harter66

I'm not totaly with Pavomasa but sorta , I do have bears and big cats in my back yard . I like the pump idea . Have an action plan for the end of socity and the colapse of civilation . It includes a lever 357 and a 22 pump . The lever is is as relible as any pump and almost as fast and has about 9 moving parts and 7 of them can be reproduceced with a file . the 357 carbineis more than enough for cats and california browns at save the larder ranges . At even 20 yrds a man ina bullet vest is going to be damaged to some degree . I have moulds for the 357 and if it came down to a complete forever apoclipse the case is big enough to use (god forbid) home grown primers andblack powder . This is a NO frills rifle Iron sights click elevation at the rear ,ranger 5/50 cord sling , 1o + 1 , wash the mud out in the lake/creek animal fat lubed5 lb.survival tool . The 357 works with my side arms too .

Badger Boy

how did i forget about lever actions... might have to reconsider my choice

gmil6184

I like the AR style platform but i think i would want something with a little more punch then the 5.56, something like the 6.8 or .308 would do quite nicely i would think

Badger Boy

stick with a caliber that is abundant and cheap.. the future of the 6.8 spc is still uncartain

savagescout

Pavomesa
"Give me a stainless bolt action .22 Long Rifle."

I agree that if all you were going to do is collect food with the rifle a 22lr would do. But to defend a family no way. I live near mountains in utah were bear and cougar tracks are always present. So for me I would not even consider a 22lr. And I agree in the long runthe rifle does play a small role in survival but I want it to be up to the task. And where you live mybe a 22 lr will do it.Inthis post I was asking about a rifle only not pots and pans.

Pavomesa
"Get real guys. Are we talking about survival or just a weekend gunfight?"


Weekend fight not sure what thatmeans. But in a survival situation maybe like louisiana your not always just dealing with just the elements. I did not say what kind of survival that is up to who responded to this thread.

starhunter21
"I would split the ammo up and have the kids help carry."

I agree with this one for sure.

kdvollmer

I only suggested pump over lever action because I felt that it can be more quickly, and reliably cycled in a defensive use. A high powered pistol cartridge in a lever action would make for a fine rifle in this situation as well. Think old wild west folks....

Badger Boy

.44 mag baby!!!

Pavomesa

Savage - Don't get me wrong. I wasn't trying to really rain on your thread here. I was day dreaming and studying about this survival stuff back when nuclear holocost was almost a daily dread, i.e. 40 years ago. My rifle then was the great all-around 30/06. I even developed a load for it that I could hunt quail with......1 1/2 grs of bullseye under a 150 gr cast bullet. Shot like a .22 LR.

But anyway as I really studied all this my thinking seriously evolved. Ultimately I came to realize the only rifle that would work in a serious long term situation was the .22 for the reasons I've listed.

As for repelling or protecting the family from other people, the lowly .22 is quite effective at that. The Russians used it very effectively as a sniping rifle against Germans in WW-2 and heaven only knows how many people a 22 has killed. But of course you don't have to kill with it. All we really want is to convince someone to leave us the hell alone and the .22 can get that message across quite well.

Defending against cougars and black bears? How often do these attack people? Very rarely...and if I were in a survival situation around them, I think I would likely shoot everyone of them I encountered regardless what they were doing........just to convince them to stay the hell away from me and people in general. The big reason for the rare cougar attack is they've lost their fear of man...but this is something that can be very quickly RE-TAUGHT...and again, I think the lowly 22 can teach the lesson.

The more one thinks about real survival, the more you realize it's the mundane little things that never cross our minds that would kill us. We can go out into the woods armed to the teeth but what if you forgot the can opener, or matches, or a needle to dig that big thorn out of your foot? Water purification tablets? Toilet paper? Aspirin or your allergy medicine?

I used to do a lot of backpacking and was always very careful to pack my .357 Magnum and enough ammo to start a small war. Invariably I would come home with the thing unfired. The gun and the ammo was just like 5 lbs of scrap metal in my pack. On the other hand, life could sure become hell if I forgot some of the "trivial stuff" that I was going to need every day. I learned about the needle for splinters the hard way.

Anyway, I love to daydream about guns as much as the next guy. But when you say "survival," I think of a whole different scenario. I'll go with the guy who is well equipped...not the guy who is well armed. And I figure in about a week of real survival life, the well armed guy will be willing to trade me a rifle for some salt.

Pavomesa

Let me add this little suggestion for anyone thinking survival: Clear a space somewhere and start placing in that spot all the things you want to have with you in a life or death long term survival situation. I suspect it will take you 10 minutes to pile up more stuff than you can carry in a backpack. And I suspect that within 30 minutes you will have enough stuff to fill the trunk of your car.[] You might get MOST of what you really need in the back of a pick-up. Then ask yourself if that truck carries enough fuel in the tank to get you to your "survival spot" or do you need to figure a way to bolt on gas cans? What if that fancy assault rifle breaks a firing pin the 3rd time you pull a trigger?[&:]

Just let your imagination run wild with this little problem. It won't take long for anyone to understand just how complicated this really is and why I'll just grab a 22 and a couple of bricks of ammo.

And don't forget your toothbrush!

starhunter21

Pavomesa, kind of like your reasoning. Not sure in the heat of the battle I would grab my 10/22 over my AR15, but sticking with the thread of a single rifle, which brand/model would you recommend for this scenario. Is there one that seems more durable than the others. I have a 10/22, browning lever, ruger pistol, and suppressed P22, but not sure I would want to defend my family w/ any of them.