RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

Quite obviously no, merely change the existing law from 16 to whatever age thesouce considers appropriate for repsonsible hunting with firearms.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

I was a NY State hunter safety instructor for many years. I have donated COUNTLESS hours of my time for the purpose of educating young people to be safe hunters. I have spent many additional hours teaching my daughter and 3 nephews (whose father doesn't hunt) as well. I strongly support wearing BO but don't think it should be a law. If you think I'm a "problem" you have some serious issues.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

simple fact is, it is a lot easier to see someone 200 yards away that has blaze orange on than it is if he has regular camo on. so say a guy is 200 yards out across a field standin next to a tree and has camo on - you are not going to be able to pick him out easily or at all. if he has blaze on, you can spot him relatively easily. so if that person is in your extended line of fire, things are much safer. I know, you need to know what is beyond your target, but you can't fault someone that can't see you.

What is the big deal about having to where a blaze orange hat or vest (it will cost you $15 for a vest at Cabelas). I'd much rather have someone see me easily than not. I don't buy the - "Big Brother" tellin me what to do -BS. Sometime the govt. actually is trying to help the public. Get over it, be safe, hunt hard.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

The issue for me is a larger one and quite probably a hunting forum just isn't the place to get into it in any detail. But fundamentally I don't belive itis our governments role to weigh in on such matters even if it's motive is altruistic. I'm a firm believer in "government governs best when it governs least" and although any single law like this may not be particularly harmful (not a "big deal" as you say) I view each new regulation as a growing cancer that ultimately will result in a Soviet type government regulated society. I believe what Ronald Regan said. "Government isn't the solution to our problems, government IS the problem".

BTW, I hope you realize that I strongly support the wearing of BO. I agree that it is safer, however I still oppose a law requiring it. Like I said before, just because something is a good idea, doesn't mean we need a law to enforce it.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

point taken

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

The big deal is simple, people are smart enough to decide whether they will be hunting in conditions where BO should be worn. Like I said I oppose this bill and if a BO was going to be implemented one way or the other, well I said what wording I would have to settle for.

I agree with Sylvan in the fact that we don't need someone else telling us something that is common sense, except Sylvan said it with some additions in a more fired up manner. I feel that people can make the decision if they are hunting in conditionsthat if you didn't wear BO you must have been brain dead.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

I think I misunderstood your earlier posts digj200, my mistake. Sorry about that!

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

That's alright, I told you I must not have been clear enough because I thought we had very similar views on the issue.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

I agree with wearing blaze orange. I wear a hat and vest untill I get to my treestand, then I take it off. I just really have a hard time with more laws made by people who don`t hunt. This might come out wrong but 22 fatel accidents in 10 yrs, that`s 2 per yr, that really doesn`t seem like a high number as far as the # of hunters in NY.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

Can't believe how short sighted some of you guys are. Requiring blaze orange is the most ridiculous idea I have ever heard. All it does is reinforce the shoot first identify later mentality. Nothing can replace the responsibility of each hunter to identify his target. Have any of you considered the fact that there are lots of other people out in the woods who are NOT hunting? Have you considered that alot of people don't hunt and don't own blaze orange clothing. Basically what you are saying is that its not safe for anyone to go out in the woodsanywhere hunters are. Or to get this straight, my wife can go out and walk down the same trail as me without hunter orange and be completely safe but if i walk out there with a gun in my hand then I may be shot? What you people are advocating is the outright ban of hunting since its obvious from your arguments that no one is safe in the woods if they don't wear hunter orange.The Peta supporter who is going out to protest your deer hunt ain't going to be wearing blaze orange. So the hunter will be safe because he has on blaze orange but the poor PETA supporter may get shot just for being in the woods? Thats right, go ahead and tell the world what bunch of reckless idiots we are and give them laws which prove it.This is not a hunter only issue and you really are scaring people.Maybe we should put a sign on public lands," enter at your own risk without hunter orange, moronic, gun carrying hunters may be present andmay shoot your ass if you aint wearing it. Apparently they seem to believe the woods belong to them alone."

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

Nicely put. I figured my your username that you would be pro BO laws. Quickly came to find out your not, something I like.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

I don't think the PETA supporter would get shot while being in the woods. I think I would purposely miss them by at least2 feet:D

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

Give them the hint to get the flock out of there. :D

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

So long as you understand your hypocrisy.

You are against adding laws, unless they are laws that you agree with.

A somewhat inconsistent viewpoint, in my opinion.

It seems better for society to add a law to prevent accidents rather than prosecute those accidents after they occur.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

all I can say is that I hope Gov. Pataki sticks to his answer from last year New York State has a higher Voluntary orange compliance than the states that require it . making this an unneccessary law

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

First of all I was being facetious. Secondly, if you had read and understoodmy posts you would realize that I am not against adding laws in general but rather against adding laws that regulate common sense, such as the BO or seat belt, etc. type laws. Thirdly, is anybody for adding laws they don't agree with or against laws they do agree with? By your logic, everybody must be a hypocrite. Come on, think!

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

The BO proposal has been revamped from what I understand from the earliest revisions. They addressed the requirement for all types of hunting, psi requirement, etc. I think it is more tolerable, but doesn't change the question of it being enacted.

Whether it needs passing is another story. I'm middle of the road. I can see both sides of the fence.

My hang up is having to have it on while in an elevated stand. But that is just my view.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

Phade,
Im not certain it should be a law either. Maybe, maybe not.
But what does an elevated stand have to do with it?
Where I hunt. and quite possible in some places in NY, the terraine is very wooded and very steep. The top of one hill to another may only be 100-200 yards away. In that terrain an elevated stand does not mean that you are above all shooting lanes. In fact your stand could be 100feet below me at times where I hunt

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

HI Danny,

Yes, I agree with that aspect. I've hunted places like that too.

My stance deals with the nature of the hunting from a stand. Studies show mixed results on the "visibilty" of BO from a deer's eye. Some say they can see it (not orange, but detect it via UV/Color variation), while others say they can't.

In a stand you aren't still hunting, pushing, etc. We're essentially still the large majority of the time, and we don't move location as in still hunting. We need to maintain our ability to be "invisible" as best as possible. The mixed results from studies, what other hunters have experienced, and my own experiences lead me to further confusion. I think I've been busted by Blaze orange before in the stand. But other times, it hasn't been a factor. I've had much more luck not wearing it while on stand in not being detected by deer. Of course the variables can't be controlled.

I'd like to get new study info from the so-called "new BO" that is less visible.

Safety-wise, I agree that BO makes sense. Ifit needs to be a law, not so sure.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

I don't think the problem is identifing your target as much as it would be what is past your target.

Don't tell me that after you spot a nice buck moving across the woods you scan everything in the background before you shoot. It doesn't happen. Can't happen unless that deer stays still for a good 10 minutes or so. Honestly think about it.

Now you add in the guy with the brown carharts or camo moving through the land he shouldn't be on. He sees you in your blaze orange and is trying to sneak around you. You will have a hard time seeing him if you see him at all! Finally (after a week of hunting NY) you see a deer, the other hunter just kicked him towards you. You shoot and unfortunately you miss and hit the other hunter in the distance who you didn't see because he's hiding in his camo.

Now you don't want blaze orange so I didn't see the other hunter and he got hit by my shot. But you want ME to go to jail?

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

.

Law or no, I doubt this guywill everbe wearing BO. Few criminals go out of their way to make it easier for you to spot them.
Check my earlier post - out of the hundreds of legal hunters I saw this year in gun season, EVERYONE of them was wearing some BO. And as I and others have pointed out and many ignore this point, NY states voluntary rate of compliance is higher than most states rate where mandatory.

With these 2 points in mind, I wish someone could tell me who a new law will effect? Not the tresspasser and not the overwhelming majority who choose commen sense. Who's left?

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

Bow - well said and truthful, that was sort of my original point

[quote]ORIGINAL: SteveBNy

like Bow says, maybe it will help "protect" law abiding hunters that may, inadvertantly shoot someone that isn't wearing BO- those that are beyond the target (not those mistaken for a deer - to me there is no excuse for that happeniong) and not easily visible without BO. Could protect them from frivaless law suits.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

touche...good point Steve.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

Anyone know the status of this bill?

Other than that I heard this bill was introduced, I haven't heard anything since.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

It was in yesturdays paper in the sporting goods page. Didn`t say it got any further.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

thanks. can't wait until this is finalized, so i know what to expect this year. the suspense is getting to me. with the different wording, it seems like there is confidence in this bill but in the past Pataki has vetoed all BO bills.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

The one in yesturdays paper limits theorange to deer and bear with shotgun or rifle only. not bow,turkey,small game or waterfowl. If I find the article online I`ll ppost it.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

Yeah, I know. The other ones included those and Pataki vetoed them. That is why I would like to know the status. I want to see what Pataki's reaction is to the slightly different wording.

I saw the wording of the bill and it said shotgun and rifle. Would a BP rifle fall into that? I would say yes because it says it in the name, but its not what you consider just a rifle that shoots cartridges.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

Found the link on line.

http://www.syracuse.com/search/index.ssf?/base/sports-0/1137231389228230.xml?syrspdout



If you mean BP as in muzzleloader they are not included in the rifle or shotgun

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

either way I don't care -

FH

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

I had a doe run under me in the tree stand this year she didn't know I was there, I wear wall orange camo coveralls and coat with a solid orange knit hat. I guess the only thing I would say in difference to the bill is, people should be able to make their own choices as with any law which restricts your right to govern your OWN safety as an adult they should not interfere.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

PLEASE READ: Here's a True story for you. I was 18yrs old, my first ever Southern Tier opening day of shotgun. My partners told me I could shoot any deer that came along. I'm sitting on a huge side hill above a logging trail. Below the logging trail was pretty thick with briars,and dropped off deeply just below the trail.It was a cold rainy day. But I was excited to see a deer. After several hrs of sitting I thought I heard a branch break. It got my attention. Suddenly I see some brown coming up through the briars. I adjust myself, and my gun into that direction. I was certain it was a deer coming up the hill to the log trail. I couldn't quite make it out yet. But I was pumped & excited. As it neared I brought my gun up, and got ready for a shot. The brown object came closer, and was only a few feet from the log trail. I was going to shoot soon as the deer got onto the log trail. As it neared I almost decided to shoot then out of excitement, but I held off. Suddenly the object seemed a little odd, and a man stands up as he got onto the log trail.This idiot was wearing full brown carharts, and he was crawling through the brush. I quickly lowered my gun, and yelled at him I ALMOST SHOT YOU!!
After that I was shaking like a leaf, I just nearly shot another hunter. I almost pulled that trigger. I was mad becasue this guy didn't have a stitch of orange on, and was wearing brown. I couldn't believe my 1st time out I almost killed a guy.
Now let me ask all of you, how many times have you come across hunters wearing brown, white, green, clothing. Not to mention todays camo patterns having dark brown colors in them. Advantage, Brown HD, Seclusion, Mossy Oak. Go ahead flip though a hunting catalog, and notice the brown in the very camo your wearing! Now picture yourself being that hunter walking the woods wearing it, perhaps stalking a deer, on a track, coming up a hill. Your concentrating on that animal for the kill. Perhaps another hunter in camo is sitting ahead of you. A young inexperienced kid, his first time in the woods!WILL HE PULL THAT TRIGGER?
Pass the law its only going to save lives. No deer is worth being shot for, or even put at that kind of risk. ;)

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

You were "certain it was a deer" and "nearly shot another hunter" even though you "couldn't quite make it out yet". You my friend are a dangerous individual and shouldn't be carying a firearm.ABSOLUTELY DO NOTpoint a firearm in the direction of anything much less something that is moving and presumably alive unless you know for surewhat it is. Any hunter safety course will even stress how important it is not to use a scope on a gun for the purpose of identifying your target. What you are telling us all is that even if a bo law passes somebody like you is apt to shoot somebody just out for a walk in the woods that isn't even hunting. Sad. I highly recommend you re-take the hunter safety course!

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

What Sylvan said!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

Everyone makes a mistake, you fortunately did not make the biggest. Rule number 1 BE SURE OF YOUR TARGET. This person wearing brown while not real smart should not be the cause of his death or injury. We as hunters have an obligation to ourselves as a group to follow the rules of hunting or the antis will win the fight. If every hunter followed the rules there would be NO NEED for Blaze orange gear.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

Common sense would help also.

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

Ya know I told you guys a story, hoping a certain point would come across your shallow minds. But its obvious to me too many on this forum look to criticize everyone's postings over trying to understand the point. So let me lay it out a little more clearer. If I had a crayon right now I'd use for you.
The whole friggen point was that this very situation can, and does occur in our deer woods. For some reason several of you are way too concerned about whether a deer can see orange over your very own safety. Yes the guy in Brown was kinda dumb for wearing brown carharts. But I wonder when he put those on if his same thoughts were much like many here. I'm not wearing that darn orange, becasue deer can see me, or Its my right not to wear orange I can wear whatever I dam well please.
Some others even want to go as far as to bring the anti's & PETA into this Bill. Well let me see, I'm sure every anti hunter reading this post is thinking these fools are actually more concerned about deer seeing them over their own safety. Or heywhat about everytime a hunter accident occurs to someone wearing camoflage it feeds their fire. Regardless I could careless what the Anti's think, becasue a preacher & a great town citizen could decide to pick up his gun, and go out hunting 1 day out of the year, and they'd label him a villian for doing it.
The whole point of this is about the safety of you, me, and every hunter out in the darn woods. Some mention taking off their camo in treestands, or changing the bill so don't have to wear it 10-20ft up. Does that take you out of every line of fire in the woods? Ever heard of a ricochet?? How many times have you parked your butt, and looked around at daylight to count the orange for hunters around you? You might even think hey I counted this many hunters, I saw them all in orange. But do you actually know how many were in the woods all together, counting the camo'd guys? Can everyone here say that there isn't a camo'd hunter behind that bush, tree top 100yards away? Have any of you ever decided to still hunt, stalk, and walked upon a guy in full camo nestled down in a small hollow, or behind a tree stump? Does everyone here honestly know what kind of hunters are in your area.A guy whose suppose to wear glasses, but takes them off becasue they fog up while wearing his mask so he uses his scope, the father taking his son into the woods for the first time. Or the 18yr old hunter in the story above, just looking to bring up his gun, and shoot that brown moving object becasue he knows its a deer. DO YOU KNOW I WON"T BE IN YOUR WOODS!!!!!!!!!!

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

Ok I made my point in the previous post. But honestly I feel too many of you guys are missing the point this bill is strictly about safety, andfor our own good. Too many excuses are being made here about why they shouldn't have to wear a little orange. I mean come on give me a break alreadly. Not 1 person here can't say they hate seeing orange on other hunters while hunting, or that their choice to wear camo doesn't place themselves at a higher risk. Ya gotta be totally ignorant if you don't!
Oh, and just to set your minds at ease, and maybe put your foot in your mouths. That 18yr old hunter is now 41yrs old. He had very minimal hunter safety 23yrs ago. That day taught me a very valuable lesson, and I remember it like it was yesterday. Nowadays I work in law enforcement, and train with weapons several times a year. Thats why I mentioned being in the line of fire. If your in the direction of a gunshot, whether on the ground, or 20 ft up in a tree. Your in the line of fire, and trust me Ricochets happen. I've seen plenty of them on the firing range.
So please guys use your heads here. ThisBill is directed towards safety its a win win for all of us. No one in law enforcement likes to notify family members of a hunting accident or death. Plus noone that causes the accident wants to be in those shoes. The charges, lawsuits, and living out a life knowing you shot someone is no picinic. Pass the law, and be safer. The orange won't kill ya!!!!!!!!!!!

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

What stood out in your story far more than anything else had NOTHING to do with blaze orange. It was thatYOU VIOLATED AFUNDAMENTAL RULE OF FIREARM SAFETY.Did you think we wouldn't notice or were you just oblivious? Now you have the audacity to call us shallow minded! You sound like a 10 year old who has just been scolded and then resorts to name calling.

So now we are ignorant if we don't see it your way? The point that seems to illude you is that no one is arguing that blaze orange isn't a good idea. The question is should it be law. I for one am simply tired of the self righteous nanny state attitude that people like you spew out. We can't have a system that passes a law to enforce every good common sense idea. It has to stop. As far as I know, there is no law prohibiting the wearing of blaze orange so if you want to wear it then wear it. Set an example and encourage others to wear it. That's how people in a free society should do things. Not pass laws regulating every little aspect of our life. Can you imagine the reaction of the founders if they were told that one day the government would pass laws regulating what someone must wear when they go hunting?

Look, literally hundreds of thousands of hunters wear bo. I didn't see a hunter this year who wasn't wearing it. And this all came about without any law requireing it. How come? Do you think just maybe, the people of NY state are smart enough to make their own decision regarding this matter?

RE: NY Blaze Orange Bill
 

you spoke of ricohet (sp ?) anyway you could be in an orange spotlight and have no control as to where that bullet wil go !no matter what your story says YOU still missed the point BE ABSOLUTELY SURE OF YOUR TARGET BEFORE YOU RAISE YOUR GUN yes everybody makes mistakes and I am glad you didn't make a bigger mistake
I also took hunter safety many years ago but they did teach be sure of your target in fact that was drilled into my head long before I ever took hunter safety