Go Back  HuntingNet.com Forums > Firearms Forum > Guns
Which gun and for bear hunting? >

Which gun and for bear hunting?

Guns Like firearms themselves, there's a wide variety of opinions on what's the best gun.

Which gun and for bear hunting?

Old 02-19-2015, 07:57 AM
  #11  
Typical Buck
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 749
Default

I would go with the 416 ruger. Something like this
http://ruger.com/products/guideGun/s...ets/47130.html
Bbj270 is offline  
Old 02-19-2015, 08:21 AM
  #12  
Giant Nontypical
 
Sheridan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location:
Posts: 5,130
Default

For me it's my Browning X-Bolt Stainless Stalker in .338 WM.

Ammo available anywhere there are brownie's !!!
Sheridan is offline  
Old 02-19-2015, 08:57 PM
  #13  
Spike
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 5
Default

Will the .416 Ruger be as powerful as a .408 cheytac?
Phil80 is offline  
Old 02-20-2015, 08:38 AM
  #14  
Typical Buck
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 749
Default

The .408 cheytac has 8,295 ft-lbf and 3,500 fps with a 305 gr bullet. The 416 ruger is 5,545 ft-lbf and 2,500 fps with a 400 gr bullet. The ruger will be a cheaper rifle and ammo and components are easier to get and cheaper, and the rifle will weighs less. If you don't only ever rifle I would consider a 375 H&H as ammo and components are ever where brown bears are. My source is from cartridges of the world 13th edition.
Bbj270 is offline  
Old 02-20-2015, 09:02 AM
  #15  
Nontypical Buck
 
Big Uncle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,780
Default

Consider a 375 Ruger. I believe that it is very popular with guides in brown bear country.

I have both a 375 H&H and a 375 Ruger, and if I could choose only one of them it would be the Ruger.

The 416 is a heavy hitter but the 375 is much more versatile. There is good reason that the 375 is legal for elephant and cape buffalo. It works.
Big Uncle is offline  
Old 02-20-2015, 10:52 AM
  #16  
Nontypical Buck
 
Nomercy448's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,898
Default

Originally Posted by Phil80
Will the .416 Ruger be as powerful as a .408 cheytac?
Think about it this way - a Peterbuilt 579 semi-tractor is more powerful than a Ford F-150 pick-up truck, but it sure doesn't make sense to commute in a semi. A semi-tractor is designed for one purpose, the pick-up truck is designed for another. A GE Evolution Locomotive Engine is even more powerful, but it's pretty hard to park a train engine in my garage.

Similarly, the CheyTac Intervention M200 in 408Cheytac, like the Peterbuilt Semi, simply isn't a hunting rifle. It would be a novelty at best to carry such a rifle for hunting, even of the largest game.

So is the 408CT more powerful than a 416Ruger? Sure. So is a 76mm cannon. Does that make it AT ALL suitable for hunting? Nope - purely a dumb idea.

Now, one other thing that's absolutely worth pointing out - the Chey Tac Intervention weighs over 20lbs empty, a proper hunting rifle in 416 Ruger, Rigby, Remington, or Weatherby will tip the scales around 10lbs scoped and loaded. What that means - even though the .408Cheytac is considerably more powerful, it actually recoils considerably less than the 416's. The recoil energy of the 416 is ~30% greater than that of the 408CheyTac.

I've been very curiously watching this thread, as it's absurdity makes me question whether Phil is trolling or serious. No one that has "a lot of experience deer hunting" would ever consider a 408 CheyTac as a hunting rifle.

I personally would only recommend the 416 Ruger if you're wanting it in a standard long action rifle and don't want a Magnum length action (which if you're actually considering a 408Cheytac, you're obviously not shy to overly-long rifle actions). The staying power of the 416Ruger is debatable, and frankly, the ammunition sources are few and far between. While more common than a 408 Cheytac, the 416Ruger is far less common than many other suitable bear cartridges. The 338win mag, or 375H&H are easily found at most gun shops, and the other 416's like the Rigby or Remington are typically easier to find than the Ruger. I love Ruger rifles and love Ruger cartridges, but if you're not willing to buy ALL OF THE BRASS YOU'LL EVER NEED right now while it's semi-available, then possibly end up reloading it for the rest of your life, or not willing to buy a rifle that will be all but worthless after the .416 Ruger goes the way of the do-do bird, then I'd say you're better served to buy a CZ550 in 416Rigby or 375H&H than the Ruger Guide Gun in .416 Ruger.
Nomercy448 is offline  
Old 02-20-2015, 11:13 AM
  #17  
Nontypical Buck
 
Big Uncle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,780
Default

Originally Posted by Nomercy448

I personally would only recommend the 416 Ruger if you're wanting it in a standard long action rifle and don't want a Magnum length action (which if you're actually considering a 408Cheytac, you're obviously not shy to overly-long rifle actions). The staying power of the 416Ruger is debatable, and frankly, the ammunition sources are few and far between. While more common than a 408 Cheytac, the 416Ruger is far less common than many other suitable bear cartridges. The 338win mag, or 375H&H are easily found at most gun shops, and the other 416's like the Rigby or Remington are typically easier to find than the Ruger. I love Ruger rifles and love Ruger cartridges, but if you're not willing to buy ALL OF THE BRASS YOU'LL EVER NEED right now while it's semi-available, then possibly end up reloading it for the rest of your life, or not willing to buy a rifle that will be all but worthless after the .416 Ruger goes the way of the do-do bird, then I'd say you're better served to buy a CZ550 in 416Rigby or 375H&H than the Ruger Guide Gun in .416 Ruger.
Actually the .416 Ruger is becoming fairly popular with the Africa hunting crowd, as is the .375 Ruger. Some guys that live in South Africa have told me that ammunition for the .375 Ruger is sometimes easier to get than the good old H&H. Both Ruger cartridges share the same basic case. I believe they are here to stay.

It is always good advice to buy brass for any cartridge.

The CZ550 has a good many fans and it is a good solid action, but it has it faults also. A good many need a trip to the gunsmith, but after that they turn into very good rifles. If I were looking for a magnum length action for a .416 Remington or a .375 H&H I would buy a Winchester.
Big Uncle is offline  
Old 02-20-2015, 12:17 PM
  #18  
Nontypical Buck
 
Nomercy448's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,898
Default

Originally Posted by Big Uncle
Actually the .416 Ruger is becoming fairly popular with the Africa hunting crowd, as is the .375 Ruger. Some guys that live in South Africa have told me that ammunition for the .375 Ruger is sometimes easier to get than the good old H&H. Both Ruger cartridges share the same basic case. I believe they are here to stay.

It is always good advice to buy brass for any cartridge.

The CZ550 has a good many fans and it is a good solid action, but it has it faults also. A good many need a trip to the gunsmith, but after that they turn into very good rifles. If I were looking for a magnum length action for a .416 Remington or a .375 H&H I would buy a Winchester.
I'm actually a fan of the 416 Ruger, but I'd stand by what I said there. The two Ruger Safari magnums are gaining a lot of ground in the few years they've been around, but in the grand scheme of things, the jury is still out at best. Take its predecessor, the .416 Remington Mag, as an example - it took around 20yrs before the Rem Mag really got on its feet and carved out its niche over the 416 Rigby, and there was more than just ONE manufacturer making rifles and more than just ONE manufacturer making brass and factory loads for it over that time. I REALLY hope the Ruger Safari Mags stick around, but if a person isn't a rifle collector (and this OP obviously is not) then I think it's a bit irresponsible to not mention the risk involved with buying one. It's REALLY easy for what happened to Ruger's OTHER proprietary cartridges to happen to the Safari Mag's too - the .480Ruger, 327Fed, .300RCM, 338RCM, etc... Nobody is regularly making firearms for them, nobody is regularly making brass, and the options are incredibly slim. I didn't say NOT to buy one, but rather there are safer bets out there for a kid what is green enough to question using a Cheytac rifle on bear...

As for the CZ vs. the Win 70, after owning both - including magnum length and "safari cartridges," I'd rather spend my money at the smith (or take the time to alter it myself, having done so on a few of them) and own a CZ than buy a Win 70. They make both because different guys will buy one or the other, but my recommendation is the CZ. Find me an unfired Pre-64 M70, maybe we'll have a different conversation, but as far as what's on a shelf today at the store, I'll take the CZ every day and twice on Sunday before I spend money on the Winchester.
Nomercy448 is offline  
Old 02-20-2015, 01:04 PM
  #19  
Nontypical Buck
 
Big Uncle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,780
Default

Originally Posted by Nomercy448
As for the CZ vs. the Win 70, after owning both - including magnum length and "safari cartridges," I'd rather spend my money at the smith (or take the time to alter it myself, having done so on a few of them) and own a CZ than buy a Win 70. They make both because different guys will buy one or the other, but my recommendation is the CZ. Find me an unfired Pre-64 M70, maybe we'll have a different conversation, but as far as what's on a shelf today at the store, I'll take the CZ every day and twice on Sunday before I spend money on the Winchester.
I still think the .375 Ruger is a logical choice. It is being chambered by other manufacturers than Ruger and is becoming increasingly popular where dangerous game is hunted. Any .416 is a specialty rifle.

Your 550 experience is totally different than mine. I was unlucky enough to get one with the standard backward safety and otherwise all it needed was a new trigger, action smoothing and correction of it's feeding problems. It turned out to be a good solid rifle but I still did not like the way it handled. It belongs to someone else now.

I would buy a 550 again if I was looking for a .416 Rigby or one of the other similar cartridges that benefit from a very large action and a heavy rifle. It is a good solid action.

In my view the new production Model 70 is a better rifle than any other Model 70 that I have seen - including the "pre-64".

To each their own. It is what makes horse races.

Last edited by Big Uncle; 02-20-2015 at 01:11 PM.
Big Uncle is offline  
Old 02-20-2015, 01:15 PM
  #20  
Typical Buck
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 749
Default

The man I know that killed the brown bear with his 375 H&H, also used it in Africa and killed about seven different species with it. it's and all weather winchester model 70. He had it for about 10 years or so. also has a cz 550 in 416 rigby he used to take a cape buffalo. He likes his winchester I think a little better then the cz mainly because he used it more. Plus he likes the model 70 in general.
Bbj270 is offline  

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.