Whats your opinion of the Pre-64 Actions
10-25-2002, 08:14 AM
#1
Guest
Posts: n/a
Whats your opinion of the Pre-64 Actions
I have never had a Pre-64 Win action. I have alot of 700 actions, and they have always served my purpose. Even the 98 actions work well for me. Do you really think they are that supurior to other actions. Or is people "picking pepper out of ant sh$#".
10-25-2002, 08:40 AM
#2
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: CHESTERFIELD MICHIGAN USA
Posts: 39
RE: Whats your opinion of the Pre-64 Actions
B.C.,
I guess you said it best with the last comment,although I am a big fan of the pre-64/ classic {winchester} , I still find that the remington hands down will out shoot the mauser design, so if accuracy is desired remington is your best bet but if building a custom rifle it only seems natural to use the claw extractor design. It is an excellent choice for dangerous game due to the fact the cartridge is held directly on the bolt thus more realible in the field then the push feed design of the remington.
RON KONTOWSKY
ACTIONS BY R.A.K.
CUSTOM GUNSMITHING CUSTOM PISTOLSMITHING
I guess you said it best with the last comment,although I am a big fan of the pre-64/ classic {winchester} , I still find that the remington hands down will out shoot the mauser design, so if accuracy is desired remington is your best bet but if building a custom rifle it only seems natural to use the claw extractor design. It is an excellent choice for dangerous game due to the fact the cartridge is held directly on the bolt thus more realible in the field then the push feed design of the remington.
RON KONTOWSKY
ACTIONS BY R.A.K.
CUSTOM GUNSMITHING CUSTOM PISTOLSMITHING
10-25-2002, 10:58 AM
#4
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location:
Posts: 6,471
RE: Whats your opinion of the Pre-64 Actions
The only negative I have heard on the pre-64 is that it can't handle a ruptured case as well as the newer versions. Too expensive to build is why they went to the push feed from what I have read and correct me if I'm wrong there were 52 separate machining operations on the action alone to produce it.
10-25-2002, 12:07 PM
#5
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Oakland OR USA
Posts: 2,929
RE: Whats your opinion of the Pre-64 Actions
I believe that winchester started to farm the manufacture of thier rifles to a company in Japan at that time. They also made some design changes I believe on some models . Don't quote me on that I am just repeating what I heard from a gunsmith .
10-25-2002, 12:27 PM
#6
Typical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: chattaahoochee fl
Posts: 871
RE: Whats your opinion of the Pre-64 Actions
one thing i have heard is that CF will chamber evan if the gun is upside down. its supsto be more relibal on feeding and extracting. maybe CF are my pf will chamber upside down to. of all my shoting with pf i have never had a problem with it feedig or extracting. the only falure of a bolt gun i have had was with a surplus 98m. the claw broke. so i dont know if the cf vs pf is that big of deal. Btw on the falure of the 98 i loaded it from the mag.idid not force the bolt over the cartarge.
but from what i have read the post 64 mod 70 it was not just the change from cf to pf that caused the problems is the fact the whol gun was redisined and looked and functiond cheaply
L. O. D. Charter member and L.O.S.
but from what i have read the post 64 mod 70 it was not just the change from cf to pf that caused the problems is the fact the whol gun was redisined and looked and functiond cheaply
L. O. D. Charter member and L.O.S.
10-25-2002, 12:44 PM
#7
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location:
Posts: 6,471
RE: Whats your opinion of the Pre-64 Actions
There have been 3 changes to the Model 70 since the pre-64 was discontinued.
Chg 1. It was redesigned into a push feed action because it was cheap to make not because it was subbed out to Japan.
CHg 2. they added a rail to the reciever to make the bolt travel smoother.
Chg 3. they brought back the pre -64 made some minor changes to the way it will handle a ruptured case, the claw is not spring steel so it will bend and remain bent and it is entirely made on CNC machines so it is probably better built than the original pre64.
There is no reason to build a custom rifle on the pre-64 action if you have a perfectly good post 64 CRF action..just replace the extractor with one of spring steel and go from there. Incidentally I have a new Model 70 CRF and MOdel 700 they can feed cartridges upside down too not that I have ever had the chance to do that hunting yet but who knows give me enough time anything is possible.
Chg 1. It was redesigned into a push feed action because it was cheap to make not because it was subbed out to Japan.
CHg 2. they added a rail to the reciever to make the bolt travel smoother.
Chg 3. they brought back the pre -64 made some minor changes to the way it will handle a ruptured case, the claw is not spring steel so it will bend and remain bent and it is entirely made on CNC machines so it is probably better built than the original pre64.
There is no reason to build a custom rifle on the pre-64 action if you have a perfectly good post 64 CRF action..just replace the extractor with one of spring steel and go from there. Incidentally I have a new Model 70 CRF and MOdel 700 they can feed cartridges upside down too not that I have ever had the chance to do that hunting yet but who knows give me enough time anything is possible.
10-25-2002, 05:00 PM
#8
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ontario Canada
Posts: 358
RE: Whats your opinion of the Pre-64 Actions
My added 2 cents....
First cent....
CRF, having to chamber a round upside down is highly unlikely. However, one documented incident that I'm aware of saw the shooter using a tree trunk for a rest. After the first shot with his 375 HH post 64 push feed the Cape Buffalo charged. As he worked the action the shooter simultaneously spun around to the other side of the trunk for the next shot but upon pulling the trigger nothing happened. The guide dropped the buffalo. Thinking he had a misfire he opened the bolt only to find an empty chamber. The live round was lying on the ground. Seemingly when he spun around and at the same time working the action the round had fallen from the action and the bolt closed on an empty chamber. Maybe CRF not quite as accurate but definitely more reliable.
Second cent....
My bolt action rifles are all CRF, Winchesters & Rugers. I'll give you that they may not be quite as accurate as say the Remington 700. However, IMHO 1 inch at a hundred yards is inconsequential when your shooting at an animal in the field with no bench rest. And a big advantage of the Mouser style CRF action is the 3 position safety over the Remington action which allows the bolt to open when cocked and safety on. Carrying a rifle in thick woods, sometimes in hand sometimes slung over the shoulder will inevitably see the bolt on a Remington catch on something and be fully or partially opened. If 1 inch MOA from the bench is important you stand a better chance with a Remington out of the box than a Winchester or Ruger. If it's a reliable hunting rifle you need and can live with 1 1/2 to 2 inches MOA choose the latter. gg.
"I generally avoid temptation unless I can't resist it."
First cent....
CRF, having to chamber a round upside down is highly unlikely. However, one documented incident that I'm aware of saw the shooter using a tree trunk for a rest. After the first shot with his 375 HH post 64 push feed the Cape Buffalo charged. As he worked the action the shooter simultaneously spun around to the other side of the trunk for the next shot but upon pulling the trigger nothing happened. The guide dropped the buffalo. Thinking he had a misfire he opened the bolt only to find an empty chamber. The live round was lying on the ground. Seemingly when he spun around and at the same time working the action the round had fallen from the action and the bolt closed on an empty chamber. Maybe CRF not quite as accurate but definitely more reliable.
Second cent....
My bolt action rifles are all CRF, Winchesters & Rugers. I'll give you that they may not be quite as accurate as say the Remington 700. However, IMHO 1 inch at a hundred yards is inconsequential when your shooting at an animal in the field with no bench rest. And a big advantage of the Mouser style CRF action is the 3 position safety over the Remington action which allows the bolt to open when cocked and safety on. Carrying a rifle in thick woods, sometimes in hand sometimes slung over the shoulder will inevitably see the bolt on a Remington catch on something and be fully or partially opened. If 1 inch MOA from the bench is important you stand a better chance with a Remington out of the box than a Winchester or Ruger. If it's a reliable hunting rifle you need and can live with 1 1/2 to 2 inches MOA choose the latter. gg.
"I generally avoid temptation unless I can't resist it."