Surprised at lack of .308 prominence ...
 

...for whitetail hunters in the Southeast U.S. Growing up, all I ever heard about from the .30 caliber family was the .30-30, and of course the 30-06 was king. I've been out of hunting for years, but just moved to Tallahassee, FL and am excited to be getting back into it.

My first recent purchase was a 300WSM. It looked good on paper. I wanted the elusive single rifle solution in the event that I did that once in a lifetime Moose/Grizzy/Leviathan/Godzilla hunt. In a fit of sanity, I finally realized it would be better to buy a rifle that was perfect 99% of the time than one that was perfect 1% of the time.

So I begin researching and come to the following conclusions based on a couple of weeks worth of Googling and getting to know Mr. Chuck Hawks on a very personal level. For Southeastern whitetail, it's mostly going to be short to mid-range shots in brushy to wooded areas. A premium rests on stopping power (big bullet), maneuverability (short action), accuracy/consistency (bolt), and comfort/familiarity (mild recoil), with a secondary interest in lethality at a distance, a wide range of appropriate grain weights, and inexpensive/widely available ammo...

Ladies and gentlemen, the .308 Win.

Maybe I've just been out of hunting too long. But I still hear alot about 270s, 7MM, 30-06, etc down here in the south. Not too many singing the praises of this - in theory - perfectly suited firearm. Any insights?

Very similar ballistics to the 30-06 in a shorter length action!

I hunt northland central fl and I'm shooting a browning blr .30& win. With the 168 gr Winchester ballistic tips it is just an awesome rifle!

Good possibility not everyone wants to shoot the same thing.

My all time favorite caliber is the .308 Winchester!

I live in south Mississippi and rarely do I come across a hunter that uses a 308, plenty of 06s, 270s and 7 mags. I personally believe it is purely a lack of knowledge. I have a friend that bought his son a 308 and to this day says he should have bought an 06. Doesn't matter that the 308 is within a 100' per second of the 06. Doesn't matter that every time his son has put the bullet where it was supposed to be he has recovered the animal. He still feels the 308 isn't enough gun for our 100 lb whitetails.

The .308 is probably the Rodney Dangerfield of cartridges. It's close enough to the .30-06 in most applications that people simply opt for the "more must be better" track. If they're inclined to consider a short-action rifle, they're probably more inclined to lean toward the WSMs than to a short-action standard.

There's nothing wrong with the .308. Everything the .30-06 can do well, it will also do well.

I just recently bought a Savage Model 11 Light Weight Hunter in 308, I love it! It only weighs 5.5lbs and has a 20" barrel. It is perfect for carrying in thick timber and capable of taking anything. It is also very accurate.

I have to agree I hear more of the 7mm-08 than I do about the tried and true .308. Don't get me wrong the 7mm-08 is a fine cartridge (necked down .308) but if I were to go and buy a short action deer rifle it would be a .308. People today think they need 270's, 06's, and don't get me started on all the magnums. Most people just don't know any better. I have gotten into several heated discussions with folks at the gun club about the difference between the .308 and 30-06....my argument has always been 100 fps with most loads, longer bolt throw with the longer action makes a 2nd shot a fraction of a second slower and a heavier rifle to boot. The .308 is very under rated unfortunitly. I go to deer rifle is a Ruger M77 7x57 aka 7mm Mauser. I went with it just because I can hand load it just as hot as the 7mm-08 and most rednecks around here have never heard of it.

I do not mean at all to disparage the .308. There's lots of room for many cartridges and many rifles, in my estimation. If you can't kill a whitetail deer with a .243 (or a 6 mm Remington, a .240 Weatherby mag, a .257 Roberts, a .25-06, a .270, a .280, etc) the problem is more with the shooter than the cartridge, in my estimation.

But since you bring up the .308, I'll discuss that. You mentioned the "short action" advantage of the .308. I have a .243, which I imagine is a short action, and I have a .25-06, and a .30-06 -- the two xx-06 cartridges being long action. I don't know that I notice a difference between these two actions. I suppose I have to work the bolt a bit further for the xx-06s, but how much length difference is there? 1/4"? 3/8"? 1/2"? Seriously, I don't know that I can tell the difference, especially if I'm working the bolt for a quick follow-up shot on a game animal in the woods. Whatever difference short action versus long action makes, I don't see that it is a significant difference. Maybe others feel differently.

If you take the short action out of the comparison, I don't see any parameter on which the .308 is superior and others where the .30-06 is superior. The selection of rifles chambered in .30-06 may be more broad versus those chambered in .308. The availability of rifle ammunition in .30-06 may be better than in .308.

Again, not taking anything away from the .308. But your theme seemed to be why don't more people in your region of the country go with the .308 rather than the .30-06. For the reasons above, I don't see why they would be motivated to prefer the .308 over the .30-06.

I hunted exclusively with a .308 for years (Savage 99) and still use it from time to time. I have what is known as a shopping problem when it comes to rifles (or so my wife says) so I have used a variety of calibers over the years, my current go-to rifle for deer is my 270 WSM (I love it!)...that being said, I own 5 .308's (Just bought a Win Model 88 in .308 from a desperate seller for $285...and it is a 1956...hehe) if I had to sell everything and could only keep one rifle? It would be one of the 308's that would remain. The .308 has many advantages over the (puke)'06...accuracy, weight, short action, recoil...to name a few.

I loved the 06... love my 270..... my 308 is my new love.That cartrige will do everything I need and for my needs will probly do it better than the 270 or the 06...That said I hunted with 760 pump 06 and model 700 in 06 for better than 20 years . Got a smoking deal on a 270 winchester barrel for my pro hunter so I messed around with it .... great gun if you hunt open grounds ... big farm fields power lines or gas lines.... not so good in brush... but the 308 does it all with less recoil than the 06 and bullets dont decinigrate on bone or from hitting a twig like the 270.... yea I know its the bullet.....not having that conversation ..I honestly like the 308 for my type of hunting.300 mags ... why????? 270 short mag why again ???? why spend twice the money for ammo .Honestly 06 surplus ammo is way harder to find than 308 these days. Short action verses long on a deer rifle ... not even a concern for deer hunting ... maybe if i was hunting lions in africa ....big tuskers or black death...

I can't tell the difference in recoil between shooting my .25-06 and my .30-06, particularly in the field, shooting at a game animal, probably with several layers of garments on even in Oklahoma in November deer season. Weight difference? How much weight are we talking about? Could a hunter tell the difference in the weight? Accuracy? Could the average or even the 90th percentile hunter shoot well enough in the field to take advantage of the greater accuracy said to be inherent in the .308?

Again, I've got no objection to a kalaidescope of cartridges. I've got no objection to anyone liking the .308. My comments are all directed to the question ".308 is clearly superior so why aren't there more .308s in the field than .30-06s?" I see no distinguishing superiority of the .308 -- meaning a difference a real-world hunter can tell in the field (thought experiment -- have a blind folder hunter carry two rifles made by the same manufacturer, one chambered in .308, one chambered in .30-06 -- and see if they can distinguish the two rifles based on weight or recoil). My point is that if a hunter is making a choice between two rifles -- one a .308 and the other the .30-06 -- for hunting whitetail deer in the Southeast, I see no solid case for definitely preferring the .308 over the .30-06. Thus, by my way of thinking, it is not at all surprising that there are not more .308s than .30-06s used in the southeast. Your .308 has a 1/4" less distance to jerk the bolt? My .30-06 has more widely available ammunition and less expensive for same quality ammunition, my .30-06 is available in more rifle models.

I don't have a big issue with folks liking the .308, I just don't see why it is a surprise to find the .30-06 more widely used than the .308.

Is surplus ammo consistent and accurate? I don't know, I've never used it. Does it come in appropriate hunting bullets?

Where can one purchase said ammo for a '06 that is both higher quality and cheaper than that for a 308? I'd like to see proof of that...never seen '06 ammo anywhere cheaper than that for a 308. Also, I reload, so I have every option available to my 308, and then some, than you can buy for your '06.

Answer...yes, given both rifles in the same make/model...I could easily tell you the difference based on recoil and bold movement. My brother has a '06 in a Rem 700 BDL...I have Rem 700 BDL's in 308, 270 and 7mm...the '06 and 7mm recoil a great deal more than the 308 and 270...enough so they are uncomfortable to shoot more than a couple times.

From the peope I have talked to when I was looking to get a .308 I was told they are better for killing people. Which is why all snipers use them.

I can easily tell a very distinguishable difference in the amount of recoil from my 06 compared to my 308. As far as ammo the prices are really close. I got a box of corelokts yesterday for $17 in 06 which is a great deal. But at the same time, the 308 box was the same price. I have never seen 06 ammo cheaper than 308.

I think I'd reconsider the credibility of your sources.

The reason so many snipers use a .308 (7.62x51) is because it's a standard NATO chambering.

The reason so many trunk monkeys use a .308 (M240) is because a TOW or 25mm are often overkill when hunting Toyota Prado SUVs in downtown Baghdad.

M240 is basically just a newer version of the old M60 right? didnt know they shot .308s. SAWs(249s) shoot basically .223 rounds though dont they?

As was the 30-06(7.62x57) till NATO adopted the 308 for lighter weight of ammo in bulk. Was all they had in 'Nam. Havent heard the trunk monkey tag in a minute!!!!

Yes Cypress, the M60 uses 308 and 249 uses 223 ammo.
And the 308 does show a more inheritable accuracy over the 30-06 for the type of work it is fashioned for. Thats why we and other Law Enforcement agencies use/used the 308 over the '06, for which we are now many going to the 338 Lapua.

While there are certainly a lot of great cartridges out there for hunting medium game, my personal preference is and has been for about 2 decades the 308 Win. I have and still do hunt with a myriad of others from time to time ... from 6.5x55 Se to 444 Marlin.

The 308 Win. coupled with a quality 165 gr. bullet, the round is bad medicine on deer out a lot farther I can proficiently hit inside a 10" circle. And I consider my self a decent shooter.

Where I hunt, from tree stands and blinds, here in the SE USA my typical shot seldom exceeds 150 yards, and more often than not is inside 100 yards. About any decent center fire cartridge will kill deer at these distances. But I usually tote my 308 Win.

No doubt about it, the most popular 30 cal. cartridge down this way is still the 30.06 Spr. I don;t see that changing anytime soon !!! I have no arguement with that at all. Great and very versitile cartridge. In fact a Browning BBR in 30.06 Spr. was for years my favorite hunting rifle.

As far as short vs. long action? About the only advange of the short action that I think comes into play is a tad less weight and shorter overall length because the receiver can be shorter.

The 30-06 is actually 7.62x63.

love my .308 Browning A-Bolt ! Won't hunt with anything else !

Thanks for all the great replies. Didn't intend for it to turn into an 06 vs. 308 thread. I see some advantages for the 06 in different environments (longer action permits greater range of grains, some additional oomph, etc). But for the specific application of whitetail in the SE, I think it's difficult to argue against .308 as the total package.

I will also add that I don't think the weight is the primary advantage of short actions when it comes to brush hunting. It's the maneuverability coupled with the ability to chamber an additional round in a bolt action without taking your eye away from the scope.

I wonder if magnum-itus bubble will ever burst and change directions or if it's a right of passage amongst all young/new hunters?

that's like sure a .300win.mag is a better elk/deer rifle, but when 99% of your hunting will be small eastern deer, a .270 is probably a better choice.

just get 2 rifles ;)

I do want a .300wsm, as well as a .308 ;)

Do you drive a Model T to work? Good enough is one thing, but better is better. To each their own. There's nothing wrong with a .308, and a lot of things right about it, but it's far from my first choice as a hunting rifle.

Yes it is. Been deer hunting all week dawn till dark and should have been in bed and not on the computer!!! Thanks.

While I don't have one.... the .308 is a great all around cartridge, and certainly arguments can be made it is one of the best ever. It can do 99% of anything most folks would use it for. I think the reason its not as popular is because of all the other options out there, especially with so many magnums these days. Too many folks think you need the most power you can get, or you cant possibly kill anything. I've personally seen a shift away from magnums with all the guys I know, they are now shooting 7mm-08, .243, .308, etc.

What goes around...
 

comes around. And people have been rediscovering the .308 and 30/06 and 7mm Mauser and ...

The U.S. Army was using the 30/06 one hundred years ago, and the .308 in military form some fifty years ago. And they remember the 7mm Mauser carried by their Spanish adversaries, nearly 115 years ago, in the Spanish-American War.

Some things do get lost over the years. Some people don't quite live that long.

Good cartridge!
 

I don't think people will ever agree on the best cartridge. Nature of the beast, I guess. I have a .308 and an /06. Love 'em both, though my yougest son has latched onto the .308. It has an 18.5" barrel, while my /06 has a 24". The way I can load the /06, there is 400 fps difference in the velocity with most bullets. All it seems to mean for woods hunting here in PA is I have to use heavier bullets in the /06 than the bullets that will perform well in the .308. If a person does more field hunting and taking shots over 200 yards, then maybe the .270s and 7 mags have a bit of an edge. Can't see it for shots up to 150 or so.

thats a handy little .308. i would love to have a gun that small for PA hunting when most of my shots are under 100 yards with a .270 and 22" barrel. Do you lose the long range potential a .308 would have with such a short barrel? i guess it also depends on twist rate and bullet weight.

I have a 308 and probably will always have one. They are a great round and will take care of any white tail on the planet plus a bunch more. Lately I've become found of 338 fed and 358 win both use the 308 parent case.

It is a Mohawk 600, basically an older version of the Remington Model 7, but with a heavier barrel. I had a gunsmith replace the bolt handle with a 700 bolt handle. Gives up a little speed due to the barrel. Gets about .300 Savage ballistics. The first buck I shot with that gun was back in 1983. Finished making that stock in spring 2011 though.

I have a 300 wsm and have been thinking of selling it for a 308

Almost everyone I know who hunts in the mountains (George Washington Nat'l Forest) of Virginia carries a .308 or an old .30-30 lever action.

The woods are thick and the hike is a long climb to get to where the big ones are. No need for a wicked something-something Magnum that will shoot 350 yards easily.

The .308 is an excellent round and has been used by military snipers, LEO's, and everyone else in between. I won't part with my Savage .308 for anything! :)

My BIL, nephew, and niece in Arkansas all use .308 rifles (Rem 742 and BLRs). I'm the odd man out, opting for a 30-06, 30-30, or 270.

The .308 and the 30.06 are close enough ballistically so as not to really mean anything.
The shorter case on the .308 probably makes it better for semi-autos and may make for
a slightly stiffer bolt action that as a result might be a bit more accurate. Not enough to matter unless you're a competition shooter.
So, the choice between the two cooks down to the .308's rifling doing better with lighter bullets like the 150 grain, and the 165 grain being the heaviest bullet the.308 likes. The 30.06 does better with a 165 grain and handles a 180 grain bullet well. So, if you're going to choose one over the other then application is probably the only real way to do it. The .308 doing better with lighter bullets like the 150 grain gives it the nod as a deer rifle, and if you're going after big northern moose, or maybe one of the big bears, the 30.06 with 180 grain TTSX bullets has the edge. For the US and southern Canada, for deer, elk, and smaller moose, the .308 with a quality 150 grain bullet and lower recoil than the 30.06 is probably the best choice. In northern Canada or Alaska, for big moose and big bears, I'm thinking the 30.06 with 180 grain TTSX ammo would be a good choice.

Here's a slant from someone who had a .308 as his first rifle, but sold it for a 30-06. It was a Remington 788 that shot very well, but was built for a right-hander and I shoot lefty.

I only went with the 30-06 because there are more varieties of cartridges available. I don't handload. That said, I only hunt deer, with the exception of one bear hunt and always with basic factory ammo that you can find at a chain store.

FWIW, all the various distinctions on short action, ammo availability, velocity, or whatever have meant absolutely zilch as far as practical purposes. In all cases, I ended up with a dead deer and there'd have been no difference with either caliber.

It was a little cheaper to shoot the .308 because there were/are some FMJ cartridges made for it. Union Metallic and Herters, for example.

If all you're doing is hunting deer, a .270 Win or something in the same ballpark is
tough to beat! Ammo for it is everywhere, and with 130 grain Nosler Accubonds you'll have a low recoil, flat shooting deer rifle with bullets that expand reliably at any distance. If you're hunting in thick woods in the mountains, it's tough to beat a light lever action. Like ButchA mentions, a Savage .308 would be a good choice. If you're wanting one rifle for open country and the wooded mountains, get a light bolt action that some folks call "mountain rifles". In .260, .270, .280, or 7mm-08, they'll have light recoil, be lightweight for long hikes, and be equally at home in the woods or long shots in open country.

I bought a Thompson Center Venture in the 308 caliber and it is the best gun I've ever owned. It was affordable and as advertised. I took the gun out of the box and at 100 yards, was shooting touching shot groups. I also own a Browning 7mm mag and although it's a very nice gun, it is now sitting in my gun safe collecting dust. I've had the TC for 3 years and have shot a couple nice bucks with it and 1 of them was at 225 yards. As long as you site the gun in for that distance, it has the knock down power for a 200 lbs deer. It hits exactly where I aim every time.