Friends,
I live in a remote area of Southwest Virginia less than 1 mile from the Ky. state line.
There are more elk on this side than on that side and rest easy they ARE wild.

Va. has opened season on elk and I have hunted whitetail for years and it is much harder to get an elk into bow range.

The anamals that were released may or may not have been from game farms. I don't know. There offspring surely were not.They were born here on this mountain and the only fence here is around my front yard.

As for breeding "super deer" I'm with Rob on this one. This sounds like a Keith Warren show. Any fishing trip he takes is at one of the "pay to play" lakes in Mexico so why would a hunting trip be any different?

I would love to see him on some National Forest land with tree rat hunters everywhere and a man every 100 yards or so.

Soon deer will be regesterd like dogs are with the AKC if this keeps up.

Where is the sport to a hunt if you can sit in a lodge and pick out your "trophy" from a catalog? Is this selective breeding natural?

When is it to much? I think we are well past that point now.

Sorry boys I guess this is sort of a sore spot for me.I had to vent

SF

That's pretty sad. Do they believe penning the does and artificial insemenating them is something that won't happen in the wild? It was my understanding that the dominate deer had breeding rights; thus the superior deer would be the ones breeding those same does. I use to think about getting some sheep and come slaughter time I'd take them out with a bow. I thought about it some more and come to the conclusion that it'd be unethical-for me anyways-because there would be no fair chase. Domestic sheep wouldn't fear me or run away, they'd just stand there and be shot. It's nice to know they'd be normal after three months, but until they return to complete wild wouldn't they just be coyote/wolf bait? Three months in the wild seems like slim chances for survival when you don't have the instincts to take care of yourself. Which comes to another point, if the does are penned up they'll eventually become domesticated. It's my understanding that the lack of survival instincts would be passed to the fawns; making them less likely to become survival conscious. I could be wrong on that part, I'm not impressively knowledgable on such things, but the deer still wouldn't be "completely" wild. I think management is a good idea, where it's applicable, but by natural means. Deer aren't robots or experiments, and the woods isn't a science lab. It's my uneducated opinion that harvesting does, especially in urban areas, is the best thing to do for this. Lower the populations so deer aren't coming out of the seems so to say, while letting the little ones grow. I wouldn't expect greenhorns, like myself, to be that strict about it, but I feel that after a few deer we should start setting better standards for ourselves and start thinking about it. I also realize that some hunters are in situations were it'd be difficult for them to pass on smaller deer, waiting for a larger deer that may not even be there, or they may not have the time for. That's my opinion on it, I'm not trying to talk down on anyone who does otherwise, so I hope I don't make anyone mad.

God bless,
Brandan

There are extremes in most situations. Breeding deer in pens and releasing them in the wild is definitely towards one extreme end and unacceptable for many if not most hunters. On the other extreme, we have hunters who shoot the first deer they see, with no concern for the condition of the herd. I'm hoping most hunters don't fall into this category.

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>It was my understanding that the dominate deer had breeding rights; thus the superior deer would be the ones breeding those same does. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

It would be nice if such a thing happened, but around here, it's generally the first 1.5 yr buck that wanders by.

Big Country thanks for the replay, I agree with the fact that it isn't a hunt if they are pened in and have been raised that way, but if they get out and live in the wild I won't have a problem taking one with my bow.

I saw the show....it was keith warren..what a sorry excuse for a hunter. I’m glad to see that the show bothered others besides myself. Worst part is that the ranch is about 30 minutes from my house. All the land it TX is like that. As long as you have the $$$$$ you can hunt. I stick to public land because I refuse to pay someone to hunt wildlife that isn’t theirs to begin with. I grew up in the Northwest where you just go out and hunt..wehrever you want , so this hunting lease thing is new to me, I don’t like it!

doc...ranches like you mentioned make me sick and the nimrods that hunt them make me even sicker. HOWEVER...this is NOT what QDM (Quality Deer Management) is about! So please do not mistake the two.

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Doc,

Howdy! I haven't talked to you in awhile. I spend nearly all of my time on the traditional forum. But this thread caught my eye, especially when I saw that you started it. Good to talk to you again!

As for the type of show discussed. Be careful what videos you purchase. They, too, hunt deer behing fences, e.g., Texas ranches, Sanctuary in Michigan, etc. They are just smart enough to talk about the &quot;unique management techniques being used.&quot;

Thaere are some Game Management Techniques used I don't have a problem with. For example, 8 pt or better in given zones, does only in others, or whatever is required to achieve a good herd balance.

I don't care for most of the TV hunting shows, other than Wayne Carlton's Elk Country Journal, and the horde of videos that are on the market.

Bill



Praise the Lord, He is worthy

ttt

Praise the Lord, He is worthy