RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

Bern, Fred Bear did experiment with the POD.

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

Fred Bear and company put a lot of money into the pod. Trying to get in legalized in most states and to put on the market. It fail to get passed in most all the states, so there was no market for it. Fred wanted to minimize game lose in the sport of bowhunting and to make more money by putting them in his bows and arrow line. I heard him talk about it once in a group of bowhunters. He though it was the answer to game lose for bowhunters.

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

Thanks Bowdoc!

If you're real quiet - you can actually hear my head expanding.

Deafening silence from the peanut gallery. Zing Pow baby. Zing muthaflippin POW!

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

So because fred bearspoke forit its ok?And like others said...

on a bad hit it would takequite a whileto make it through the body and become effective, with no blood trail you still have the same problem as a normal arrow.

on a good hit, well good hits are already lethal and need no sedative to help. the deer will be past the point of sleeping long before the miracle drug will kick in.;)

It just may be banned from nearly all states for a reason...

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

The voice of reason doesn't work around here!

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

LOL[&o]...yes sir[:o]

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

Fred Bear did alot of things I wouldn't, you think because he trid the Pod now everyone will change their opinion? He took a 100 yd shots at game too doesn't mean he would today.

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

My dad always called the pod, "Hamburger Helper" :D

I've shot 3-4 deer using the pod.. All shots were perfect, so I never really got a chance to see if they work.... I stopped using them b/c (1), I was always nervous about sticking it in me and (2) I didn't feel it was necessary.

I've heard a rump shot with a pod will put them down in 20 yds...

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

Now I am thinking that a self bow, wood arrows with the fletching held on by dried deer tendons, and using my own handmade flint broadheads tied on with dried deer tendons is the way to go.

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

This is just to funny! It is an interesting conversation especially so since it was seemingly promoted by one of the icons of the archery world and still remains legal in at least Mississippi.Deer control in heavily populated area's would seemingly make sense,especially if they are going down within 20 yards even if poorly hit.Many of us have had perfectly shot deer go 100 yards plus.
Now lets hear more about the girl friend.How awkward was it when you both sobered up?

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

Make it easy---just go with heat seeking explosive broadheads

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

Kill it and grill it all in one shot! [:-]


I'd sooner hunt with handgrenades than coated arrows........... an instant gratification thing I guess.

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

I was going to go with hand grenades but thought they would tear them up too bad.
Seriously though,dont you think that some coatings or "poison" could be less humane than just a sharp broadhead?

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

i wouldnt use it. I feel it would take away a lot from bowhunting.

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

could you fill the pod with pepper and salt, maybe some fresh herbs ???
or a fluorescent substance that would make your bad hit deer light up for another round ???

I have had dendrobataes frogs from Costa Rican rainforest, the indians could mix up a really cool posion which they dipped their arrows with, they put it just behind the sharp end of their arrows so no one could stick themselves....

Wemight evenconsider some LSD ??? We should all wear flower patterns instead of expensive camo gear then......

Frank

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

quicksilver you make some good points and I would not want to face you in a debate:DI would not use the drugs in a normal bow hunting setting. Maybe in a urban hunt that would help with a deer finding its way on some treehugers front lawn[:'(]Good Post

Hatchet Jack

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

Not true Double Creek, unless they are standing at 20 when you hit em and don't run. I'm not going to get into it oversomething that is hypothetical but not feasable. I'll give you some info however.

Sucostrin (succinycholine) is a neuromuscular blocking agent that works on skeletal muscle. It causes your muscles to contract and stay in the contracted state, thus causing paralysis. It is in the same class of drug as curarie (atracurium) the substance many native tribes use to poison arrows. There are three classes of these drugs, ultra fast (sucostrin) taking up to 1 minute to work if an appropriate dose is injected directly into a large vein or artery, fast acting (curarie) 1-2minutes, and long taking > than 3 minutes. Hitting a deer in the muscle will not result in a quick recovery. How far can a deer run in 5 minutes? The drug has to gain access in an appropriate concentration to the vascular system and be distributed throughout the body to work.

Another consideration with these drugsis how they work. You hit a deer right and he bleeds out they lose conscienceness. This class of drugs only paralyzes the animal, they die because the diaphragm is composed of skeletal muscle and without it they can't breathe. So the animal becomes parlayzed, is awake, can see, hear, feel, sense etc and dies of suffocation. Not a very humane death.

Special K, barbiturates and other anesthetics also take time to work. Most take between30s to a minute in a quiet animal that is sedated. These also take an appropriate dose delivered into a majorveinor artery to work. When dosed in the muscle the dose ismuch higher and takes much longer to work. You could be looking at 15-20 minutes for full effect with these types of drugs. Also, in an excited animal the behavior of these drugs is erratic and unpredictable. There is a good chance they wouldn't work, especially given in the muscle. They aren't going to be absorbed inenough capacity to work anywhere other than a large muscle mass, so you are looking at a hip shot or a neck shot. If they would happen to work you then are going to have to decide how you are going to kill the animal as they will only anesthetize not kill. Not feasable to get a dose in them to cause death. Going to have to cut the throat or walk up and shoot another one into the boiler room.

No matter the poison you use a proper hit will kill the animal before the poison has a chance to work. If you hit them bad and no blood trail there is a really good chance you aren't going to find the animal. Now you have the question, better to hit one bad and have them live than to poison one, not find it and have it dead for sure?

As for your catch and release, you realize there is a veterinarian present for a reason? When you dart these guys to shoot again next year you going to take them home and watch them for 24 hours to make sure they make a full recovery before setting them loose? That way if they die you can go ahead and tag them? You know animals have 0 ability to regulate their body temperature when sedated/anesthetized. Are you prepared to deal with an animal that goes into malignant hyperthermia, anaphylactic shock, hypovolemic shock, apnea, or cardiac arrest so you can get your pictures? Are you going to pay a vet to acccompany you so they can make sure the animal remains stable until it makes a full recovery? Domestic animals and people anesthtized in a controlled environment by professionals that have pre operative exams, blood work, are treated for any abnomalites and recieve state of the art monitoring have a fatality rate between 1-2%. What do you think the rate might be in the woods with wild animals. Non domestic animals have a much higher fatality rate in a controlled environment BTW.

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

No.

What is a humane kill? Define that.

Is what wolves do humane, no, it is wolf-like. But in human terms (dragging an animal down after a long drawn out chase filled with terror, and feeding on it's intestines and haunches while it is still alive) is not humane for us.

Wasting the meat is also not humane, unless you simply have to cull animals for the greater good of humanity for some reason and let them lay. Like they used to do to the elk in YNP before any amount of sport hunting was developed to aleviate this problem with late hunts (which, by the way, the wolves have eliminated - the late hunts I mean, and the elk of course, inhumanely I'm sure)

Why not use a rifle quik.

RE: HNI Thinktank: Arrow Coatings
 

I haven't read all of the replies, but people already use stuff like this. They are called "pods".