What the DCNR wants
 

Rifle season from Oct-Jan.Some thought the DCNR would back off some or even cut demaps where the numbers were reduced below 15 DPSM.I guess that answers that question.I'm glad I have other land to hunt on.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Can't wait to here why this is good!!!!

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

They (DCNR) want the hunters to kill off ALL the deer (which they (hunters) are blindly glad to do) so that the forest can mature and the trillium can grow pretty and the birdwatchers from NYC and Boston can come and spend a few relaxing naturalistic days here without worrying about being shot by some slob, drunk, hick hunter (NOT my thoughts) or hearing those terrible gun shots and being witness to that horrible killing going on. They figure we (hunters)will contribute to our own demise. Or maybe I got the whole thing wrong, who knows. I can read between the lines of that Ben Moyer guy and the propaganda crap he writes. I think he is a mole for the enemy.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Couldn't agree more Livbucks, But we're just conspiricy theorists!!!



I'm going to have fun with this and keep guessing what the folks that think this is a good Idea are going to say!!!

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Jim Grace DCNR comments to Commissioners

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Read: "Hunters may need more time to kill each and every last whitetail remaining in this state"

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

I dont care what the DCNR wants.they are not important as far as i am concerned. They are as dangerous as the moslems that hit the towers.Evil greedy anti hunter crackerheads

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Break down your article, 1.75 deer per square mile on for about 900,000 acres of dmap. Why is that??? They state they want to keep going untill they reach their harvest goals, what is that?? From this article, its pretty obvious!! No good, they can stick it!!!

Call me greety,I could careless that crap is outta control!!

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

4sox, that is why they are saying they want more time, longer seasons, for hunters. With the current seasons they are only getting the 1.75 deer per square mile harvested in DMAP. A way to increase that is with longer, much longer seasons.

Get it?

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Come on T,they're only getting 1.75 deer because numbers have been reduced so much.Let's take a look at some of the possibilities.
Bear season-we all read the reports from the bear hunters claiming to see few deer and in alot of cases only one or two.So if they are now allowed toshoot these few deer they see,guess what?On a good note it would be good for the PGC because if people could hunt deer and bear together they would sell a boatload of bear licenses.Along with massive overharvests of the few deer that remain.
A fellow would be crazy to try archery hunting on state forest land with these new rifle seasons.
Matter of fact a person would be crazy to hunt deer period on dcnr lands in a few years.I really do feel sorry for those stuck hunting on state forest lands because their true blue colors have shown they want all the deer dead.A three month rifle season in PA would damn near do it.
I'm very thankful that I'm not stuck hunting on these anti run lands.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

I don't have time to do the research but I would love to see how many dpsm are being harvested in say the SW.I'll bet it's a whole lot higher then the dcnr dmap areas?
Why?Because there's alot more deer.The deer numbers are very low in the dcnr demap areas hence the low harvest rates.No science needed to figure that out just some experience and knowledge in those places.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Yeh T, I get it, mission accomplished, herd reduction in these areas worked, I guess total erradication is next??? What else is the article saying, more time for the remaining deer in pockets.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

germain,I killed a doe in Parker dam state park on the first day of archery this past year at 8:00am.She was the sixth deer I had in range that morning.I hunted private property for the remainder of archery season and killed a buck.I saw a total of 3 doe and 9 legal bucks during the rest of archery season on private property.Ispent the rest of the year hunting in Ohioand didn't hunt Pa again until the last day of rifle season.I had a dmap tag for an area in southern Cameron county so I headed up there despite everyone telling me I was wasting my time.I killed a doe that morning and saw around 20 deer by 10:00am.When you add it up,I hunted for about 5 hours on state forest land this year and killed 2 deer and saw at least 25 deer.That's far more than I saw on private land or in Ohio for the entire season.Hunting the state forests is much easier than hunting alot of private land in my opinion.The habitat is so poor on most of the state forests,all you have to do is key in on the small amount of available food and cover.Find an area with some recent logging and you'll generally find the deer.

Once again,the next time you're up this way give me a call.I'd like to show you some area on state forest landwhere they're not even fencing the timber harvests anymore because the regeneration is so good,do to less deer.Some of these area were loaded with deer just 5 years ago and the old timber harvests never regenerated.The herd was dramatically reduced prior to the more recent cutting and boom,regen all over the place.the deer herd is also making a strong comeback in these area over the past year.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

I'm going to try and get with you this year Doug.
If the dcnr would get their wish for a three month rifle season it wouldn't take long to eliminate the few deer left on state forest land.
Your hunt up north was on private land though right?

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

careful guys. few guys on here think that the DCNR can do no wrong. i for one do not and will not support the DCNR and i am so glad i dont have to hunt state forest. [/align]i think that's sad that they would want that long of a rifle season, but maybe next year they will get that wish.[/align]

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Germain,The dmap property that I hunted in Cameron county is owned by a friend of mine that bought it for the timber.He doesn't hunt and never posted the property.It's bordered on 3 sides by state forest land so most peopleprobably assumed it was state forest.He gets10 dmapcoupons a year and hands them out to anyone that wants them.Most of his property is unhuntable because it's pretty mucha cliff.You can actually see the white dots,marking the state forest from whereI hunted.He owns 200 acres and I'd say no more than 50 acres are actually huntable.This property was timbered in 2001 and he's having a hard time getting any regeneration because the deer flock to this area in the winter because it's one of the only places in that immediate area that had any browse.

I've been spending a consideable amount of time on state forest land over the past few weeks while scouting for turkeys.I'm seeing way more deer and sign thanI did the last three springs.I really fail to see how hunting has gotten so terrible in this area.I had a great year last year and I'm positive this year will be better.

Interestingly.I've only seen one other hunter on public land this spring scouting for turkeys.I've seen multiple hunters scouting on the private property where I hunt.Just because land isn't owned by the state,it doesn't mean it gets less pressure.

I'm not a real big fan of Rendell's yes men that area running DCNR.It seems their priorities are out of wack and not in the best interest of sportsman.However,they do have alot of good guys on the ground and they know what's going on in their districts.I know you disagree butI think they did exactly what neded to be done in this area.The habitat in district 9 was absolutely terrible.When it takes a fence to get regeneration,you have too many deer.Now that the deer herd is down,regeneration is starting to come back and hopefully the fencing will come down as well.Those fences help the trees but they hurt the deer.Every acres that's get's fenced is one less acre of habitat for the deer.Hopefully,less deer will mean the habitat will start to recover but it won't happen overnight.

Give me a call when you're up this way.I think you'll see where I'm coming from.Plus,I can show you a few areaswhere you should have no trouble killing a deer.Turkey numbers seem to be down somewhat but there's still plenty of them out there.Who knows,maybe we'll even see a mountain lion.:D

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

The hunters of Pa better wake up and start supporting a lisence increase.The PGC is our best friend and they're on our side regardless of what many think.They have reams of evidence proving that the deer herd was way out of balance with the habitat.Theyreduced the herd because it was in the best interst of hunting and the deer.Once theyhad it reduded,they made adjustments.Last year theyslashed allocation in 2F and 2G by over 40%.This year they slashed it even more.I fail to understand why hunters think they haven't done anything.I get sick and tired of people saying DCNR is running deer management.Ifthey were,which may be a possibility if the PGC doesn't get an lisence increase,we'll see rifles in all seasons,baiting,group huntingand a hell of alot less deer than you're seeing now.DCNR has been asking for these things for several years and the PGC hasn't given in.It's time to ignore the conspiracy theories and look at the facts.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Bingo Doug.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Doug, I speak for myself here, I support the liscense fee, I know DCNR isn't totally running the show, I know they have good ground men, but I wanna keep it that way, I want Rendell's yes men to stay outta of the picture. Nothing will change my opinion of the powers to be high in the DCNR!!

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

I'm not nuts about the guys running the show at DCNR myself.I have friends that work for DCNR,including our district forester and these guys are dedicated to both the deer and the habitat though.None of them want to see the deer exterminated like so many believe.they're also sick of building and maintaining fences,but up until recently,they had no choice.

All I can say is we better support the PGC because the other options aren't very good.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

I agree doug, but Like I said I just don't want those in charge of DCNR to keep their noses in things, they're backgrounds speak for themselves.



By the way, good luck in turkey, I'll be in Clearfield myself!!

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Many people on many boards tried telling you habitat gurus that swallowed the hook that things would eventually come to the point where the PGC would be in financial chaos. But you's wouldn't listen. Instead, we were labeled as greedy, lazy and incompetant. And now suddenly, the same group is asked to bail the PGC out.

I and many others have no sympathy whatsoever. You folks made your bed, now lay in it. If the PGC folded tomorrow, and the DCNR takes over the reigns, serves you right. I'll laugh all the way to Ohio and New York where the hunting begins.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Have we ever thought that some of those seeking deer ain't all that good at hunting.?? Like I said before, was all over the state on both public and private... Deer all over...

This BS about killin all the deer, please... I hear alot of so-called farmers on here saying we need more deer etc.. WTF?? If you ran your farm the same way as you are calling for the deer herd, you would get arrested for cruelty to animals... They starve when you over run poor property.. If there are not as many deer, that may indicate the land will not support them..Or you are not seeing them due to a reduction in the herd and less deer in one area means you need to look harder...

I hear others saying I ain't got time to research.. Hope your investments are thought out better.. I have been sickened by this type of discussion all my life here in PA... Crying, whining etc... Typical.. It is always the same ones.... you know who you are... try this one.. do a little research, take a look in most of the magazines which focus on DEER HUNTING and learn that PA is a laughing stock in deer management...

We have the genetics and food to support fantastic hunting but must constantly deal with this idiotic talk... For a long time I tried to make reason with some of you and now, don't care.. Your opinions are not substantiated with any fact just wind...

T in PA3 you are trying but brother, your wastin your time trying to educate...

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

HCK,The PGC would be in financial chaos with or without a large deer herd.The entire country is losing hunters through attrition.Regardless of how many hunters buy a lisence,any business would be struggling if they were forced to charge the same price for nine years without getting an increase.

I'm not asking guys like you to bail the PGC out.Go hunt Ohio and and New yorkand pay their out of state fees.I hunt Ohio and I don't see any more deerthere than I do back home in 2G.Then again,I'm not crying about the poor hunting in 2G.There's less deer but the hunting is as good now as it ever was.It takes a little more effort but that's what hunting is all about.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Yes. You are exactly right. For the last 5 years, Pa deer managers have been the laughing stock of the nation. Considering that they have unsuccessfully tried to manage a deer herd while not having a working population model, it's not any wonder. I bet they didn't point that out to you in that last issue of Buckmasters did they?:eek:

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Is it any wonder that the Pennsylvania Game Commission is the laughing stock of the nation? Consider that the previous Executive Director was a friend of the previous governor and a supermarket manager by profession.

Consider that the current Executive Director is a retired (30 Years) army full bird colonel who hunted as a teenager and whohas only just recentlybegun again to hunt, probably because of the new job, which may well also be a political favor.

Consider that the PGC Director of Wildlife Management does not hunt.

Consider that Dr. Gary (Kill the Deer) Alt had no oversight and answered to no one, not even the Director of Wildlife Management.

Would anyone call this good corporate management policy when you consider that the PGC has an operating budget of about $70 Million Dollars?

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

your post is funny cuernos.:DYou complain of whiners yet your post is whining about the whiners.:eek:

Actually Doug the good news is nationwide the hunting licenses sold last year increased alittle.Pa bucked that trend and saw a decrease.
I really hate to say this here but some of yinz in here never set foot in the big woods hunting deer.It's not hard to tell.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

[quote]ORIGINAL: cuernos1

Like I said before, was all over the state on both public and private... Deer all over... {quote]






THREE DEER IN ONE AREA CAN MAKE ALOT OF SIGN, DON'T BE FOOLED!!!!!

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Actually,when you follow the number of posts on the various boards by some of these folks that claim they scout every weekend, they hunt all the time, they know the bigwoods, yada yada yada, you begin to see see the picture more clearly. Clones. PGC clones.

I don't doubt that most of them are on the PGC payroll.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Don't leave out DCNR payroll either!!!

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

I have to agree. Many of them are probably Deputy Game Wardens, Game Wardens and Governor Rendell's PGC employees. Keep in mind that when (not if) DCNR overruns Rendell's PGC there will be substantial layoffs. Many of these posters will be looking for work in an area that is wanting for jobs.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

I have to agree the DCNR will take over and hunting won't be on their agenda.Rendell and the Philly boys he appointed are no doubt antis.Hunter numbers will start dropping at a higher rate then last year.I justed talked to two hunters that have a camp in southern potter that decided to call it quits.They are surrounded by state forest and after reading the proposal from dcnr to hold a three month rifle season they realize it's a lost cause.
This proves they aren't interested in keeping a balanced herd they want them brought down to the lowest numbers possible or eliminated.It's ashame because so many people are reliant on state forest lands for hunting deer.Soon enough they will get their wish for that three month season.
One thing that sticks out about this is the overlap of bear season.If that was combined with deer there would be so many people buying bear tags that system would have to go to a lottery with many not getting bear tags.Wonder how that would go over.:eek:

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

What really got me was when the proposal said hunters needed more time to get to the pockets of deer that still remained, talk about the mask coming off, there's no way anyone could support this and call themselves a hunter!!!

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

http://pennsylvania.sierraclub.org/PAChapter/Forest%20Management/Management.htm



Hey look who's in contact with the DCNR promoting old growth and trying to stop timber!!!!!

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

The Audubon and the Sierra Club has been pushing for the deer slaughter for a long time, they know as long as the deer is in the woods the hunters will hunt, no deer no hunters.
They are the big pushers for PA. WILD'S, NO ROOM FOR HUNTERS!!!!!!!!!!!

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Thats why I posted it, people say this is conspiercy theories, but to me DCNR is sounding just like these other hippies!!!

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

Here is the pockets they were talking about.

April 11, 2006
By Christian Berg
Of The Morning Call

Responding to a growing public outcry over deer-vehicle collisions, Lyme disease and damaged crops and landscaping , the Pennsylvania Game Commission has released its first-ever plan to manage whitetails in urban and suburban areas.
A draft version of the plan, posted Monday on the agency's Web site, includes a wide range of new tools designed to control burgeoning deer populations in Pennsylvania's most populous communities. Among them are more liberal hunting regulations, longer hunting seasons and non-traditional methods such as professional sharpshooters, deer feeding bans and deer-management training seminars for mayors, police chiefs and other local officials.
''It's no secret why there is great difficulty managing urban/suburban deer populations,'' said Jeannine Tardiff, a commission deer biologist and the plan's author. ''A deer population inaccessible to hunters can quickly exceed the tolerance level of those in the community. The safety issues can become serious, and property damage severe.
''We believe the…plan provides a starting point from which the Game Commission can develop and implement a program that will help hunters, landowners and municipal officials achieve mutually acceptable goals of increasing hunting opportunities and greater control of the deer population in highly developed areas of the state.''
Overabundant deer are a growing problem in many urban and suburban areas across Pennsylvania, including portions of the Lehigh Valley, Philadelphia suburbs and Poconos.
Large numbers of deer living in close proximity to large numbers of people has put Pennsylvania among the national leaders in the number of deer-related automobile accidents and new cases of Lyme disease, which is carried by deer ticks.
Last year, auto insurer State Farm released the results of a survey that ranked Pennsylvania No. 1 in the nation for deer-vehicle collisions. And statistics from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Pennsylvania indicate Pennsylvania has the second-highest Lyme disease infection rate in the nation.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

I was actually talking about the Dmap wishes for state forest lands.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

"And statistics from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Pennsylvania indicate Pennsylvania has the second-highest Lyme disease infection rate in the nation."

I for one believe this statement to be true.The proof is evident in the way it has affected the mental thinking ofGovernor Rendell's PGC Board of Commissioners.

RE: What the DCNR wants
 

So one of the symptoms of lyme is liberal left wing thinking.:D