Didn't mean to single out game cams as a bad thing..........I actually think they are pretty cool. If I didn't think it would be stolen in 2 days I would try one out.

It is nice to go back to the woods after a week and see time stamped pics of deer you would never have known were there............just seems like nocturnal deer movements are something they always used as a secret to avoid the dangers that lurk in the daytime light..........now they are being watched 24/7.

Yea.........I wonder how many times a buck is willing to get zapped by a flash and whirl of a camera before he heads for the hills.

Over a food pile and they may not mind as much.......at least they get something out of it.

oh ABSO-TIVLEY POSO-LUTLEY. they woudl sell faster than you and i could ever fathom. BUT at that point i think that teh "FUN" that is involved in making a hunt sucessfull woudl be taken away. the countless hours spent scouting... and checking signs and setying up game cams....

i agree...

now where the line gets crossed maybe closer than we think... there are peopel out there everyday who's sole purpouse is to make new laws to prevent you from doing what you want to do. lets not leave it up to the people to descide.... i mean we are a bunch of morons...

i think this has the makings of a DAMN GOOD discusion.

BTW; do it today for tomorrow it may be illegal!

I think you can take any person out there who is of average skills and dexterity and make them lethal with todays equipment in 1-2 weeks time.

Send them into the woods with a good deer population and they stand a very good chance of taking a deer..........not a mature buck..........but a deer.

That is saying something because years ago that was unheard of.

I guess the question I have is, even with all the gadgets imagineable, how likely are you to take a wall hanger? I believe the percentages to be extremely low. With these low percentages, I believe we are far from becoming overly "odds-in-our-favor" hunters. The hardest thing is to get that bigboy in front of you, and then make the shot. They may make gadgets to help with the second, but the first will almost always come from hard work and knowledge.

No sweat!

With all the overpriced, gimmicks, junk, complex, prone to malfunction, sensitive shooting, short lasting, gear that is on the market, that many shooters believe is a substitute for necessary skills, and is detrimental to successful hunts and to some bowhunters eagerness to stay in the sport, it all balances out.

In the past several years, I am aware of several new and unseasoned bowhunters dropping out of the sport of bowhunting. It is not uncommon to meets bowhunters in the field that are carrying and wearing the best "Gucci" gear that barely know the basics of bowhunting deer and cannot track a hit deer unless the deer is leaving their own trail markers evey five feet.

I am mixed on this issue. I have my way of hunting, and yes i make use of technology, and some "traditional" skills. It's man's nature to keep improving and making things easier for himself. Look at the fishing industry. Until they make a bait that catches fish EVERY cast, we will still have flying lures, helicopter lures and banjo minnows

Much of the gadgetry out there is of no use, unless in the proper hands anyways. Some of it is highly specialized, and some of it is just junk. No one out there is forced to use the latest technology.

Before we get off on a tangent........I wasn't really referring to the "Deerview Mirror" kinda gadgets that we all know are useless.

I just meant the solid pieces of equipment that many if not all of us carry on a regular basis that has helped swing the odds in our favor.

Releases, GPS, rangefinders, lightning accurate bows putting massive KE into incredibly deadly broadheads, climbers, camo, cameras etc.

These are pretty stock gear in todays world I would say.

With no skill they are as useless as a rubber crutch............but the amount of skill needed to use them successfully can be found in almost anyone in minimal time.



If I had a dollar for every time I saw a guy step to the first tee with $1,500 worth of equipment and clothes............and duff his way to the ladies tee


I thought all bowhunters had to take a instructional class before getting a license. You mean to tell me this class doesn't teach them all the stuff they need to know?

Depends what you consider a wall hanger.


Big trophy mature bucks will always be the exception due to sheer numbers.............and I would guess that "trophy" hunters make up a small percentage of hunters over all anyways.

Having said that............don't you think equipment wise we have helped our chance for success even on big bucks in the last 5-10 years??

Here is fair chase as defined on the Pope & Young website:

Fair Chase
From its beginnings, the Club has grown to epitomize fair chase and sportsmanship in hunting. This fair chase philosophy reaches to the very foundations of the hunting spirit; it remains a dominant factor in the personal hunting ethic of every responsible individual; it is key to bowhunting's future with deep roots in America's hunting heritage. Simply defined, fair chase is the ethical, sportsmanlike, and lawful pursuit of free-ranging wild game animals in a manner which does not give the hunter an improper or unfair advantage over the animal. It does, however, extend beyond the hunt itself; it is an attitude and a way of life based in a deep-seated respect for wildlife, for the environment, and for other individuals who share the bounty of this vast continent's natural resources.

The term "Fair Chase" shall not include the taking of animals under the following conditions:

Helpless in a trap, deep snow or water, or on ice.
From any power vehicle or power boat.
By "jacklighting" or shining at night.
By the use of any tranquilizers or poisons.
While inside escape-proof fenced enclosures.
By the use of any power vehicles or power boats for herding or driving animals, including use of aircraft to land alongside or to communicate with or direct a hunter on the ground.
By the use of electronic devices for attracting, locating, or pursuing game or guiding the hunter to such game, or by the use of a bow or arrow to which any electronic device is attached.
Any other condition considered by the Board of Directors as unacceptable.
SPECIAL NOTE: For the purpose of the Pope and Young Club's Records Program, a bow shall be defined as a longbow, recurve bow or compound bow that is hand-held and hand-drawn, and that has no mechanical device to enable the hunter to lock the bow at full or partial draw. Other than energy stored by the drawn bow, no device to propel the arrow will be permitted. A let-off exceeding sixty-five (65) percent, using the A.M.O. standard method of measurement, will be listed with an asterisk (*) in the Records. For further information, please click here for the "Definition of a Hunting Bow, Arrow and Broadhead"


Although we can gain advantages from new products we are by choice choosing a weapon with greater limitations. We as bow hunters are looking for more in terms of "the experience" in hunting than the killing. I believe this is shown everytime a bow is picked up instead of a rifle. I'd gladly give up some of my high tech gadgets if the option was that or hunting with a rifle. All of the gadgets you've listed can give a hunter an advantage but they can't take the place of true skill. Being 40 feet up a tree in an area without deer is no good. Neither is setting up a game can where there are no deer. A 300+ fps bow with razor tipped carbons dose no good if you're not with in range. I could go on but I'm sure you see my point.

Even with all the advancments the bow hunter is still has the smallest advantage IMO than any other type of hunter in the woods.