Jerry/Pa

I'm really pleased to see that this thread didn't get ugly like I've seen it happen on sites. Including one from my own state. It says something about the people who visit HuntingNet.

Myself I have no problem with Modern equip. I began in the 70's with trad style equip. Tried to go back to it a couple years ago but just didn't get the same from it as I do with a compound. I don't look at equipment choice as an ethical issue. To me ethics is more in line with conduct. Shot choices, conduct when no ones looking, courtesy in the field. Things of that nature. Staying within the realem of your equip and your own ability while hunting I think is also part of ethics. I don't think equip. makes you any better of a hunter or any less. I don't see lazy or easy having anything to do with modern equip either. To me equip. choices are like chocolite and vanilla. Some equip. can aid in inhancing your ability while some can do nothing or worsten it. We owe it to the animals to be as efficient as humanly possile. As long as you draw in the presence of your game and you practice good ethics then your choice of equip is your own. That's what makes this sport what it is. It attracts a wide range of people and personalities. JERRY

Lilhunter

Krisken,

First off let me point out I am not a stickbow only type of bowhunter althought thats all I personally shoot....I am a bowhunter period and I've hunted with people shooting everything from rifles to a selfbow guy.

That said, let me quote something here. <BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>On the other hand...if I am useing machines to hunt,am I (not) giving the quarry fair chance?.
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

Look no farther then the Mech heads, releases or compound bows the majority of bowhunters are using today...these are all machines. Even to some degree my stickbows are a machine. The technology advances in even these, although they look the same they are vastly different, would lead me to believe they are nothing more then a &quot;lower grade&quot; if you will machine! Heck the releases, at one time called cluches, were around before Compounds were ever invented. Mech heads also!

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>At what point do I become less of a skilled hunter?. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

This one is also a sore subject but one I bet I can have the founder of the P&Y club back me on after spending some time with him. Most of the bowhunting community has lost the skill of being a true hunter but have perfected the skill of being a killer! Look around, blood and socres are more important then anything else!

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote> At what point do I lessen the hunt?.
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

That said, the hunt in itself is an individual decision. We are all out there for our own reasons. What you do to make or break the hunt, make it what it is or isnt, is in your hands regardless of the group you are with at the time and more so, as the saying goes, &quot;when nobody's looking&quot;. I full believe we dont even need anti's to take away our right to hunt as our actions are doing it for us!

Cods,

Your second paragraph is not even close! other then that I agree with ya.

Farmhunter,

You talk of boundrys my friend, you are walking a fine line! I hear this time and time again <BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote> proficient weapon (to use your words), effecient, and more humane<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>sorry but I snicker at comments like these. Even an ATLATL in the right hands is all of the above! Did I tell ya I killed a moose and sheep this year with my longbow.....Neither of which traveled farther then 25 yards.

Ak

As one of the many I respect there postings on this and the trad forum, I am a bit in awestruck by your post.
<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>as long it falls within the confines of the law <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

I know you know as well as I, that just because its legal does not mean its ethical, and visa versa! Just because its illegal does not mean its unethical!

Aurther P! Well said! AMEN!

Now I am not going after anybody as I am sure it can be taken that way! I think more so suprised at what others are posting/thinking about things like this!

cods

Lilhunter,
My second paragraph was an attempt at sarcasm. Even if I was trying to make the point being made, rangefinders would be at the bottom of the list.

AK

Lilhunter, I made that statement in a little more loose context than how you may be viewing it. I was looking at &quot;fair&quot; from the general standpoint of using animals for human use as opposed to &quot;fair&quot; in the sense of challenge and chance from a hunter's stance. I tried to distinguish between the two indirectly, but mabey I didn't present that well. Guess I should also qualify my statement with a &quot;responsible use&quot; clause in there somewhere.

davidmil

Long before there were all the gadgets I killed deer with a recurve. Old antiquated things by todays recurve standards too. We didn't have all the camo.... I hunted in Army Green. It really wasn't much different. I still killed deer every year. I practiced for the fun of it more than to become proficient. That was a by product of having fun. IF they outlawed our gadgets tomorrow we could all do the same stuff we do now... we'd just have to learn to shoot a recurve or long bow. It's not rocket science. It's no big deal. We use what we have because they're improvements and we enjoy bowhunting. Everything in life doesn't have to be some big &quot;ETHICAL&quot; discussion or conform to some &quot;FAIR&quot; standard. If you're unhappy with the gadgets just stop using them. No big deal. There are thousands out there not using them now and there were hundreds of thousands before them.

And... that's a homemade(by me) leather vest I'm wearing. Why on earth did I make something like that. Oh well.



Edited by - davidmil on 01/04/2003 21:28:41

vc1111

Nice doe, David. <img src=icon_smile_tongue.gif border=0 align=middle>

Kristen, it is interesting to see someone think so much about this. I do agree with Davidmil. Somethings about living are not anymore complicated than you choose to make them.

If its legal, and its ethical, and you're having fun, you're doing it right.

Now that doesn't mean that one person's way of having fun is the same as the others. I do not care for the idea of Fall turkey season. I prefer the Spring hunt because you can call them in close. Yea, I know its possible to call them in during the Fall season in a certain way, but it is not the same to me. So I simply do something else.

When our first Americans hunted they didn't trifle over &quot;sport.&quot; They didn't spend too much time thinking about what the deer was thinking. The idea of &quot;sport&quot; is a relatively new thing in the whole scope of time. It is ill-defined and always will be.

huntforlife

i think davidmil hit the nail on the head



<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote> We use what we have because they're improvements and we enjoy bowhunting. Everything in life doesn't have to be some big &quot;ETHICAL&quot; discussion or conform to some &quot;FAIR&quot; standard. If you're unhappy with the gadgets just stop using them. No big deal. There are thousands out there not using them now and there were hundreds of thousands before them.<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

if i had even half of a brain i might of said something like that

beprepn

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
I remember (years ago) when an ethical hunt meant giving the animal fair chance,chase and good shot placment.

...

At what point do I lessen the hunt?.
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When you use a tree stand. Where is the &quot;chase&quot; in tree stand hunting?

Lilhunter

and its different in setting up a ground blind how? There is chase in all of what we do, albeit in different forms. Moving from stand to stand, woodlot to woodlot, trying to outsmart mr animal.

Not to mention I would much rather people use stands with high tech saftey belts, then climb up tree limbs, standing on branches with nothing more then a hemp woven cord to &quot;break there fall&quot;.

I am sure you also have problems with dogs be it bears, cougars, or birds, baiting bears, etc etc. Careful the path you choose as it affects us all!


David, Nice pic man! Looks like it belongs in one of the old bear digests. I do however disagree to some aspect. What we do is personal and to what level we take it is also personal. But what we do is under constant scrutiny of non hunters day in and day out. A picture of a &quot;bowhunter&quot; dress like &quot;rambo&quot; on his weekend/daily &quot;hunt&quot; would I am sure leave a bad view in there heads. Just the other side to the coin I guess. Btw, that leather vest has class, espically by todays &quot;standards&quot;! <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>!

AK

Davidmil, That's one of the neatest pictures I've ever seen on this board! Thanks for putting it up. <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle> What year was that, if may I ask?