or for that matter for the betterment of anything besides yourself.

There is a quote that kind of stands out as applicable, yet I don’t know you to credit with the quote. It goes something like this, “All that is required for evil to rule, is that good men do nothing.”

What have you done in the face of evil or of crime? Are you really a good man if you do nothing in the face of evil or crime?

Dick Bodenhorn
WCO, Elk County