"MANAGEMENT" my fears have come true
 

Several members have questioned why I am against &quot;managing&quot; the wild animal we hunt. I understand the principle behind it- a desire to harvest a record Buck- but my fear all along was that it would deminish the older records and that it would begin to domesticate our wild deer. The ? is where do you draw the line. Do you hand feed them or enclose them in and eventually treat them like domesticated cattle- Well. it has happened. I watched a program on the outdoor channel today that sickened me and sortof made me embarrased to have the same title as these people (Hunter). The show (I can't remember his name- but it was Hunting and outdoors with somebody) They were &quot;HUNTING<img src=icon_smile_angry.gif border=0 align=middle>&quot; from a ranch named Mustang-creek in Texas. It started out as your typical management hunting show- hailing the ability of certain engenierd feed to grow massive racks and then sitting over a trough and sitting their picking and choosing whick Trophy they would kill. But then my fears came to fruition- they began to explain and even praise the process that this land was managed with. It's a &quot;cutting edge&quot; technology called AI- artificial insemination. That's right- these does are penned up- captured- corralled- Master deer seaman is the inserted into the does uterous. Then the fawns are penned and bottle fed- but don't worry (and I quote) &quot;...bottle fed deer return to complete wild after three months of being released...&quot;<img src=icon_smile_question.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_angry.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_angry.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle> This idiot even had the nerve to state that when horses and cattle were first domesticated their where naysayers too, so he expected disagreement among his fellow hunters at first. He called this &quot;management come full circle&quot; and that we agree on. With more and more people measuring the succsess of their hunt by the size of the antlers- this is the direction we are heading. Why plant special crops for the sole purpose of growing huge bucks, why focuse only on the size of the antler- what has happened to the challenge and the joy being the HUNT!!! and not the shot- or the mount- or the craftiness of our managing technices????? What is becoming of our Sport?????

RE: "MANAGEMENT" my fears have come true
 

Doc, I understand your concerns. However, no deer that is from an enclosure, no matter how large of an enclosure, is allowed to be entered into any currently established record book. ie:Boone & Crocket, Pope-Young, or Buckmasters.
I imagine people have already tried to enter into these books with deer killed inside a fence, and maybe have gotten away with it, but it is not legal to do so.
If the deer on this particular ranch are being released back into the wild, then the Texas wildlife people should step in and put an immediate stop to it!

NRA,UBP,BASS Member
New Stanton,PA

RE: "MANAGEMENT" my fears have come true
 

Doc. I agree with you 100% living it texas I have seen it all its big money.I lost my lease because of it.The only good thing about this type of ranch is the big holes that they get in there high fence.<img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>Its not hunting its shoting someones pet,unless they get out into the wild and they have to make it on there own.Good luck with your season.

RE: "MANAGEMENT" my fears have come true
 

Big Country what is the problem with them being released into the wild? Don't they become wild deer if hey have to find there own food?Isn't that what they do when they stock fish in ponds? Kinda like the elk in kentucky.

RE: "MANAGEMENT" my fears have come true
 

they aint goin out and hunting them elk,they are re-establishing a wild population

RE: "MANAGEMENT" my fears have come true
 

I wouldn't doubt it was Hunting and Outdoor Adventures with Kieth Warren....his show is as pathetic as they come.

<font color=blue>Good Luck and Good Shooting</font id=blue>

<font color=red>Rob</font id=red>

RE: "MANAGEMENT" my fears have come true
 

The elk in Ky are hunted but by only a lottery of 10 or so people.The difference is there isn't a fence involved.There are elk in a fence at Land Between the Lakes but they are not hunted.


I don't have a problem with management because what makes bigger racks also makes healthier deer.I don't like the artificial insimination because you are screwing with nature.This is 1 thing that I agree with the books,(1 of few things).Don't allow the fenced deer into the books or artificialy grown deer.

RE: "MANAGEMENT" my fears have come true
 

Why not just clone the big bucks? They've done it with sheep.<img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle>

I agree with Doc. There is a big difference between wildlife management and &quot;deer farming&quot;. This is something that shouldn't be done with wild animals.

RE: "MANAGEMENT" my fears have come true
 

doc,
i agree with you on this. i like to kill a big buck as good as anybody,but this is stupid. i want to enjoy the hunt not so much the kill. i could do that with my daddys cows. im glad they haven't started doing this i georgia.

tracey moore

RE: "MANAGEMENT" my fears have come true
 

Texastracker, to the best of my knowledge(which is often incomplete<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>) the elk in kentucky were wild animals that were trapped and then transplanted. They were not bottle fed as babies.

To answer your question as to whether the deer become wild after being released into the wild, I only have one case of first hand knowledge on this subject.

A buddy of mine owns a rather large farm in westmoreland Co., PA. Anyway, 4 1/2 years ago he found a roadkilled doe by his driveway, with a pair of newborn fawns standing beside her. These fawns were probably less than 24 hours old.
He took the fawns to his barn, they allowed him to pick them up. He and his wife bottle fed them for days. He contacted the game commision about keeping them, and was told he would have to apply for a permit, build a pen to their specs, and what all else I don`t remember. So, my buddy just kept his barn doors wide open so they were free to go whenever they wished. By the time they were 3 monthes old, they were rarely ever around the barn. By 6 monthes of age they never went back into the barn, they lived in the woods, but would come into the yard to get attention every day. When they were one year old, the doe, there was one buck and one doe fawn, the doe went into the barn and promptly dropped her first fawn. Now she nursed her own fawn, and even though that fawn was born in the barn, and watched her mother get petted by humans everyday, she would not let anyone close to her.
Almost 4 1/2 years now since the day my buddy brought those little fawns home and bottle fed them, and I can still see them in the woods while hunting, walk up and pet the doe. The buck grew a big 10 point rack in his 3rd year, and was promptly shot on another farm.
So, my only firsthand knowledge of bottle feeding deer tells me that once a pet, always a pet.

NRA,UBP,BASS Member
New Stanton,PA