little ones make big ones
11-26-2006, 06:22 PM
#11
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Blossvale, New York
Posts: 21,199
RE: little ones make big ones
Dude, you live in a state with the best of Genes, the best of food, the fewest of hunters and have NO idea what the rest of the world is like. It's no access, small parcels, state land and no restrictions. I can pass up every 8 point I see on public land in NY and he'll never be seen again because he won't make it over the next hill. The biggest buck or the best buck isn't necessarily the biggest set of horns. The biggest buck in many areas is a dink in your country. And NO, most of us can't effect that when hunting state or small parcels. When I say small, I hunt a couple pieces that are 5 acres and 25 acres. Let's see you manage that herd. You joined 4 years ago, made one post and have NO idea what you're talking about in the rest of the world. I pass deer all the time, but it really doesn't matter. I'm just leaving them for someone else to shoot. Genetics and food are also a major factor. Let me take you to the deep Adirondacks where there are not crops, there are no fields, there are no roads for 25 or 30 miles. The deers home range is vast. They travel up to 50 miles in late fall to yard up in swamps with open springs. They die by the hundreds in 250 inches of snow. Let's see you manage that. It's real easy to say let the 6 and 8 pointers go when you've had to really do nothing except wait another hour for something bigger to come along. You come to the big woods or the small patch and lets see how many deer you have walk by that aren't dancing on egg shells. Iowa to me is as close as pen hunting as you can get without a fence. If you held out in some of the areas I hunt, you'd never kill a deer.... period. I refuse to pay thousands of dollars to hunt. I'll whack my basket rack in fair chase and he eats just fine. To me, it's not the horns, it's the meat.... not the macho.
11-26-2006, 06:58 PM
#12
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: NY
Posts: 4,668
RE: little ones make big ones
ORIGINAL: Buck Master
I live in NE iowa and every one complains about not having enough big bucks in the area.
I live in NE iowa and every one complains about not having enough big bucks in the area.
Why, evenwith a bow huntingbeing able to hunt during peak rut, do people take small deer and not give them a chance to grow?
11-26-2006, 07:02 PM
#13
Typical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Rutland, MA
Posts: 808
RE: little ones make big ones
ORIGINAL: davidmil
Dude, you live in a state with the best of Genes, the best of food, the fewest of hunters and have NO idea what the rest of the world is like. It's no access, small parcels, state land and no restrictions. I can pass up every 8 point I see on public land in NY and he'll never be seen again because he won't make it over the next hill. The biggest buck or the best buck isn't necessarily the biggest set of horns. The biggest buck in many areas is a dink in your country. And NO, most of us can't effect that when hunting state or small parcels. When I say small, I hunt a couple pieces that are 5 acres and 25 acres. Let's see you manage that herd. You joined 4 years ago, made one post and have NO idea what you're talking about in the rest of the world. I pass deer all the time, but it really doesn't matter. I'm just leaving them for someone else to shoot. Genetics and food are also a major factor. Let me take you to the deep Adirondacks where there are not crops, there are no fields, there are no roads for 25 or 30 miles. The deers home range is vast. They travel up to 50 miles in late fall to yard up in swamps with open springs. They die by the hundreds in 250 inches of snow. Let's see you manage that. It's real easy to say let the 6 and 8 pointers go when you've had to really do nothing except wait another hour for something bigger to come along. You come to the big woods or the small patch and lets see how many deer you have walk by that aren't dancing on egg shells. Iowa to me is as close as pen hunting as you can get without a fence. If you held out in some of the areas I hunt, you'd never kill a deer.... period. I refuse to pay thousands of dollars to hunt. I'll whack my basket rack in fair chase and he eats just fine. To me, it's not the horns, it's the meat.... not the macho.
Dude, you live in a state with the best of Genes, the best of food, the fewest of hunters and have NO idea what the rest of the world is like. It's no access, small parcels, state land and no restrictions. I can pass up every 8 point I see on public land in NY and he'll never be seen again because he won't make it over the next hill. The biggest buck or the best buck isn't necessarily the biggest set of horns. The biggest buck in many areas is a dink in your country. And NO, most of us can't effect that when hunting state or small parcels. When I say small, I hunt a couple pieces that are 5 acres and 25 acres. Let's see you manage that herd. You joined 4 years ago, made one post and have NO idea what you're talking about in the rest of the world. I pass deer all the time, but it really doesn't matter. I'm just leaving them for someone else to shoot. Genetics and food are also a major factor. Let me take you to the deep Adirondacks where there are not crops, there are no fields, there are no roads for 25 or 30 miles. The deers home range is vast. They travel up to 50 miles in late fall to yard up in swamps with open springs. They die by the hundreds in 250 inches of snow. Let's see you manage that. It's real easy to say let the 6 and 8 pointers go when you've had to really do nothing except wait another hour for something bigger to come along. You come to the big woods or the small patch and lets see how many deer you have walk by that aren't dancing on egg shells. Iowa to me is as close as pen hunting as you can get without a fence. If you held out in some of the areas I hunt, you'd never kill a deer.... period. I refuse to pay thousands of dollars to hunt. I'll whack my basket rack in fair chase and he eats just fine. To me, it's not the horns, it's the meat.... not the macho.
Nicely said
11-26-2006, 07:04 PM
#14
Fork Horn
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Midwest
Posts: 359
RE: little ones make big ones
That is one heck of a first thread. To pass a deer and let them grow is beat to death and I doubt the argument will ever influence the way a person hunts. Taking or not taking a particular animal comes down to a personal preference at the moment of truth. No internet thread, person, username will ever influence what deer I do or do not take when hunting. You can all save your breath, everyone knows that deer need to live to grow but not everyone cares to hunt like everyone else. There are too many outside influences to say that an Iowa'n has the same influence on the herd as a NY'er. It's different everywhere in the country. It's difference from public land to private land, it's different from 100 acres to 10,000 acres. To each their own.!!!
11-26-2006, 07:08 PM
#15
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,175
RE: little ones make big ones
You tell 'em, Washington Hunter and davidmil. 
Frankly, I don't care. Oh, I'd like to get a big wall hanger, just as much as anyone else would. But since I normally hunt on the ground with a recurve or longbow, bowhunting isn't nearlyEASY enough for me to be all that choosy.
Actually, I feel sorry for anyone who's overloaded themselves with so much gadgetry and 'bowhunting shooting system' garbage that they've lost the challengeof hunting with a simple bow. Must be horrible to be forced to concentrate on only trophy class animals just to get a sense of accomplishment again. It's really sad. [
]
I feelevery hunter has every right to take whatever size animal makes them happy. Whether you horn hunterslike it or not.I couldn't put it any better than the old line from Monty Python...Bugger off!
And besides that.... Bowhunting doesn't take enough deer out of the woods to even be included in this nonsense. Bowhunters take only a small portion of the total harvest every year. If you want to drastically reduce the number of small bucks taken, then haul your carcassover to the gun forums and do your thing there. Try to talk them out of filling their tags.
By the way.... My wife says guys who are so obsessed by big horns must be compensating for the size of... uh... 'something else.'[:-]
Frankly, I don't care. Oh, I'd like to get a big wall hanger, just as much as anyone else would. But since I normally hunt on the ground with a recurve or longbow, bowhunting isn't nearlyEASY enough for me to be all that choosy.
Actually, I feel sorry for anyone who's overloaded themselves with so much gadgetry and 'bowhunting shooting system' garbage that they've lost the challengeof hunting with a simple bow. Must be horrible to be forced to concentrate on only trophy class animals just to get a sense of accomplishment again. It's really sad. [
]I feelevery hunter has every right to take whatever size animal makes them happy. Whether you horn hunterslike it or not.I couldn't put it any better than the old line from Monty Python...Bugger off!
And besides that.... Bowhunting doesn't take enough deer out of the woods to even be included in this nonsense. Bowhunters take only a small portion of the total harvest every year. If you want to drastically reduce the number of small bucks taken, then haul your carcassover to the gun forums and do your thing there. Try to talk them out of filling their tags.
By the way.... My wife says guys who are so obsessed by big horns must be compensating for the size of... uh... 'something else.'[:-]
11-26-2006, 07:16 PM
#17
Fork Horn
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Freeland, Michigan
Posts: 291
RE: little ones make big ones
I agree with you about people shooting little bucks and then complaining about no big ones, BUT heres my issue with what you said. Your main question was "why do people shoot littlebucks while bowhunting"? I am in a round about way the kind of person you are talking aobut. I have hunted about 30 days (out of 45)of our early bow season, I will have hunted 7 days ofgun season (with a bow) that runs 15 days until Nov.30th and probably about 12 days in December until season ends.
I took vacation Nov. 6th- 13th, I seen six bucks prior to this a decent 7pt that I passed on and a nice 16-17inch wide buck (not sure on pt total) that was quartering towards that I let walk because of the angle and some smaller bucks. I seen 10 different bucks on my vacation the biggest being a 14inch 8pt, I ended up shooting a year and a half old 5pt that I was very pleased with personally. I still have a restricted tag that can be used for atleast 4 on one side or better or it can be used on a doe and I have a doe tag.
Over the years I have shot probably 20 bucks with my bow, but none of them will crack 100, I put my time in, scouting, hanging stands, watching deer, very scent concious, practicing and shooting good equiptment. Up until about 6yrs ago I never saw a "good buck" while hunting, but since I have seen about 1 a year. I had 2 within shooting range, one was a bad angle which I passed the other was stupidity- I didn't stand and the deer passed by 12yds to my right and I couldn't turn by the time he was gone.
I would love to pass up 100-120inch deer, but where I hunt they are not as common as you may believe. I am not saying they are not there, but with where I hunt and all the private land I just feel fortunate enough to have some land to hunt. I hunt 80 acres pretty much surrounded by houses, I hear about 300 cars passing because the property is by a busy rd every time I hunt. The draw of this place is it is out my back door and puts me minutes away from the family and occasionally I can take one of my sons hunting with me.
I posted little history and I hope you don't think I am complaing because I am not. I think I am the luckiest guy on earth, I am happy shooting "little bucks". I love being able to sit next to one of my sons on stand and see deer with them. I love going to the house and getting them to do some tracking and dragging. I usually shoot 2 deer a year and I am happy with everyone of them.
So here is my conclusion, it is MY tag, MY time, MY money spent, and if it makes me happy why would you care or want to know? You would think you would be happy for another archer if they feel good about the situation.
If you were to invite me to NE Iowa I would hold out for a 140 class buck if those were your wishes.
My question is how do the bigger antlered bucks taste? J/K.
Chris
I took vacation Nov. 6th- 13th, I seen six bucks prior to this a decent 7pt that I passed on and a nice 16-17inch wide buck (not sure on pt total) that was quartering towards that I let walk because of the angle and some smaller bucks. I seen 10 different bucks on my vacation the biggest being a 14inch 8pt, I ended up shooting a year and a half old 5pt that I was very pleased with personally. I still have a restricted tag that can be used for atleast 4 on one side or better or it can be used on a doe and I have a doe tag.
Over the years I have shot probably 20 bucks with my bow, but none of them will crack 100, I put my time in, scouting, hanging stands, watching deer, very scent concious, practicing and shooting good equiptment. Up until about 6yrs ago I never saw a "good buck" while hunting, but since I have seen about 1 a year. I had 2 within shooting range, one was a bad angle which I passed the other was stupidity- I didn't stand and the deer passed by 12yds to my right and I couldn't turn by the time he was gone.
I would love to pass up 100-120inch deer, but where I hunt they are not as common as you may believe. I am not saying they are not there, but with where I hunt and all the private land I just feel fortunate enough to have some land to hunt. I hunt 80 acres pretty much surrounded by houses, I hear about 300 cars passing because the property is by a busy rd every time I hunt. The draw of this place is it is out my back door and puts me minutes away from the family and occasionally I can take one of my sons hunting with me.
I posted little history and I hope you don't think I am complaing because I am not. I think I am the luckiest guy on earth, I am happy shooting "little bucks". I love being able to sit next to one of my sons on stand and see deer with them. I love going to the house and getting them to do some tracking and dragging. I usually shoot 2 deer a year and I am happy with everyone of them.
So here is my conclusion, it is MY tag, MY time, MY money spent, and if it makes me happy why would you care or want to know? You would think you would be happy for another archer if they feel good about the situation.
If you were to invite me to NE Iowa I would hold out for a 140 class buck if those were your wishes.
My question is how do the bigger antlered bucks taste? J/K.
Chris
11-26-2006, 07:23 PM
#18
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Blossvale, New York
Posts: 21,199
RE: little ones make big ones
Arthur P, you are bowhunting. You are the backbone and the foundation of what we all enjoy in our own little way. I've watched your threads, post and steadfast stand in what you believe. It would be my honor to be in your hunting camp. Thanks for your participation. DAVE
11-26-2006, 07:23 PM
#19
Fork Horn
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location:
Posts: 313
RE: little ones make big ones
ORIGINAL: davidmil
Dude, you live in a state with the best of Genes, the best of food, the fewest of hunters and have NO idea what the rest of the world is like. It's no access, small parcels, state land and no restrictions. I can pass up every 8 point I see on public land in NY and he'll never be seen again because he won't make it over the next hill. The biggest buck or the best buck isn't necessarily the biggest set of horns. The biggest buck in many areas is a dink in your country. And NO, most of us can't effect that when hunting state or small parcels. When I say small, I hunt a couple pieces that are 5 acres and 25 acres. Let's see you manage that herd. You joined 4 years ago, made one post and have NO idea what you're talking about in the rest of the world. I pass deer all the time, but it really doesn't matter. I'm just leaving them for someone else to shoot. Genetics and food are also a major factor. Let me take you to the deep Adirondacks where there are not crops, there are no fields, there are no roads for 25 or 30 miles. The deers home range is vast. They travel up to 50 miles in late fall to yard up in swamps with open springs. They die by the hundreds in 250 inches of snow. Let's see you manage that. It's real easy to say let the 6 and 8 pointers go when you've had to really do nothing except wait another hour for something bigger to come along. You come to the big woods or the small patch and lets see how many deer you have walk by that aren't dancing on egg shells. Iowa to me is as close as pen hunting as you can get without a fence. If you held out in some of the areas I hunt, you'd never kill a deer.... period. I refuse to pay thousands of dollars to hunt. I'll whack my basket rack in fair chase and he eats just fine. To me, it's not the horns, it's the meat.... not the macho.
Dude, you live in a state with the best of Genes, the best of food, the fewest of hunters and have NO idea what the rest of the world is like. It's no access, small parcels, state land and no restrictions. I can pass up every 8 point I see on public land in NY and he'll never be seen again because he won't make it over the next hill. The biggest buck or the best buck isn't necessarily the biggest set of horns. The biggest buck in many areas is a dink in your country. And NO, most of us can't effect that when hunting state or small parcels. When I say small, I hunt a couple pieces that are 5 acres and 25 acres. Let's see you manage that herd. You joined 4 years ago, made one post and have NO idea what you're talking about in the rest of the world. I pass deer all the time, but it really doesn't matter. I'm just leaving them for someone else to shoot. Genetics and food are also a major factor. Let me take you to the deep Adirondacks where there are not crops, there are no fields, there are no roads for 25 or 30 miles. The deers home range is vast. They travel up to 50 miles in late fall to yard up in swamps with open springs. They die by the hundreds in 250 inches of snow. Let's see you manage that. It's real easy to say let the 6 and 8 pointers go when you've had to really do nothing except wait another hour for something bigger to come along. You come to the big woods or the small patch and lets see how many deer you have walk by that aren't dancing on egg shells. Iowa to me is as close as pen hunting as you can get without a fence. If you held out in some of the areas I hunt, you'd never kill a deer.... period. I refuse to pay thousands of dollars to hunt. I'll whack my basket rack in fair chase and he eats just fine. To me, it's not the horns, it's the meat.... not the macho.
I managed to squeeze in 3 half day hunts passing on the same spike 2x before taking a 5 point (4 weeks into the season). I might not have taken the 5 pt, but, a guy just finished bragging to me how he and his 15 buddies put on drives and shoot every deer they can (including my "pet" spike). I would have been just as happy with a mature doe.
My 49 day season ended yesterday, I was able to log a grand total of 22 hours in the woods, that's about half the hunting I usually get in so I'm not displeased with the clean kill I made on my one deer. I wish I could hunt more and more selectively but that's just not in the cards right now. Ultimately, my need for venison trumps any horn hunting superiority complex I don't have the time or ground for.
Jim
11-26-2006, 09:21 PM
#20
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Blossvale, New York
Posts: 21,199
RE: little ones make big ones
Urban Redneck, you're the average typical hunter probably. People that live in farm country or own farms and can plant food plots have no concept of that kind of hunting. You are the norm more than the exception. That's what the horn hunters forget. Some people get a few hours here and there and that's it. If they want to tell us tuff, they have to remember there are more of us than them. Without us they'd have no hunting rights today. Without us the antis would have won.... and yet they try to tell us we're some sort of lesser animal because we choose to loose the arrow on something that won't "MAKE THE BOOK". I'm sure I have book deer..... but I've never put a tape measure on one.