RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Wait, he asked you to take him onto "your" property to hunt? That takes some big steely ones there. Anyone that forward wouldn't give a rat's tail about your rules anyway. I don't know him from anyone, but with what you've said I'd stick to hunting foam with him.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Still blatantly rude.

If you are asked over for dinner and you're told it will be hamburger do you say. "Okay, but if I find a steak in the refridgerator I'm going to eat it. Just so you know."?

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Sincere question.....

Sincere answer.....

yep. I either would accept.....or know I could hunt my own spots and do as I please. If I accepted, though.....it would be under their terms.

I was talking about thinning does.....and he said he'd help. When I gave him the stipulations (I'd already pointed this out to my shop owner).....that's when I heard the "I'll shoot a big buck", stuff.

No problems. No invitations. When I come right out and say I might not even take a buck off the property.....that should tell volumes.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

You should tell them that even though they can't shoot bucks if they want to film you shooting one you will set up a stand for them.:D

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Again, nothing personal.

I guess everyones different. If alandowner asked me because the deer were hurting his crops, etc. I would absolutely go as well, especially, if I thought, through my kind actions I may be given even less strict hunting guidelines in the future:D. I way to get my foot in the door, so to speak.

BUt, If another hunter (who was just an aquaintance) asked me..to come and shoot DOES ONLY, because of his own "QDM" project and especially if I perceived that he thought he was doing me a favor, I'd say sorry, I think I'll just hunt somewhere else.

A friend, again, imo, would never put limitations on another for those reasons.

Take care

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

It's not selfish , it's self serving.

And its no more than do as I say not as I do ......................


To set rules on others that you won't lived by is wrong.
If the land was yours and you set these limits I would support you as a land owner but you are just elevating your self for a reason that I am unfamiliar with.
The land is over run with deer and for you to not be wild about a Friend killing a great buck is nothing but selfish.

How we hunt , anyone that scores is a winner...................

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

While I agree with this......a true friend wouldn't ask for anything more than what's offered.

Let me put it this way.....

My shop owner opens at 10:00 on Saturdays. if we were hunting his land (does only....on his request)....I'd do it because I knew it would be helping him out. I'd even drag HIS deer and butcher it if his time constraints said he had to go open his shop.

Maybe I'm a chump.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Bawana....

If you'll go back and read......

The error of my ways was that I thought I WAS doing them a favor. It's their choice. They can hunt here at home (by my rules).....or go for a drive and do it "their way".

Ultimately....it's their choice. As of now.....it's a moot point.

SO? Decline with no hard feelings on either end!

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

LOL. Yeah right.

It's more like if I invited you to my house and said "I'm going to eat this steak, but since you guys don't live here, you can have hot dogs, heck, it's better than going hungry"

No offense again to you GMMAT, but I will combat analogy with analogy if somebody else interjects. Take care and good hunting all.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Tell me what the difference is in this scenario:

You get invited to a big time lease or outfitter to take a management buck. 8 points or less......3.5 yrs or more.

Are you gonna look that outfitter in the eyes and tell hm you'll shoot the 150" 2.5 yr old if you "want to"?

His lease/ranch. He can (obviously) shoot whatever he wants....but he has a need to cull a certain "class" buck.

Your turn.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

I don't think you're a chump for helping somebody. I help people out of the goodness of my heart all the time. I try to do the right thing. I also expect people to do the right thing by me, and If someone wants me as part of their deal, then it better be the same kind of a deal, I'd offer tothem.

I understand from your responce that you are the same way, it's just what you/I regard as a good "deal" may be different. Hence the difference in our opinion.

I wouldn't ever attach any strings to anybody I'd ask to hunt with me, regardless of the "mission" of the hunt, that Idid not intend on abiding by myself,and I wouldn't ever expect "strings" from them, regardless of who initiated what. Take care

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Seems like a no brainer to me. If you invite someone to hunt your land then they should abide by the rules you set or don't hunt there.... pretty simple. If you say does only and they say "I'm shooting a big buck if it comes by".......... well then ...... tell them thanks but no thanks the offer is off.

It's no different than friends that are invited to hunt my land but have toABSOLUTELY abide by my buck restrictions I set forth. If I say you can't shoot anything less than a 3.5 year old buck, 120" buck etc.......and they tell me I'm dropping the first spike I see they won't step foot on my land period!

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

My bad , the people that I hunt with I have known for years I know their kids ,I know their parents and we have only fun in mind ,we don't hunt for political ,social or any other reasons .We hunt because we love to hunt ..........[>:]

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Would you adhere to the same rules you asked other to abide by??

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Bwana,

your mailbox is full:)

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

I don't want to put words into GMMAT's mount so if I'm off base here Jeff tell me.

Here it goes.....I re-read his posts and I think I understand a little better what happened. What GMMAT is trying to say (I think)is that he has no problem letting any of his close friends or family shoot anything they want when they are hunting with him, His problem was he asked a couple of folks not quite in that circle to come out and shoot some does only. I totally see where he feels slighted because a couple of acquaintances were asked to help with shooting some does only and they should have either accepted or declined his offer based on that criteria only. When they made the comment about shooting a slammer, I feel theywere in the wrong.

Now here's the grind and it's where we differ.....But it's also where I think GMMAT has seen the light.

Anyone that I ask to hunt with me no matter what the objective is, whether it be thinning does or what have you, can shoot anything they like and I would be just as happy had I killed it. It's just that I will only ask those who I know for sure will hunt the way I do, ethically and legally. I will never put restrictions on anyone who hunts with me but I do restrict WHO hunts with me, savy?

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Absolutely. If I felt I couldn't or didnt' want to then I wouldnt' hunt there. If someone invited me to hunt their land I'd certainly respect their wishes.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

If they can't abide by the rules, they don't hunt.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

NY,

If you would abide by the same rules as you ask other to, all while on your land, then that may be the difference.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Good post Bigj12, I think that is pretty much it with one minor exception.

When someone makes you an offer regarding anything, you have more choices than to accept or decline. You can make a counter offer and that may be, in effect, what the "guests" were doing in GMMAT's case

I apologize for the proliferation of posts that I have had on this thread and now will respectfully bow out (barring further interjection by others directed at me)
Take care and good hunting all
hb

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Hillbilly,

I guess it all depends on how it was asked. As I understand it GMMAT made it clear that they were only to shoot does, there's no "counter offer" to something as clear as that. If someone tells me does only I know where that person stands and I will accept or decline based on that offer. In my case I would graciously decline as I would not like restrictions put on my hunt just as I would not restrict those who hunt with me.

Now if GMMAT just asked them to "come out and shoot does" then I think it's perfectly reasonable for something like the buck comment to be made because the ground rules weren't clearly laid out from the start.

Again, I think a lesson was learned about knowing the people you hunt with and only hunting with the people you know and trust.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Do any of you think that the guys that whacked the fifteen biggest bucks last year left home with that in mind??????????????????


No I'm only gonna shoot a doe......[:-][:-][:-][:-][:-][:-][:-]

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

jim - did they go after being asked to only shoot does? I don't understand the arguement. Plainly he asked them to only shoot does, if they can't abide by it, then they shouldn't go. I watched a Drury video where the guy was allowed to shoot any deer but a 180" 8 pointer, well guess what.... 8pointer walked right under his stand stood at 18 yards and was videod for 10 min, the man had the integrity to not shoot that buck. It would have been his biggest ever. That is the line that decides what kind of man you are.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Thats cause it could not get out of the fence.............[:o];):D

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

I can't argue your point.:D But if Jeff invited me to hunt his land for does only, I have at least 3 doe tags, guess how many I am gonna shoot? Provided Jeff helps drag..... Even if the next world record walks by.... I might draw just to see if I could do it without shakin all to pieces, but it would walk.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Nah, the're the ones being selfish. Here you go & invite them to "thin the herd" by shooting does. What part of thin the herd don't they understand. If you wanted them to shoot anything, u'd invite them to hunt your property. No you're not in the wrong. I would respect request if it's known upfront about shooting does only. Besides they taste better, & u can't eat the antlers.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

I got twenty says your lying like red haired adoped kid with Ho Ho's on his breath..............

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

As I remember the property you hunt isn't that big. I really don't think you'd have a hard time whacking some does all by your lonely. That said, if they can't come and visit for just a doe hunt then leave them out.They have to be ready to abide by the rules or the landlord. And if you're not the landlord, well they have to abide by his agents rules. To be honest, they've shown their true colors already. I wouldn't trust them. They might go behind your back and get permission from the landowner all by themselves. Choose your friends more wisely.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

I see what you're saying. I misunderstood the first time you asked me. You're saying that I should abide by the same rules I set forth for the people I invited to my land? I guess that does put a little different perspective on it.

But, I still see it as I'm the one inviting people to MY land to hunt with stipulations. Kind of like giving them an opportunity if they choose to want to come out and shoot some does. If they choose not too than so be it, I still offered them a chance to put meat in the freezer if they were intersted.

Still seems like a no brainer to me. As long as the rules talked about and decided on ahead of time. I guess it's all in how you present it. It almost has to be black and white. "You guys want to come to my land and take a few does (AND ONLY DOES)....... yes or no?"

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

You lost $20. The only thing I ever had was my word, and I don't take it lightly. If I tell someone something, bank on it. Now if he asked me not to eat his HO HO's, I can't guarantee that.....

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

And when the Jorden buck walks by you............................[>:]
Twenty what????????????????

I have to run my dog nowbut I'll be back..........

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

I'm back...............[8D]

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Doesn't matter. My word is my word. If it were the Jordan buck but piebald, still would walk. You can say what you will, but I honor my word more than any deer. I have a pond that we catch 10# bass up to 27" long, I let a few friends fish it but they know that that ALL bass go back. I have had friends say "what if it's over 10#?" it goes back, those that say "If I catch one over 10, I'm keeping it" get the "Don't bother fishing then". I work hard on my pond, working way more than I fish it, but I know on most days I can catch a 6-10lber. I don't want anyone to take that away from me or my kids. I think 3 people have fished it this year.

A sample.....

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

I agree 110% with Nctaxi on his response, I debated whether responding to this at all anymore but it burns my chaps to see the viewpoint hunting and what it is materializing into nowdays. I grew hunting in Fla and any deer was a great deer, now there is the neverending fascination with horns, antlers, headgear whatever you prefer. I am relatively new to the site but how will young people percieve this - if I can't shoot a buck it ain't worth my time - is the messgae I have heard. What happened to the experience, meeting new people, Respect, and being honest. I get just as fired up on a doe as a 10pointer and I have taken both - I live for the experience and the atmosphere - now people dont wanna hunt if they can't take a buck - I must still be in the Fla woods waiting on a plump doe with my heart coming outta my chest but to me bowhunting is the best thing in the world . SORRY gota little off topic Excellent post taxi and nice to see a few still believe in a man's word

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Nobody answered this question.

What is different in this scenario?

nctaxi......I will abide by your fishing rules!......and I live close! Heck....if Mitch can fish.....I'll just WATCH!;) You can even blindfold us going in.....lol.

I may ask you to come up and shoot a doe or two if you find yourself with the time and the inclination. Yep. I help drag and butcher.....meat's all yours.....and the appreciation is all mine. Deal for you.....If Mitch shoots a deer with his bow, this year,....I'll give you that business. I've already told himwe'll taxi his first.

Good to hear from you, pal. I still look at the piebald hide you tanned for me with fond memories.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Hunting means so much more to me thanthe social adventure many are making it out to be.
I have no reason to hunt some where that others would set limitations on what I am hunting. Here in PA we get one buck tag and one or more doe tags. The P.G.C. has set 4 points to a side limit in my area ,and a plan to reduce deer numbers with outlandish doe allocations.
These are the only rules I must follow. And no ones personal goals or agendas will interfere with my hunting. I would not hunt where there were limits on my the joys I get from hunting.
Of course I care enough about my hunting to have purchased enough land for me and my family & Friendsto hunt on withoutsome one Else's ideas or agendas in the back of our minds.

Hunting is supposed to be fun , and for us it is.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

You mistakenly (apparently) suppose that hunting isn't fun for us that are trying to manage a herd. I'd profess otherwise. This year will be challenging and fun in its own way. I see what this land and this herd CAN be. I've said it before.....the journey, to me, is a huge part of the destination.

I hope you're having as much fun as I am.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

Thats how I see it too Jeff.

I'll take BwanaJim's example here:

If the Jordan buck walks by, who cares! Its just a deer. I don't hunt to flex my ego muscles, nor do any of my true friends and hunting buddies. I have let more than my share of 125"-140" bucks walk, and even had to watch a deer that would have gone near 180" go under my tree. In SC, that would have put it in the top 25 deer ever taken in the state, nevermind with archery equipment.

But....

If I would have shot that deer, assuming I would have gotten to keep the horns anyway (and I know my reputation would have gone in the can), all I would think about every single time I looked at that head on the wall would be the deceitful way I came by it. I would really be ashamed of myself.

As it is, I was really happy to be that close to such a great buck. Call it catch and release hunting. Its one of my more fond hunting memories anyway.

To each his own.

RE: My eyes were opened.....Am I selfish?
 

I would respond that what you are trying to do is a Nobel under taking but your struggle with power control gives it away.

Or maybe the bucks in your area don't like to eat your farmer Friends beans. I see no reason for you to place limits on what others shoot on land that you presently don't own.

Every doe taken helps you get closer to your goals and every buck reduces the herd by one more. If you hunt with hunters that have the same mindset as you no one needs to set rules. Just go out and enjoy a day in the woods. Shoot what you want to and let others do the same.