James,
Ah, "You bet"? ----- You bet What?

Earlier you claimed....

And I responded,
Really?
If your words are in ernest, then youhave immensely moreexperience withgut shot elk than I do.
(1) How in the heck did that ("several")happen? and,
(2) How did youallow yourself to continue to beinvolved withit?

And then you followed up with....

Ah, let me make sure I understand this. So in addition to the "several 243-hit'em-bad-yet-killed-'em-where-they-stood" elk kills, there is another cluster of"other" elk that you have seen gut shot withothercartridges --- andyou are using the comparison between these two groups of gut shot elkto make your point that cartridge size is largely irrelevant in this?

For the moment, Igottaset asidethe "cartridge part" of the discussion, andpoint out the glaring "issue" in your message....

You appear to be a witness to whatisessentially the hunter equivalent of "war crimes" against wildlife. This would be especially true, if strong measures were not taken to put an end toitsre-occurance (which, on the surface of it, it sounds like it wasn't....)

(1) How in the heck didyour first hand witnessing of such a streak ofgut shooting come about? and,
(2) How did youallow yourself to continue to beinvolved withit? and,
(3) What actions, if any, were taken to try to stop/prevent it?

After reading your posts, I'm feelingeven stronger convictionsabout how we're running our elk camp, including our perceived heavy handed rules covering "cartridges, ranges, and backup" and the rest ofthe way we run things.

I know our culture is hung up on "individual freedoms" to do whatever folks want and,
Nowhere is that belief stronger than in our hunter community,

Technically wildlife are property of the state to be sold via licenses and dispatched,
Even so there are limits....

Taken to this extreme you seem to describe, the hunter's rights have to give way a bit...
What about the "elk's rights" and some basic decency in this deal?
IMO, this stuff can't just be "okay" and everyone just turn a blind eye to it.

Let's put this one to bed. The lady got her questions answered and bought a rifle.

Good luck staying away from that mirror and not******** yourself to death......



I have seen some arrogant folks on here but you take the cake Know all, done all, seen all and yours is the only experience that matters or is credible...you da man!!

DD. that about says it all you saved me a lot of wasted typing..Good idea Roskoe.

Roskoe,
That was well done., but no....
Yes,Lady Arwenfound a fine elk rifle (in spite of it all)and that is a darned good thing.
However, that is not the only thing that has been unfolding over the course of the last 10 pages....
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Doe Dumper,
You're the one that started this little "gut shot" discussion. I responded as honestly as I knew how and as a result, this "baggage" gotdropped into my lap. I'm working with verbatum quotes levelled my direction that claim somepretty outrageousthings, so asking for an explaination doesn't seem unreasonable.

Note: I must say, that yourapparent obsession/fixation about beds, sleeping, mirrors, and intercourse (ah, I see you editted/cleaned it up a bit --- good for you)and other inuendos that you have wove into this thread seem a bitrinappropriate for a public forum. IMO, it would be better to just stick to the facts of what is being discussed versus your experiences.
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James,
It's nice to have these two fellows "pulling" for you. One is quite credible. However, you wrote what you wrote.... and claimed what you claimed....

What the heck IS the deal with all these gut shot elk experiences that you areclaiming first person knowledge of?

Did this really happen or wereyou just being "a little over-aggressive" in arguing a point? If you want toleave it as isand takefull credit, then of course I would certainly be glad tohelp you out with that any way I can.

That may be true EKM...I do enjoy things besdies trying to convince other posters and myself on the size of my gun. I got a few more things to say but out of respect to the board and the fact Roskoe says now is a good time to end it...I will stop.

Any port looks goodin a storm.

I guess if you feel like you HAVE to continue this you are invited to pm me....if not then I guess we are done.

I think that if you're worried about the amount of recoil that you find someone who has the rifle and caliber you're considering buying, if possible. Test fire it and other rifle calibers combinations.

I personally think that a .300 WM is the rifle (Tikka) for me. I don't agree with the gunsmith about it kicking as much a a .243. On a bench rest I notice the .300 WM. It kicks. However, with the Elk I've shot with my Tikka .300 WM I was so concentrated on the Elks I was shooting, I did not notice the recoil. You're also hopefully shooting less rounds when hunting, than with the initial sighting anyway. A good bore sighting first is worth a lot to avoid a sore should for the initial siting of a new rifle/scope combination. Have fun.

Doe Dumper,

In answer to your post....

(1) Yes, at least until I get an answer of some sort.

(2) NoWay.[IMHO, you are a bit to risque to risk non-public internet communication with]
(3) I doubt it,given your perchant for following me around and providing "running commentary"
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MinnFinn,
Lady Arwen, went ahead and bought a Remington SPSin7mmRemMag, good post though!