scottycoyote

robert i know youre feelings exactly, i think we talked about this in another thread and i went so far as to carry my full sized 1911 for a couple days ****ed and locked (unloaded) as an experiment, and i never had an accident. I have a nice rotation of carry guns but id like to add a small 1911 either in 9mm or 45 one day. If i do ill carry it condition 1. I occasionally carry a glock but if i had one i carried every day i think id add one of the aftermarket safeties to it that you push out with ur trigger finger, its right there and it woudlnt take any time. To me the built in trigger safety is too easily disengaged.

RobertSubnet

Homer: so was your instructor recommending just relying on the grip safety and leaving the slide safety off?

bigbulls

You guys seriously worry way too much about safeties on a hand gun. Aside from a 1911 (one of the very few handguns with a manual safety that is naturally disengaged with the thumb with out having to think about its operation) I wouldn't have a carry weapon with a manually operated safety.

KEEP YOUR FRIGGIN FINGER OFF THE TRIGGER AND YOUR GUN ISN'T GOING TO FIRE ON ITS OWN! IF YOU CAN'T DO THIS THEN YOU SHOULDN'T BE CARRYING A FIREARM AT ALL!

homers brother

That was the point he made to me after many drills with and without the slide safety engaged. He reinforced that by demonstrations with an unloaded 1911.

With your unloaded 1911, try the following:

1. Bring the hammer back and without touching the grip safety, pull the trigger as hard as you can and make the hammer fall. This simulates something snagging on or depressing the trigger.

2. Again with the hammer back, the grip safety depressed this time and your thumb on the hammer, pull the trigger just enough to release it and gently follow the hammer forward with your thumb after letting off the trigger. Your hammer will more than likely stop at a half-**** position.

In order for your 1911 to fire, two things must happen: you must depress the grip safety, and the trigger must remain depressed until the primer is struck. If the grip safety is engaged again or you let off pressure on the trigger while the hammer is falling, the hammer will be blocked mid-travel. I can't tell you how important it is to experiment on your own with your unloaded 1911. Think of any manner of "accidents" that might cause that hammer to fall, something snagged, a fall, etc., and then in very slow motion attempt to replicate how the firearm will react.

I've also done this with my exposed-hammer DA and SA autos and revolvers, as well as a Winchester 94 in order to become familiar with each of their safety features Not a single one of my Beretta, Ruger, S&W, Winchester or Sig hammers will fall and contact the firing pin UNLESS the trigger is pulled at the same time. Not only would the hammer have to snag on something or be struck by something, but the trigger would have to snag at the same time and be pulled fully to the rear.

I also have a Ruger MkII. No exposed hammer, none of the above apply. I carry it with the safety engaged.

Most modern handgun safeties today involve something getting between the hammer and the firing pin. You may not even be aware of some of these redundant safeties. Think about how many hunting rifles and shotgun safeties that do nothing more than prevent the trigger from being pulled accidentally? But how many times have you carried them to the field and never given it a second thought?

I much prefer hunting and shooting when I know that the people around me focus far, far more on muzzle awareness (where that weapon's muzzle is pointed) than whether a safety is engaged. An accident or malfunction is always possible.

Get some formal training though. The money you spend to improve not only your "carry confidence" and draw -- but more importantly your judgements of and reactions to situations -- will be far less than the legal fees and inconvenience you'll endure mounting a defense in court.

homers brother

All Hollywood aside, there's a lot of truth to the idea that one's finger is the only safety one needs. Quite true, BB.

scottycoyote

i can only speak for myself, but im not worried about accidentally shooting someone else, im worried about accidentally shooting me. Got a gun tucked in the small of your back, youre getting in and out of cars, you sitting down and getting back up out of chairs, youre scooting past someone or something and your back is hitting the wall or a door......its something else, not my finger, that worries me about a possible discharge.

bigbulls

With the proper holster that is properly designed for how you carry the firearm it is a non issue.

scottycoyote

yes i realise this, but sometimes regardless of doing all the right things and having all the proper gear, things happen that are you dont plan on. We call these things "accidents". These "accidents" can occur out of nowhere, and some people like to try and cover every possible angle, to keep these things called "accidents" to a minimum. Somehow you took it that we people who are trying to limit our accidents are incompetent and should keep our fingers off the triggers or not own guns. Thats not the case

bigbulls

That's not what I thought or meant at all. What I am trying to get across to you guys is that if you carry the gun in a proper holster designed for the gun and keep your finger off the trigger the chances of an accidental discharge are so miniscule it isn't worth worrying about...... regardless of the gun brushing up against objects, sitting on it, jumping around, running a marathon, mountain biking, or what ever your doing.

You're thousands of times more likely to kill yourself driving to work than shooting yourself in the leg because you bumped your firearm in the holster.

homers brother

For a long time while I was in the Army, we called them "accidental discharges." However, within months of being in iraq, and with young and old Soldiers now carrying live ammunition around with them, the investigations into "accidental" firearms deaths were found to contain a common component - "negligence".

In fact, I don't remember a single case where a weapon accidentally discharged, every case involved someone's trigger finger being where it wasn't supposed to be.

I don't mean to be harsh, but the most important part of a firearm's function resides between our ears. You're obviously concerned about accidents. My advice to you is NOT to carry until you're more confident in your equipment - to the point that you aren't so concerned about accidents and instead can focus on the threat and making the correct judgement.

I'm not saying you shouldn't own guns. I AM suggesting that you may not be ready YET to carry for defensive purposes.