Does anyone care about accuracy?
04-13-2005 | 11:01 AM
#31
Giant Nontypical
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 6,440
Likes: 0
From: California
RE: Does anyone care about accuracy?
Okay i'm going to feel dumb asking this but i have to. Aside from the poundage you shoot, what truely makes one arrow go faster then the other? (and aside from weight)
04-13-2005 | 12:48 PM
#32
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 137
Likes: 0
From: Gillett, PA
RE: Does anyone care about accuracy?
ORIGINAL: BGfisher
This is not bashing. It's called educating. I'm an old school guy, and I try to pass on a lot of the info I've gained over the decades. I also learn something from the younger guys. It's a two way street. If you can't handle it then just don't tune in.
Let's say I'm not totally old school. One has to be flexible. I've shot bows that were 50" long from the 70's on up. 20% letoff to 88% letoff. I now own two Martin bows that are less than a year old. I'm a speed freak. One bow is 38" long and it's a screamer, with 6.5" brace and highly reflexed riser. I also have a new ShadowCat that is 32 1/4" long with a 9 3/8" riser and virually no reflex. I shoot them both equally well, considering my abilities these days. Which one is more consistently accurate? The longer one by all means.
There is a lot to consider when talking about accuracy. Definition alone is different for different folks. Some guys think pie-plates at 30 yards are good enough. Then there are those of us who like to have 2" groups at 40 yards and will accept nothing less. Then there are bows capable of this and there are some that are not (in the hands of an archer). Length is only part of it though. Riser geometry and brace ehgith play an important part, too. It's no secret that longer ATA, deflexed risers, and higher brace height makes for a more accurate bow. How many pro's do you see shooting 32" bows?
And target and 3D is different from hunting. We don't necessarily need pinpoint accuracy to shoot anything within 30 yards. But a person should be able to shoot no greater than 4" groups at that 30 yards (IMO) or do something different, whether it's practicing more or getting more forgiving equipment. And frankly, 4" groups at 30 yards isn't all that good. Where I think some fall short is in accepting such grouping as "good enough for hunting". Personally I'll never be satisfied till I can robinhood every arrow I shoot, so I guess I'll never be satisfied. But striving to get better is what life is about.
Did I get off track a bit? Sorry
This is not bashing. It's called educating. I'm an old school guy, and I try to pass on a lot of the info I've gained over the decades. I also learn something from the younger guys. It's a two way street. If you can't handle it then just don't tune in.
Let's say I'm not totally old school. One has to be flexible. I've shot bows that were 50" long from the 70's on up. 20% letoff to 88% letoff. I now own two Martin bows that are less than a year old. I'm a speed freak. One bow is 38" long and it's a screamer, with 6.5" brace and highly reflexed riser. I also have a new ShadowCat that is 32 1/4" long with a 9 3/8" riser and virually no reflex. I shoot them both equally well, considering my abilities these days. Which one is more consistently accurate? The longer one by all means.
There is a lot to consider when talking about accuracy. Definition alone is different for different folks. Some guys think pie-plates at 30 yards are good enough. Then there are those of us who like to have 2" groups at 40 yards and will accept nothing less. Then there are bows capable of this and there are some that are not (in the hands of an archer). Length is only part of it though. Riser geometry and brace ehgith play an important part, too. It's no secret that longer ATA, deflexed risers, and higher brace height makes for a more accurate bow. How many pro's do you see shooting 32" bows?
And target and 3D is different from hunting. We don't necessarily need pinpoint accuracy to shoot anything within 30 yards. But a person should be able to shoot no greater than 4" groups at that 30 yards (IMO) or do something different, whether it's practicing more or getting more forgiving equipment. And frankly, 4" groups at 30 yards isn't all that good. Where I think some fall short is in accepting such grouping as "good enough for hunting". Personally I'll never be satisfied till I can robinhood every arrow I shoot, so I guess I'll never be satisfied. But striving to get better is what life is about.
Did I get off track a bit? Sorry
04-13-2005 | 05:16 PM
#33
Giant Nontypical
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,175
Likes: 0
RE: Does anyone care about accuracy?
I wish the Administrators would lock out these threads too. I am sick of the slow bow GODS bashing fast bows. I never bash other peoples bows or set ups.
No. If you hate fast bows, thats your right. I am quite comfortable with my set up and don't need or want your "education."
04-13-2005 | 06:22 PM
#34
Nontypical Buck
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,625
Likes: 0
From: Middletown PA United States
RE: Does anyone care about accuracy?
Arthur, that's more or lesswhat I was aying but apparently Medic is thin skinned and thick headed. Says he doesn't need my education. That's fine, but then one who doesn't want to learn is well.....youy know what I mean. I did mention that one should be flexible in this sport if he wants to learn.
And for the record, I'm not against speed. I'm totally for it. I've been chasing that mythical 300fps for 1 years and finally got a bow that will do it. Albeit a 3D setup, but at 27" draw and 53# that is smoking.
Flexibility young man. The sport changes every year. Gotta keep up. But don't throw out the past. Never know when you'll need some of that info.
And for the record, I'm not against speed. I'm totally for it. I've been chasing that mythical 300fps for 1 years and finally got a bow that will do it. Albeit a 3D setup, but at 27" draw and 53# that is smoking.
Flexibility young man. The sport changes every year. Gotta keep up. But don't throw out the past. Never know when you'll need some of that info.
04-13-2005 | 07:49 PM
#35
Giant Nontypical
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 7,876
Likes: 0
From: Ohio
RE: Does anyone care about accuracy?
ORIGINAL: BGfisher
And for the record, I'm not against speed. I'm totally for it. I've been chasing that mythical 300fps for 1 years and finally got a bow that will do it. Albeit a 3D setup, but at 27" draw and 53# that is smoking.
And for the record, I'm not against speed. I'm totally for it. I've been chasing that mythical 300fps for 1 years and finally got a bow that will do it. Albeit a 3D setup, but at 27" draw and 53# that is smoking.
04-13-2005 | 08:34 PM
#36
Giant Nontypical
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 6,634
Likes: 0
From: HENDERSON KY USA
RE: Does anyone care about accuracy?
Hey swamp dog,Michael Braden could most likely outshoot 99% of the people on this sight 99% of the time with any bow BUT he CHOOSES to shoot the PROELITE for tournaments and an ULTRATEC for hunting.I know the Proelite has the longer xt3000 limbs and I am pretty sure when I was looking at his Ultratec this fall that it had the xt3000 limbs on it too.They both have spirals,he chooses them because the wall makes him more accurate.
Now,if the best in archery are choosing bows that are more forgiving,what the heck do the rest of us need.[:-]
Not trying to point fingers or tell anyone what they need to shoot but when I saw Braden's name brought up,I thought it was funny because I just happened to get a look at what he chooses to hunt with last fall.
I personally am an accuracy freak as opposed to a speed freak and I choose a Protec to shoot targets with but I have an xtec to hunt with.The Protec is twice the shooter than the Xtec but the xtec is a great hunting bow and forgiving to a point.I have extreme confidence in killing deer with it out to 40+ yards but if I want to hit 12 rings at 40 yards I better be shooting the Protec.
Now,if the best in archery are choosing bows that are more forgiving,what the heck do the rest of us need.[:-]
Not trying to point fingers or tell anyone what they need to shoot but when I saw Braden's name brought up,I thought it was funny because I just happened to get a look at what he chooses to hunt with last fall.
I personally am an accuracy freak as opposed to a speed freak and I choose a Protec to shoot targets with but I have an xtec to hunt with.The Protec is twice the shooter than the Xtec but the xtec is a great hunting bow and forgiving to a point.I have extreme confidence in killing deer with it out to 40+ yards but if I want to hit 12 rings at 40 yards I better be shooting the Protec.
04-14-2005 | 08:39 AM
#37
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 137
Likes: 0
From: Gillett, PA
RE: Does anyone care about accuracy?
ORIGINAL: BGfisher
Arthur, that's more or lesswhat I was aying but apparently Medic is thin skinned and thick headed. Says he doesn't need my education. That's fine, but then one who doesn't want to learn is well.....youy know what I mean. I did mention that one should be flexible in this sport if he wants to learn.
And for the record, I'm not against speed. I'm totally for it. I've been chasing that mythical 300fps for 1 years and finally got a bow that will do it. Albeit a 3D setup, but at 27" draw and 53# that is smoking.
Flexibility young man. The sport changes every year. Gotta keep up. But don't throw out the past. Never know when you'll need some of that info.
Arthur, that's more or lesswhat I was aying but apparently Medic is thin skinned and thick headed. Says he doesn't need my education. That's fine, but then one who doesn't want to learn is well.....youy know what I mean. I did mention that one should be flexible in this sport if he wants to learn.
And for the record, I'm not against speed. I'm totally for it. I've been chasing that mythical 300fps for 1 years and finally got a bow that will do it. Albeit a 3D setup, but at 27" draw and 53# that is smoking.
Flexibility young man. The sport changes every year. Gotta keep up. But don't throw out the past. Never know when you'll need some of that info.
I have never said anything about older shooters. I shoot with a 62yo and a 72yo regulary. I learn much about archery history from them and want education from such men. The 62 yo outshoots me every day. He has been shooting for years and I have not. So I learn much from them about the art of archery. I do not need to learn from those that only accept those who believe like they do and is intolerant of those who do not.
I signed up to this forum to learn from those with experience and have found out that this is a forum to berate those that do not agree with you. So I guess I did learn something from this site.
04-14-2005 | 09:28 AM
#38
Nontypical Buck
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,720
Likes: 0
From: Cornwall, Pa.
RE: Does anyone care about accuracy?
I agree with you ewolf. The speed deal is a selling tool for manufactures. Bows, arrows and the trick stuff that your REALLY must have. Then they wonder why there is always something wrong with the bow. Strings-cables, limbs and risers going south. And of course it's the manufacturer's product that causes all the problems not the setup. Eventually the light goes on and the archer decides on a middle of the line set up. Walla! An easy to tune setup that lasts for years without constant adjustments and repairs. Next time your watch a hunting video. Check out the cams on the bow your favorite personality is using. Mild cams or even round wheels with a longer axle to axle bow. They may advertise the super dooper cams, but just look closely at their selection. Time to wake up.
04-14-2005 | 09:33 AM
#39
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 941
Likes: 0
From: West CO
RE: Does anyone care about accuracy?
I keep reading things like... speed vs accuracy
or...
I am an accuracy freak not a speed freak.
Well...
I am an accuracy freak and I shoot around 300 fps. My buddies are accuracy freaks and they shoot about 320 fps. You can have both! I shoot the alliegance for it's versatility and feel. Speed is a usefull byproduct. I like to shoot: 3D, spot, Techno, 100 yard backyard stuff, hunting, and more. For some things the speed is useful for some it isn't needed at all, but it is there just the same. I did not sacrifice any accuracy for speed.
I am an everything freak. [8D] I agree that you can go overboard on speed and it will affect your accuracy (though it takes a lot), but in moderation, both can easily co-exist.
One friend I shoot with has been shooting and hunting for probably 40 years or so, and he can shoot! We shoot out to 90 and 100 yards at his place on a regular basis. I have witnessed him shoot Skoal cans at 70 yards, with is Patriot shooting 319fps. He shoots 83#'s with a 425gr arrow. If he is sacrificing so much accuracy than I would love to see him shoot with one of these "slow accurate bows"[8D] Maybe he would shaft his arrows at 70 yards then.[:-]
And no I don't bash you guys who aren't speed freaks. To tell you the truth accuracy is more important and high speed it isn't really needed at all (well to a point obviously). But if you can balance the two it is highly advantagous.
P.S.
I would like to shoot a Proelite once. That is one hoyt I have never shot.
or...
I am an accuracy freak not a speed freak.
Well...
I am an accuracy freak and I shoot around 300 fps. My buddies are accuracy freaks and they shoot about 320 fps. You can have both! I shoot the alliegance for it's versatility and feel. Speed is a usefull byproduct. I like to shoot: 3D, spot, Techno, 100 yard backyard stuff, hunting, and more. For some things the speed is useful for some it isn't needed at all, but it is there just the same. I did not sacrifice any accuracy for speed.
I am an everything freak. [8D] I agree that you can go overboard on speed and it will affect your accuracy (though it takes a lot), but in moderation, both can easily co-exist. One friend I shoot with has been shooting and hunting for probably 40 years or so, and he can shoot! We shoot out to 90 and 100 yards at his place on a regular basis. I have witnessed him shoot Skoal cans at 70 yards, with is Patriot shooting 319fps. He shoots 83#'s with a 425gr arrow. If he is sacrificing so much accuracy than I would love to see him shoot with one of these "slow accurate bows"
[8D] Maybe he would shaft his arrows at 70 yards then.[:-]And no I don't bash you guys who aren't speed freaks. To tell you the truth accuracy is more important and high speed it isn't really needed at all (well to a point obviously). But if you can balance the two it is highly advantagous.
P.S.
I would like to shoot a Proelite once. That is one hoyt I have never shot.