Posting: Can & Will Be Used Against You
12-31-2009, 07:28 AM
#11
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 3,329
This is VERY fishy.
#2 - I grew up in MI (this is where it occurred, right). While I have little respect for the DNR there based on my experiences and those of other acquaintances, unless laws have changed it is not illegal to have meat over one year old in your freezer, nor are you required to keep the tag once the carcass is processed. How would they tell what meat when with what tag anyways?? The processor I used regularly had a DNR officer there aging/measuring deer and sent me out the door past them with bags of meat, and no tag returned with it.
#2 - I grew up in MI (this is where it occurred, right). While I have little respect for the DNR there based on my experiences and those of other acquaintances, unless laws have changed it is not illegal to have meat over one year old in your freezer, nor are you required to keep the tag once the carcass is processed. How would they tell what meat when with what tag anyways?? The processor I used regularly had a DNR officer there aging/measuring deer and sent me out the door past them with bags of meat, and no tag returned with it.
I don't want to talk anymore about the actual poaching because 1) I don't condone it in anyway.
2) I wasn't there for all of this but I have extremely good 2nd hand knowledge of the situation.
BTW - The last thing the officers told everyone before they left was, don't contact the guy after we leave. If you do we will know and we'll be back.
Tom
12-31-2009, 07:30 AM
#12
Fork Horn
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Virginia Beach, Va
Posts: 317
Tom,
This is straight from Michigans DNR web site:
Deer processing
Q. Can I process or have my deer processed before I return home?YES. You may process your own deer or take it to a processor before you return home. You do not need any type of permit from the DNR; however, until you get your deer home, you must keep the head and validated kill tag as proof of the kind of deer you took.
I cant find anything that states that a tag must be maintained with the processed meat while its in the freezer... then after a certain time frame... you must get another tag re-issued. Please show me / the forum this regulation.
Tom, its always about the details... cause detail can prove that your telling a factual story or BS.
The story is BS....
This is straight from Michigans DNR web site:
Deer processing
Q. Can I process or have my deer processed before I return home?YES. You may process your own deer or take it to a processor before you return home. You do not need any type of permit from the DNR; however, until you get your deer home, you must keep the head and validated kill tag as proof of the kind of deer you took.
I cant find anything that states that a tag must be maintained with the processed meat while its in the freezer... then after a certain time frame... you must get another tag re-issued. Please show me / the forum this regulation.
Tom, its always about the details... cause detail can prove that your telling a factual story or BS.
The story is BS....
This is not BS.
To the poster that said since when is it illegal to have meat in the freezer without a tag etc.... Every state is different. In Michigan you have to have a tag in the freezer with the meat. After a certain period of time you must be re-issued a tag to keep it in your freezer. Not sure on the exact time frame etc...
This story is not BS. The guy did poach the deer and claimed that it was shot somewhere else. Why did they care about this one deer? It would have been a new state record.
Guys,
Don't get bogged down in the details. Just take from this that what you post on the internet can come back to haunt you. I've always watched what I've said on here so I know I'm good.
Tom
To the poster that said since when is it illegal to have meat in the freezer without a tag etc.... Every state is different. In Michigan you have to have a tag in the freezer with the meat. After a certain period of time you must be re-issued a tag to keep it in your freezer. Not sure on the exact time frame etc...
This story is not BS. The guy did poach the deer and claimed that it was shot somewhere else. Why did they care about this one deer? It would have been a new state record.
Guys,
Don't get bogged down in the details. Just take from this that what you post on the internet can come back to haunt you. I've always watched what I've said on here so I know I'm good.
Tom
Last edited by Alex G.; 12-31-2009 at 07:37 AM.
12-31-2009, 07:36 AM
#13
Fork Horn
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Virginia Beach, Va
Posts: 317
Straight from the Michigan DNR regulations....
Tagging Big Game and Furbearers
Immediately after killing a deer, bear, elk or turkey, you must validate your kill tag and fasten it to the antler, lower jaw or lower leg in such a manner that the tag remains securely attached to the animal. Do not stick or wrap the kill tag to the antler of a deer or to the leg of a turkey.
The best way to attach a kill tag is to lay a strong piece of wire or cord across the sticky side of the kill tag so the tag can be folded in half. Tie the wire or cord to the animal. Make sure the kill tag is completely legible and visible for inspection.
The kill tag must remain attached until you process or butcher the animal, or the animal is accepted for processing and recorded by a commercial processor or taxidermist.
Note: If the antlers or head are returned to the person submitting the animal to the commercial processor, the kill tag shall accompany the head or antlers. Immediately after taking a bobcat, otter, fisher or marten, you must validate your kill tag and fasten it in such a manner that the tag remains securely attached to the animal. For details on furbearer kill tags and proper placement, see Furbearer Kill Tags. Make sure the kill tag is completely legible and visible for inspection.
It is unlawful to tag an animal you did not legally kill.
Immediately after killing a deer, bear, elk or turkey, you must validate your kill tag and fasten it to the antler, lower jaw or lower leg in such a manner that the tag remains securely attached to the animal. Do not stick or wrap the kill tag to the antler of a deer or to the leg of a turkey.
The best way to attach a kill tag is to lay a strong piece of wire or cord across the sticky side of the kill tag so the tag can be folded in half. Tie the wire or cord to the animal. Make sure the kill tag is completely legible and visible for inspection.
The kill tag must remain attached until you process or butcher the animal, or the animal is accepted for processing and recorded by a commercial processor or taxidermist.
Note: If the antlers or head are returned to the person submitting the animal to the commercial processor, the kill tag shall accompany the head or antlers. Immediately after taking a bobcat, otter, fisher or marten, you must validate your kill tag and fasten it in such a manner that the tag remains securely attached to the animal. For details on furbearer kill tags and proper placement, see Furbearer Kill Tags. Make sure the kill tag is completely legible and visible for inspection.
It is unlawful to tag an animal you did not legally kill.
12-31-2009, 07:54 AM
#14
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 3,329
Flip,
Don't take this the wrong way but I don't care if a guy with 26 posts thinks I'm laying out some BS. I'm not giving any additional details.
Secondly none of the info you have provided addresses meat in a freezer. Only the transportation of the animal/meat.
Anyone on here that has known me for a while knows I don't BS. The officers were looking for tags in the freezers and that should be enough. If you don't believe what I have written go about your business.
Tom
Don't take this the wrong way but I don't care if a guy with 26 posts thinks I'm laying out some BS. I'm not giving any additional details.
Secondly none of the info you have provided addresses meat in a freezer. Only the transportation of the animal/meat.
Anyone on here that has known me for a while knows I don't BS. The officers were looking for tags in the freezers and that should be enough. If you don't believe what I have written go about your business.
Tom
12-31-2009, 08:07 AM
#15
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Garfield NJ USA
Posts: 3,067
Flip,
Don't take this the wrong way but I don't care if a guy with 26 posts thinks I'm laying out some BS. I'm not giving any additional details.
Secondly none of the info you have provided addresses meat in a freezer. Only the transportation of the animal/meat.
Anyone on here that has known me for a while knows I don't BS. The officers were looking for tags in the freezers and that should be enough. If you don't believe what I have written go about your business.
Tom
Don't take this the wrong way but I don't care if a guy with 26 posts thinks I'm laying out some BS. I'm not giving any additional details.
Secondly none of the info you have provided addresses meat in a freezer. Only the transportation of the animal/meat.
Anyone on here that has known me for a while knows I don't BS. The officers were looking for tags in the freezers and that should be enough. If you don't believe what I have written go about your business.
Tom
On a side note I find it very hard to believe that a judge would sign the court order to wire tap an entire neighborhoods phone lines just because they own a truck. That would be quite of number of peoples' civil rights being violated. Especially if they had the IP address of the person who made the post. Common sense would lend to identify the make of the truck and then check registrations. Then you have circumstantial evidence that a judge may authorize the surveillance on. Like you said " it's in the details".
Last edited by thndrchiken; 12-31-2009 at 08:10 AM.
12-31-2009, 08:17 AM
#16
Fork Horn
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Virginia Beach, Va
Posts: 317
Tom,
I didnt take it the wrong way, actually it made me laugh a bit. 26 posts or 2988 posts.... doesnt make any difference. It just means that the person with 2988 joined earlier and spends a WHOLE LOT more time perusing the forums. And I didnt ask for anymore info concerning the supposed poacher.
What I did ask for was the regulations that your refering too...
And the reason that the info I gave you only covered transport cause thats all there is. If there is a Michigan DNR regulation... or any other state regulation saying that you must keep a game tag with stored meat AND re-apply after a specified time.... then please provide it. "The kill tag must remain attached until you process or butcher the animal, or the animal is accepted for processing and recorded by a commercial processor or taxidermist."
You posted, " I could have been dragged into this myself because in my buddies truck I had several old hunting tags that came from deer in my freezer and they had my name on them."
If you know the "regulations" then why werent you in compliance?
You also posted, "Guys, Don't get bogged down in the details. Just take from this that what you post on the internet can come back to haunt you. I've always watched what I've said on here so I know I'm good." Just by this statement, your confessing to breaking Michigan DNR regulation (did you find it yet?) to maintain the deer tag with the processed meat in your freezer... so how are you good?
Ya know, people often write, post things, or retell a story before they verify what their saying... newspapers print retractions. Forum posters ... well lets just say most just never say their wrong.
I didnt take it the wrong way, actually it made me laugh a bit. 26 posts or 2988 posts.... doesnt make any difference. It just means that the person with 2988 joined earlier and spends a WHOLE LOT more time perusing the forums. And I didnt ask for anymore info concerning the supposed poacher.
What I did ask for was the regulations that your refering too...
And the reason that the info I gave you only covered transport cause thats all there is. If there is a Michigan DNR regulation... or any other state regulation saying that you must keep a game tag with stored meat AND re-apply after a specified time.... then please provide it. "The kill tag must remain attached until you process or butcher the animal, or the animal is accepted for processing and recorded by a commercial processor or taxidermist."
You posted, " I could have been dragged into this myself because in my buddies truck I had several old hunting tags that came from deer in my freezer and they had my name on them."
If you know the "regulations" then why werent you in compliance?
You also posted, "Guys, Don't get bogged down in the details. Just take from this that what you post on the internet can come back to haunt you. I've always watched what I've said on here so I know I'm good." Just by this statement, your confessing to breaking Michigan DNR regulation (did you find it yet?) to maintain the deer tag with the processed meat in your freezer... so how are you good?
Ya know, people often write, post things, or retell a story before they verify what their saying... newspapers print retractions. Forum posters ... well lets just say most just never say their wrong.
12-31-2009, 08:20 AM
#17
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Pine Hill Alabama USA
Posts: 1,280
I believe his point is that he was unable to find any statute that substantiates the requirement of the tag having to accompany the meat in the freezer and asked you to post the statute.
And I have heard of some dumb game laws in my time but having to keep a tag in your freezer on top of a pile of venison and then having to be reissued a new tag if it stayed in there over a year would take the cake by a country mile.
If I eat some deer meat from a deer I tagged in Michigan do I have to swallow a tag along with it so that it will stay with the meat as it passes through my digestive track. LOL!! What if I get constipated. How long before the tag in my colon has to be reissued?
12-31-2009, 09:25 AM
#18
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 3,329
Honestly, I can't hardly find the deer guide consistently on the DNR website. The search feature sucks. Genreally speaking the whole site sucks. I'm not going to spend my time searching for that info. Though I have heard it from mulitple sources, including a butcher I used to use with a large-ish operation in Grayling.
Not to mention that they were looking at all the tags in the freezers of three guys I know.
Don't expect me to try and back this up. If you don't believe what I have written. Don't.
I agree the phone things sounds crazy but how do they know this info? I think they figured out who the people of interest were and pulled phone records, tapped lines something.
Tom
12-31-2009, 09:26 AM
#19
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location:
Posts: 1,408
If such a regulation on tagging meat in the freezer existed, I would think it would be covered in the DNR manual or searchable online. It is NOT in the 2009 manual, nor can I google it up with many combinations of search terms found.
If you can find a reference, we'll believe you. Otherwise, it's an urban legend.
LEO may say many things meant to mislead you into thinking they know things or can find out things that they can't. Or, judging from my experience with MI-DNR, they may not even know their own regulations. There's a guy that has posted in detail on this site (including scanned letters from MI-DNR) where they basically tried to ruin his life for shooting a piebald deer that their own biologists certified was piebald, claiming it was an albino.
If you can find a reference, we'll believe you. Otherwise, it's an urban legend.
LEO may say many things meant to mislead you into thinking they know things or can find out things that they can't. Or, judging from my experience with MI-DNR, they may not even know their own regulations. There's a guy that has posted in detail on this site (including scanned letters from MI-DNR) where they basically tried to ruin his life for shooting a piebald deer that their own biologists certified was piebald, claiming it was an albino.
12-31-2009, 12:10 PM
#20
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: central and east texas
Posts: 4,894
i can see the dnr gettin an ip address, gettin a home address, showing up at the ip holders house, lookin in the truck...finding someone elses tags and persuing it from there....it is possible they got the ip holders phone records before they came.
monitoring phone conversations i dont think so...but since all calls are recorded and stored for like 30 days, maybe they made it to the records before they were re-recorded over, but they woulda had to been real quick to get this info
they will need to find this deer head they are lookin for ..imo hard to get dna from a pic
the dnr cant stop you from callin a friend lol...just dont talk about what happened over the phone...i'd call him right now lol..
monitoring phone conversations i dont think so...but since all calls are recorded and stored for like 30 days, maybe they made it to the records before they were re-recorded over, but they woulda had to been real quick to get this info
they will need to find this deer head they are lookin for ..imo hard to get dna from a pic
the dnr cant stop you from callin a friend lol...just dont talk about what happened over the phone...i'd call him right now lol..