Pass through with sharp blades verse "dull" blades
10-04-2008, 09:01 PM
#81
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Dover, PA USA
Posts: 5,497
RE: Pass through with sharp blades verse "dull" blades
ORIGINAL: buckmaster
Matt/PA spake:
What is it with you and Rob tonight? Have yall pushed the little red hand on me?
Didnt you even read page one?
Buckmaster Spake:
edit:forgot thes little guys[8D]
Matt/PA spake:
Listen everything in an animal aside from the bodily fluids is basically elastic. Blood vessels, hide, organs tendons you name it.......if things didn't have elasticity animals in general would snap organs and vessels and everything else inside the first time they jump up and down.
Dull allows blades to push aside elastic materials.........slide one through a rubber band once and tell me how great it works. Arteries and veins are very much like a rubber band in toughness. They have to be orall mammals woulddie during everyday activities.
Dull equals less trauma, lessened bleeding and potentially uncut vessels and slower death.
Dull allows blades to push aside elastic materials.........slide one through a rubber band once and tell me how great it works. Arteries and veins are very much like a rubber band in toughness. They have to be orall mammals woulddie during everyday activities.
Dull equals less trauma, lessened bleeding and potentially uncut vessels and slower death.
Didnt you even read page one?
Buckmaster Spake:
No, Your exactly right, think about all of the veins and arterys running through a deers vital, a sharp blade will severe(sp) the aterys/veins where as a dull one would push, stretch, bruise them. Like a rubber band, push a sharp one accross them, then push a dull one.
edit:forgot thes little guys[8D]
Don't push me.
10-04-2008, 10:28 PM
#83
Fork Horn
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: State of Confusion
Posts: 172
RE: Pass through with sharp blades verse "dull" blades
Cant believe I am gonna respond here. Is it possible to shoot a dull head through a deer? Sure it is but this is not a matter of physics it is a matter of physioligy. Trauma induces the release of platelets to a specific area which helps in the clotting process. All bodies do this to protect themselves. The less trauma induced the less of a reaction from the body to protect itself. (sharper= less trauma)
Would doctors rather see a clean cut or a jagged cut? Of course the clean one because they are trying to fix it. A chain saw wound is miserable for doctors to fix, but its tough to sneak up on a deer with a running chain saw too.
As far as the stone heads are concerned burnie is correct they can be knapped to 1 micron in thickness a surgeons scalpel on average is 25 microns in thickness.
just my 0.02
Rogue
Would doctors rather see a clean cut or a jagged cut? Of course the clean one because they are trying to fix it. A chain saw wound is miserable for doctors to fix, but its tough to sneak up on a deer with a running chain saw too.
As far as the stone heads are concerned burnie is correct they can be knapped to 1 micron in thickness a surgeons scalpel on average is 25 microns in thickness.
just my 0.02
Rogue
10-04-2008, 10:39 PM
#84
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Gleason, TN
Posts: 1,327
RE: Pass through with sharp blades verse "dull" blades
Knapped heads are very sharp and have been effective over the last 5,000 years or so. As to what edge causes more damage/ less clotting, I don't know, I'm not a doctor (I know it's a big shock to everyone[8D]). The fact remains, a sharper head will penetrate deeper since it has less resistance than a dull head.
If you sneak a dull broadhead into the lungs, heart, or liver, the punture wound probably will be fatal, but as to what gives you a better "edge" in the field, no question, a razor sharp broadhead is where it's at.
If you sneak a dull broadhead into the lungs, heart, or liver, the punture wound probably will be fatal, but as to what gives you a better "edge" in the field, no question, a razor sharp broadhead is where it's at.
10-04-2008, 10:47 PM
#85
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,193
RE: Pass through with sharp blades verse "dull" blades
I disagree with anysharp bladetalkand blood trails. If the arrow passes through ..regardless of dull or sharp......you have a large blood trail....
I do believe sharper blades will help with penetration....but lets be real...with the speed most of us compound shooters are using ...does it matter? Dull or not...at 20 yards @ 290 FPS + you're going through lungs.
I have taken multiple animals with the same NAP spitfire mechanical..over and over...I clean the hair and tissue out of the grooves and they continue to work fine.
I do believe sharper blades will help with penetration....but lets be real...with the speed most of us compound shooters are using ...does it matter? Dull or not...at 20 yards @ 290 FPS + you're going through lungs.
I have taken multiple animals with the same NAP spitfire mechanical..over and over...I clean the hair and tissue out of the grooves and they continue to work fine.
10-04-2008, 10:52 PM
#86
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location:
Posts: 6,006
RE: Pass through with sharp blades verse "dull" blades
First off, I only got to page five before I get fed up with the BS I was reading and decided to post, so if I happen to mention something that was posted in the remaining several pages, I appologize.
Nissan - Apparently you need someone to explain to you that there is a difference between a dull blade and a serrated blade. A serrated blade is still sharp. A dull blade is, well, dull. I honestly can't understand the logic behind your thinking, if you've even got any. Are you posting simply to post and stir the pot or do you really buy into the crap thats coming out of your mouth?
I've really got to agree with Rob here, this thread is advocating the use of dull blades. Anyone who says that a dull blade is just as effective as a razor sharp blade is completely off base.
Ever get a paper cut? How bad did it bleed? Pretty bad, I bet. How long did it take to stop? Quite awhile, would be my guess. Wonder why? Less tissue was actually damaged, sending less responses to your body to tell it to begin the process of repairing the damaged tissue. When you cut yourself with a dull blade, the tissue is torn, sending more signals telling your body to start clotting and repaiging itself.
On top of that, if the dull blades don't manage to snag the tissue and tear it, its simply pushing the veins, arterys, and organs out of the way without damaging them at all. Yeah, you'll get a passthrough, no problem. Yeah, you might kill your deer, but I garauntee you your blood trail will be less than optimal.
Always replace or resharpen your broadheads before using them. We owe it to the game we pursue to put them down as quickly and humanely as we possibly can. Why take the chance of getting anything less than an optimal blood trail to follow?
Nissan - Apparently you need someone to explain to you that there is a difference between a dull blade and a serrated blade. A serrated blade is still sharp. A dull blade is, well, dull. I honestly can't understand the logic behind your thinking, if you've even got any. Are you posting simply to post and stir the pot or do you really buy into the crap thats coming out of your mouth?
I've really got to agree with Rob here, this thread is advocating the use of dull blades. Anyone who says that a dull blade is just as effective as a razor sharp blade is completely off base.
Ever get a paper cut? How bad did it bleed? Pretty bad, I bet. How long did it take to stop? Quite awhile, would be my guess. Wonder why? Less tissue was actually damaged, sending less responses to your body to tell it to begin the process of repairing the damaged tissue. When you cut yourself with a dull blade, the tissue is torn, sending more signals telling your body to start clotting and repaiging itself.
On top of that, if the dull blades don't manage to snag the tissue and tear it, its simply pushing the veins, arterys, and organs out of the way without damaging them at all. Yeah, you'll get a passthrough, no problem. Yeah, you might kill your deer, but I garauntee you your blood trail will be less than optimal.
Always replace or resharpen your broadheads before using them. We owe it to the game we pursue to put them down as quickly and humanely as we possibly can. Why take the chance of getting anything less than an optimal blood trail to follow?
10-04-2008, 10:54 PM
#87
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: May 2006
Location: MA
Posts: 1,653
RE: Pass through with sharp blades verse "dull" blades
"I have taken multiple animals with the same NAP spitfire mechanical..over and over...I clean the hair and tissue out of the grooves and they continue to work fine."
WOW!! Send me your address and I will send you a buck or two toward new broadheads..
10-05-2008, 12:01 AM
#88
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location:
Posts: 3,465
RE: Pass through with sharp blades verse "dull" blades
nissan, do a test for me....
Gather a serrated steak knife that is 3-4 years old from your kitchen, nice and used....then get a brand new straight razor.
Extend your left arm, cut it with the serrated steak knife with moderate pressure.
Watch the bleeding and observe how long it takes to quit.
Now move down the arm 6 inches, again cut yourself with the same moderate pressure only this time with straightrazor.
Watch the gushing blood, and observe how long it takes to quit ( if it ever does)
The reasoning is simple, bleeding stops from coagulation...meaning proteins form with platelets from the blood to form a clot. The more cells damaged(dull head tearing tissue) the more platelets sent to cut and the clot forms faster.....less cells damaged (clean cut) means less platelets, and the cut cant adequately heal itself as quickly....the blood just keeps flowing.
If you cant accept that for an answer I can find an article where a scientist says it in bigger words, if that will make anyone feel better about it.
Gather a serrated steak knife that is 3-4 years old from your kitchen, nice and used....then get a brand new straight razor.
Extend your left arm, cut it with the serrated steak knife with moderate pressure.
Watch the bleeding and observe how long it takes to quit.
Now move down the arm 6 inches, again cut yourself with the same moderate pressure only this time with straightrazor.
Watch the gushing blood, and observe how long it takes to quit ( if it ever does)
The reasoning is simple, bleeding stops from coagulation...meaning proteins form with platelets from the blood to form a clot. The more cells damaged(dull head tearing tissue) the more platelets sent to cut and the clot forms faster.....less cells damaged (clean cut) means less platelets, and the cut cant adequately heal itself as quickly....the blood just keeps flowing.
If you cant accept that for an answer I can find an article where a scientist says it in bigger words, if that will make anyone feel better about it.
10-05-2008, 12:10 AM
#89
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: PA
Posts: 9,085
RE: Pass through with sharp blades verse "dull" blades
just read the first post....
my answer is think of rubber bands...pass your dull head through it and it will just move the rubber bands outta the way....do it with a sharp head and it will slice them easily...
think of blood vessels and all that good stuff the same way....rather than cut through them with a dull head, it will likely pass by them....
same with tissue damage...a sharp head is going to cut MORE of the heart and lung tissue than the dull one that kinda just punches through....
my answer is think of rubber bands...pass your dull head through it and it will just move the rubber bands outta the way....do it with a sharp head and it will slice them easily...
think of blood vessels and all that good stuff the same way....rather than cut through them with a dull head, it will likely pass by them....
same with tissue damage...a sharp head is going to cut MORE of the heart and lung tissue than the dull one that kinda just punches through....
10-05-2008, 03:14 AM
#90
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Manassas, VA
Posts: 3,612
RE: Pass through with sharp blades verse "dull" blades
Thank you Mauser and everyone else that attempted to answer my question. Just talking hunting here folks, nothing more nothing less.....good day and good luck to anyone in the field today!
And thanks TEmbry--great explanation. That is why I started this thread in the first place....too figure it all out!
And thanks TEmbry--great explanation. That is why I started this thread in the first place....too figure it all out!