did I go about this correctly
02-27-2011, 02:46 PM
#21
Giant Nontypical
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,867
I see a issue wiht drinking and carrying the same as driving. Lets say you go to the bar with your buddy or a strip club and I will use a personal experience for this one. In nov I went to indy and hit a local strip club by my self, I got a bud light when I went in, and did not drink a second, I was there a good two hours and drove 2 hours home, in the middle of the night, the bartender asked if I wanted another, I said no I had to drive, she said don't hear that much. This is why I have a good clean driving record. I think if I was carrying and went out side and got robbed, happens at this club and shot someone it would not be good to have alcohol in my system. Not so much as I was carrying but I had shot someone and the judge and or lawyers would say I am impaired and I feel I could be looking down the barrel of a manslaughter charge.
02-27-2011, 03:12 PM
#22
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Huntin' In Colorado
Posts: 2,910
Simply carrying a firearm on your person for self defense while intoxicated is perfectly legal.
It is not legal to actually have in your hand a loaded firearm or to actually discharge a firearm while intoxicated unless you are justified in defense of yourself or another person..... and then you have to have a .10 BAC or higher to be legally intoxicated to the extent that your normal faculties were impaired. Well over the legal limit for driving a vehicle.
It is not legal to actually have in your hand a loaded firearm or to actually discharge a firearm while intoxicated unless you are justified in defense of yourself or another person..... and then you have to have a .10 BAC or higher to be legally intoxicated to the extent that your normal faculties were impaired. Well over the legal limit for driving a vehicle.
02-27-2011, 03:15 PM
#23
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,679
In your scenario you would have been carrying inside a bar and a "place of nuisance" (as defined by Florida statutes) by being in a strip club, and you would have been breaking the law to begin with and would be subject to arrest long before you shot someone.
Second, regardless of how you may feel about it, in Florida you still have the right to defend your life with lethal force even when you have had a few beers or glasses of wine at a restaurant while you were out on "date night" with your wife.
How am I reading it wrong? It's right there in black and white. It can't get any more easy to understand. And no, I hardly drink at all anyway. But if I want to have a beer when my wife and I go out to dinner it's nice to know I am not going to be breaking any laws by being armed.
If it's in a holster it is not in your hand. If it is in a holster you are not using it as defined by the statute. And you still have the right to use it in lawful self defense.
I also posted the requirements for being intoxicated to the extent that normal faculties are impaired and you are not legally considered inpaired until your BAC is .10 or higher.
Any ways, It's right there in black and white. You can interpret it how you wish.
Whoever shall erect, establish, continue, or maintain, own or lease any building, booth, tent or place which tends to annoy the community or injure the health of the community, or become manifestly injurious to the morals or manners of the people as described in s. 823.01, or any house or place of prostitution, assignation, lewdness or place or building where games of chance are engaged in violation of law or any place where any law of the state is violated, shall be deemed guilty of maintaining a nuisance, and the building, erection, place, tent or booth and the furniture, fixtures, and contents are declared a nuisance.
I'm not trying to start an argument Bigbulls but I think you are not reading it properly. I hope you are not practicing what you think you are reading. If so, I hope you never have to use your firearm while you are intoxicated. I think you would be in more of a picle than you think but I have been wrong before and I'll be wrong again. LOL
790.151Using a firearm while under the influence of alcoholic beverages, chemical substances, or controlled substances; penalties.—
(1)As used in ss. 790.151-790.157, to “use a firearm” means to discharge a firearm or to have a firearm readily accessible for immediate discharge.
(2)For the purposes of this section, “readily accessible for immediate discharge” means loaded and in a person’s hand.
(3)It is unlawful and punishable as provided in subsection (4) for any person who is under the influence of alcoholic beverages, any chemical substance set forth in s. 877.111, or any substance controlled under chapter 893, when affected to the extent that his or her normal faculties are impaired, to use a firearm in this state.
(4)Any person who violates subsection (3) commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.
(5)This section does not apply to persons exercising lawful self-defense or defense of one’s property.
(1)As used in ss. 790.151-790.157, to “use a firearm” means to discharge a firearm or to have a firearm readily accessible for immediate discharge.
(2)For the purposes of this section, “readily accessible for immediate discharge” means loaded and in a person’s hand.
(3)It is unlawful and punishable as provided in subsection (4) for any person who is under the influence of alcoholic beverages, any chemical substance set forth in s. 877.111, or any substance controlled under chapter 893, when affected to the extent that his or her normal faculties are impaired, to use a firearm in this state.
(4)Any person who violates subsection (3) commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.
(5)This section does not apply to persons exercising lawful self-defense or defense of one’s property.
I also posted the requirements for being intoxicated to the extent that normal faculties are impaired and you are not legally considered inpaired until your BAC is .10 or higher.
Any ways, It's right there in black and white. You can interpret it how you wish.
Last edited by bigbulls; 02-27-2011 at 03:27 PM.
02-27-2011, 06:18 PM
#24
Giant Nontypical
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,867
I think you make a good point, just because it says under the influence of something does not mean that first drink, you must look up what it means by under the influence, which in most takes is .08-.10, this would allow the one or two drinks with dinner or such, like driving, you must make sure you give enough time between the last drink and your leaving, I was offered a beer the other day and opted not to take it, I was leaving in 10 minutes and did not have dinner in me yet, I figured a beer and 10 minutes would leave me open to a dui, plus I was carrying which would have been another issue if I was over the limit. Nice to know if I go down to say islamarda for dinner and drink a daiquiri I will be ok
In your scenario you would have been carrying inside a bar and a "place of nuisance" (as defined by Florida statutes) by being in a strip club, and you would have been breaking the law to begin with and would be subject to arrest long before you shot someone.
Second, regardless of how you may feel about it, in Florida you still have the right to defend your life with lethal force even when you have had a few beers or glasses of wine at a restaurant while you were out on "date night" with your wife.
How am I reading it wrong? It's right there in black and white. It can't get any more easy to understand. And no, I hardly drink at all anyway. But if I want to have a beer when my wife and I go out to dinner it's nice to know I am not going to be breaking any laws by being armed.
If it's in a holster it is not in your hand. If it is in a holster you are not using it as defined by the statute. And you still have the right to use it in lawful self defense.
I also posted the requirements for being intoxicated to the extent that normal faculties are impaired and you are not legally considered inpaired until your BAC is .10 or higher.
Any ways, It's right there in black and white. You can interpret it how you wish.
Second, regardless of how you may feel about it, in Florida you still have the right to defend your life with lethal force even when you have had a few beers or glasses of wine at a restaurant while you were out on "date night" with your wife.
How am I reading it wrong? It's right there in black and white. It can't get any more easy to understand. And no, I hardly drink at all anyway. But if I want to have a beer when my wife and I go out to dinner it's nice to know I am not going to be breaking any laws by being armed.
If it's in a holster it is not in your hand. If it is in a holster you are not using it as defined by the statute. And you still have the right to use it in lawful self defense.
I also posted the requirements for being intoxicated to the extent that normal faculties are impaired and you are not legally considered inpaired until your BAC is .10 or higher.
Any ways, It's right there in black and white. You can interpret it how you wish.
02-28-2011, 01:45 AM
#25
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,905
I've almost always had a gun in my car, usually just a .22 pistol, or a .17 HMR revolver for cleaning up coyotes around the farm should one present itself. I've had two instances where I was "caught" with a gun in my car. Both were before we passed CCW in Kansas.
The first time I was only 17, I had a Ruger Mark II pistol loaded with one in the pipe sitting on my dash. It set nicely in the molded dash tray, so that's just where I left it all the time. I always kept it locked and loaded in case I'd spot a coyote. It never even crossed my mind when I saw the red lights in my rear view. I quickly dug through my glove box looking for my current registration. As soon as the officer walked up, I offered my license and reg, but the officer spotted the stainless pistol right away. He smirked and asked me if I had any weapons in the car, blatantly leaning to look at the pistol, and I said, "oh #$@!, yes, I always keep that pistol up there for coyotes". I assumed I was about to have a gun drawn on me, or at least have some big to do where he'd have to secure the weapon, etc. However, the officer just asked me to step out of the vehicle for his safety. He had me stand in the ditch beside our cars as he ran my info. Once I checked out, he gave me a verbal warning and sent me on my way. Never even touched the pistol, never said anything else about it.
The second time was a few years later, I had the same pistol in my glove box. The magazine was in a cubby in the dash. I didn't even think about the pistol being in the glovebox, along with about 3 or 4 other written warnings for speeding. Again, the officer quickly spotted the pistol as I reached for my registration. He quickly stopped me and asked if it was loaded, I said no, and pointed out that he mag was in the cubby on the dash, and he could clearly see the mag well was empty. He instructed me to set it on the dash, and we went on with the traffic stop. He ran my license and reg and came back and gave me another written warning, and even joked that I could add it to the "collection" of others I already had in the glove box. Never said anything else about the pistol.
I was pulled over in Oklahoma once in college and when the officer asked if I had any guns in the car, I answered honestly and said I had a pistol (same Ruger Mark II) in the glovebox. He pointed out a pistol bag I had on the rear floorboard and asked if that was another one, but it was empty. He said to comply with OK law, I really needed to take the pistol out of the glove box and put it in the pistol bag in the back seat... It SHOULD be locked, but zipped up was close enough.
On the other hand, I was pulled over AGAIN in OK a few months later for crossing the center-line (eating an icecream cone while driving), but DIDN'T have the pistol on board, but when the officer spotted the magazine in the dash tray, he instructed me out of the car and I spent 3hrs handcuffed to his grill-guard while him and 3 other officers searched my vehicle for drugs and guns. Of course they didn't find anything and eventually they let me off without even a ticket.
I personally wouldn't have OFFERED any information about the gun or your permit. The point of the CCW program is to keep the weapons CONCEALED. Officers are trained to approach EVERY stop as if the driver is an agitated tweaker with an AK-47 and a deathwish, and they are fully aware that they work in a CCW state, so they'll be pretty non-chalant about someone legally carrying.
The first time I was only 17, I had a Ruger Mark II pistol loaded with one in the pipe sitting on my dash. It set nicely in the molded dash tray, so that's just where I left it all the time. I always kept it locked and loaded in case I'd spot a coyote. It never even crossed my mind when I saw the red lights in my rear view. I quickly dug through my glove box looking for my current registration. As soon as the officer walked up, I offered my license and reg, but the officer spotted the stainless pistol right away. He smirked and asked me if I had any weapons in the car, blatantly leaning to look at the pistol, and I said, "oh #$@!, yes, I always keep that pistol up there for coyotes". I assumed I was about to have a gun drawn on me, or at least have some big to do where he'd have to secure the weapon, etc. However, the officer just asked me to step out of the vehicle for his safety. He had me stand in the ditch beside our cars as he ran my info. Once I checked out, he gave me a verbal warning and sent me on my way. Never even touched the pistol, never said anything else about it.
The second time was a few years later, I had the same pistol in my glove box. The magazine was in a cubby in the dash. I didn't even think about the pistol being in the glovebox, along with about 3 or 4 other written warnings for speeding. Again, the officer quickly spotted the pistol as I reached for my registration. He quickly stopped me and asked if it was loaded, I said no, and pointed out that he mag was in the cubby on the dash, and he could clearly see the mag well was empty. He instructed me to set it on the dash, and we went on with the traffic stop. He ran my license and reg and came back and gave me another written warning, and even joked that I could add it to the "collection" of others I already had in the glove box. Never said anything else about the pistol.
I was pulled over in Oklahoma once in college and when the officer asked if I had any guns in the car, I answered honestly and said I had a pistol (same Ruger Mark II) in the glovebox. He pointed out a pistol bag I had on the rear floorboard and asked if that was another one, but it was empty. He said to comply with OK law, I really needed to take the pistol out of the glove box and put it in the pistol bag in the back seat... It SHOULD be locked, but zipped up was close enough.
On the other hand, I was pulled over AGAIN in OK a few months later for crossing the center-line (eating an icecream cone while driving), but DIDN'T have the pistol on board, but when the officer spotted the magazine in the dash tray, he instructed me out of the car and I spent 3hrs handcuffed to his grill-guard while him and 3 other officers searched my vehicle for drugs and guns. Of course they didn't find anything and eventually they let me off without even a ticket.
I personally wouldn't have OFFERED any information about the gun or your permit. The point of the CCW program is to keep the weapons CONCEALED. Officers are trained to approach EVERY stop as if the driver is an agitated tweaker with an AK-47 and a deathwish, and they are fully aware that they work in a CCW state, so they'll be pretty non-chalant about someone legally carrying.
02-28-2011, 02:15 AM
#26
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,905
Just to throw my 2 cents in on the florida "drunk carry" laws... A few friends and I were in Kissimmee, FL for a little R&R a few yrs ago, 08 or 09 maybe?, and had a few drinks at Hooters. One of my friends passed out in the bar/restaurant/family dining facility, so we were carrying him back to the car. A cop rolled up on us just to check us out, naturally he was all to eager to give us a hard time since we were out of staters. The officer asked him and I to take breath alcohol tests, my friend was over, and I hadn't been drinking, so I blew nothing. Our passed out friend was barely lucid, but obviously was intoxicated. They were ALMOST TO LET US GO, agreeing that ONLY I would drive, but my friend, a CCW holder, got a little obstinant. Then when the officer asked him if he had any weapons on him, he answered honestly, and said yes, and pointed out that he had a permit. They talked him over for a minute or two, telling him it's illegal to carry in a bar, but he argued that hooter's isn't a bar, it's a restaurant, and they didn't have a "no-guns" placard in the window, and he got louder and louder...
I really wasn't sure why they were talking him up so much, but finally, one of the officers asked him to take out his weapon so they could see it, before I could holler at him to ignore the request, he reached for his pistol, and they threw him on the ground and cuffed him up.
According to his lawyer, Hooter's didn't count as a bar since kids could dine there, and he was legal to have been drunk and CARRYING, but when he handled the weapon, that's when the rule bit him in the butt. The officers also argued that the "defendant" had become agitated and suddenly drew the weapon, which was BS, but they still cooked up a solid resisting arrest charge. Needless to say, his license has since been revoked.
So the moral of the story, if you carry, know the laws wherever you are, and as always, if you're drunk, don't even TOUCH a gun, whether it's already on your hip or not!
I really wasn't sure why they were talking him up so much, but finally, one of the officers asked him to take out his weapon so they could see it, before I could holler at him to ignore the request, he reached for his pistol, and they threw him on the ground and cuffed him up.
According to his lawyer, Hooter's didn't count as a bar since kids could dine there, and he was legal to have been drunk and CARRYING, but when he handled the weapon, that's when the rule bit him in the butt. The officers also argued that the "defendant" had become agitated and suddenly drew the weapon, which was BS, but they still cooked up a solid resisting arrest charge. Needless to say, his license has since been revoked.
So the moral of the story, if you carry, know the laws wherever you are, and as always, if you're drunk, don't even TOUCH a gun, whether it's already on your hip or not!
02-28-2011, 05:47 PM
#27
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,679
I really wasn't sure why they were talking him up so much, but finally, one of the officers asked him to take out his weapon so they could see it, before I could holler at him to ignore the request, he reached for his pistol, and they threw him on the ground and cuffed him up.
If you are carrying KNOW THE LAWS and don't fall for the tricks like this guy did.
02-28-2011, 06:15 PM
#28
Giant Nontypical
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,867
had that happen in ky, I went shooting when I was 19, in ky you must be 21 to carry a handgun, I took the ar but left the handgun( the only time), I did my shooting and since the barrel was hot I leaned it against the back seat of my four door car and headed down the road to cut fire wood(legal in nat forest but I guess you need a permit(did not have one) a officer stopped behind me asked if I was alone why I was cutting it, I said I was cutting up some fallen trees for firewood, mainly camp fire and such. He checked my liceanse and said I could load what I had cut and cut the remaining tree I was cutting on and to then go get a permit, When he pulled off and stopped up the road I noticed why the ar was in the window 
.
So you have a 19 year old from indiana in ky cutting firewood with an assualt weapon in the window
, plus it was pot growing heaven. He got out walked back to me with his gun unclipped but holstered with his hand on it. He asked me if the rifle was loaded, I said no but there was 500 rounds in the car and 6 30 round mags loaed beside it 
He asked if it was full auto, I said no that would be illegal, he then asked if I was carrying I said no I ant 21, He said if he had permission to check it out, I said sure would your like to get it or would you like me to, he opted to retrieve it, As he checked it for full auto fire and or changes not legal he ran it through, this is where it hit me I had bought it from the gun smith for the indianapolis swat team and it was still under their name, he turned to me and said do you know who this gun comes up to, I said I would guess the indy swat team
He laughed said well that is a new one for me. and that was the end of it. He did say for future reference not to cut fire wood with a ar15 in my car window. I offered to follow him to the range and let him "test' it but he was busy
. So you have a 19 year old from indiana in ky cutting firewood with an assualt weapon in the window
, plus it was pot growing heaven. He got out walked back to me with his gun unclipped but holstered with his hand on it. He asked me if the rifle was loaded, I said no but there was 500 rounds in the car and 6 30 round mags loaed beside it He asked if it was full auto, I said no that would be illegal, he then asked if I was carrying I said no I ant 21, He said if he had permission to check it out, I said sure would your like to get it or would you like me to, he opted to retrieve it, As he checked it for full auto fire and or changes not legal he ran it through, this is where it hit me I had bought it from the gun smith for the indianapolis swat team and it was still under their name, he turned to me and said do you know who this gun comes up to, I said I would guess the indy swat team
He laughed said well that is a new one for me. and that was the end of it. He did say for future reference not to cut fire wood with a ar15 in my car window. I offered to follow him to the range and let him "test' it but he was busy I've almost always had a gun in my car, usually just a .22 pistol, or a .17 HMR revolver for cleaning up coyotes around the farm should one present itself. I've had two instances where I was "caught" with a gun in my car. Both were before we passed CCW in Kansas.
The first time I was only 17, I had a Ruger Mark II pistol loaded with one in the pipe sitting on my dash. It set nicely in the molded dash tray, so that's just where I left it all the time. I always kept it locked and loaded in case I'd spot a coyote. It never even crossed my mind when I saw the red lights in my rear view. I quickly dug through my glove box looking for my current registration. As soon as the officer walked up, I offered my license and reg, but the officer spotted the stainless pistol right away. He smirked and asked me if I had any weapons in the car, blatantly leaning to look at the pistol, and I said, "oh #$@!, yes, I always keep that pistol up there for coyotes". I assumed I was about to have a gun drawn on me, or at least have some big to do where he'd have to secure the weapon, etc. However, the officer just asked me to step out of the vehicle for his safety. He had me stand in the ditch beside our cars as he ran my info. Once I checked out, he gave me a verbal warning and sent me on my way. Never even touched the pistol, never said anything else about it.
The second time was a few years later, I had the same pistol in my glove box. The magazine was in a cubby in the dash. I didn't even think about the pistol being in the glovebox, along with about 3 or 4 other written warnings for speeding. Again, the officer quickly spotted the pistol as I reached for my registration. He quickly stopped me and asked if it was loaded, I said no, and pointed out that he mag was in the cubby on the dash, and he could clearly see the mag well was empty. He instructed me to set it on the dash, and we went on with the traffic stop. He ran my license and reg and came back and gave me another written warning, and even joked that I could add it to the "collection" of others I already had in the glove box. Never said anything else about the pistol.
I was pulled over in Oklahoma once in college and when the officer asked if I had any guns in the car, I answered honestly and said I had a pistol (same Ruger Mark II) in the glovebox. He pointed out a pistol bag I had on the rear floorboard and asked if that was another one, but it was empty. He said to comply with OK law, I really needed to take the pistol out of the glove box and put it in the pistol bag in the back seat... It SHOULD be locked, but zipped up was close enough.
On the other hand, I was pulled over AGAIN in OK a few months later for crossing the center-line (eating an icecream cone while driving), but DIDN'T have the pistol on board, but when the officer spotted the magazine in the dash tray, he instructed me out of the car and I spent 3hrs handcuffed to his grill-guard while him and 3 other officers searched my vehicle for drugs and guns. Of course they didn't find anything and eventually they let me off without even a ticket.
I personally wouldn't have OFFERED any information about the gun or your permit. The point of the CCW program is to keep the weapons CONCEALED. Officers are trained to approach EVERY stop as if the driver is an agitated tweaker with an AK-47 and a deathwish, and they are fully aware that they work in a CCW state, so they'll be pretty non-chalant about someone legally carrying.
The first time I was only 17, I had a Ruger Mark II pistol loaded with one in the pipe sitting on my dash. It set nicely in the molded dash tray, so that's just where I left it all the time. I always kept it locked and loaded in case I'd spot a coyote. It never even crossed my mind when I saw the red lights in my rear view. I quickly dug through my glove box looking for my current registration. As soon as the officer walked up, I offered my license and reg, but the officer spotted the stainless pistol right away. He smirked and asked me if I had any weapons in the car, blatantly leaning to look at the pistol, and I said, "oh #$@!, yes, I always keep that pistol up there for coyotes". I assumed I was about to have a gun drawn on me, or at least have some big to do where he'd have to secure the weapon, etc. However, the officer just asked me to step out of the vehicle for his safety. He had me stand in the ditch beside our cars as he ran my info. Once I checked out, he gave me a verbal warning and sent me on my way. Never even touched the pistol, never said anything else about it.
The second time was a few years later, I had the same pistol in my glove box. The magazine was in a cubby in the dash. I didn't even think about the pistol being in the glovebox, along with about 3 or 4 other written warnings for speeding. Again, the officer quickly spotted the pistol as I reached for my registration. He quickly stopped me and asked if it was loaded, I said no, and pointed out that he mag was in the cubby on the dash, and he could clearly see the mag well was empty. He instructed me to set it on the dash, and we went on with the traffic stop. He ran my license and reg and came back and gave me another written warning, and even joked that I could add it to the "collection" of others I already had in the glove box. Never said anything else about the pistol.
I was pulled over in Oklahoma once in college and when the officer asked if I had any guns in the car, I answered honestly and said I had a pistol (same Ruger Mark II) in the glovebox. He pointed out a pistol bag I had on the rear floorboard and asked if that was another one, but it was empty. He said to comply with OK law, I really needed to take the pistol out of the glove box and put it in the pistol bag in the back seat... It SHOULD be locked, but zipped up was close enough.
On the other hand, I was pulled over AGAIN in OK a few months later for crossing the center-line (eating an icecream cone while driving), but DIDN'T have the pistol on board, but when the officer spotted the magazine in the dash tray, he instructed me out of the car and I spent 3hrs handcuffed to his grill-guard while him and 3 other officers searched my vehicle for drugs and guns. Of course they didn't find anything and eventually they let me off without even a ticket.
I personally wouldn't have OFFERED any information about the gun or your permit. The point of the CCW program is to keep the weapons CONCEALED. Officers are trained to approach EVERY stop as if the driver is an agitated tweaker with an AK-47 and a deathwish, and they are fully aware that they work in a CCW state, so they'll be pretty non-chalant about someone legally carrying.
03-03-2011, 05:51 PM
#29
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: MN USA
Posts: 1,392
You need to know what your state and any other state you're legal to carry with CCW permit laws say you must do. In MN if a CCW permit holder is carrying and are stopped by a LEO, they MUST tell them they are carrying and where it is. Don't reach for it to show him/her. (I would always keep my hands on the wheel in plain sight regardless, especially if carrying CW.) Wait for the officier to give you instructions. Have a nice day.
