Mechanical BH-75% failure rate!!!!!!!
10-03-2002, 10:30 AM
#41
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Lingle WY USA
Posts: 527
RE: Mechanical BH-75% failure rate!!!!!!!
Just to clarify something on the neck shot that bent the Snyper. Most of the bending was at the ferrule and a little curl to the blade. And it did hit bone...it was inbedded in the 3rd cervical vertebrea below the skull and had to be cut out with a saw.
The Snyper that hit the coyote in the head did a VERY impressive job. It shattered the skull right above the right eye, liquified the brain and stuck halfway out the back of the skull. When it was removed I replaced the tip which was the only thing that was dull. I thought that was fairly impressive performance. That definately gives me hope for this design.
As I said I am not against mech heads even after this year's experience. BUT I think they can improve on all designs. Mechanicals definately have their place.
I knew I was going to take a bashing but I figured it would be worse to not say anything....If nothing else people can take what I say "with a grain of salt" and make a more informed decision.
"What we do in this life echos an eternity"
The Snyper that hit the coyote in the head did a VERY impressive job. It shattered the skull right above the right eye, liquified the brain and stuck halfway out the back of the skull. When it was removed I replaced the tip which was the only thing that was dull. I thought that was fairly impressive performance. That definately gives me hope for this design.
As I said I am not against mech heads even after this year's experience. BUT I think they can improve on all designs. Mechanicals definately have their place.
I knew I was going to take a bashing but I figured it would be worse to not say anything....If nothing else people can take what I say "with a grain of salt" and make a more informed decision.
"What we do in this life echos an eternity"
10-03-2002, 11:00 AM
#42
Fork Horn
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: PA
Posts: 430
RE: Mechanical BH-75% failure rate!!!!!!!
I would also take a head shot on coyotes, there a pain in the #$@.
One thing i found about the game tracker mechanicals is that the rubber band tends to roll down the back of the blade instead of breaking, the blades do open but then when i pull them out of the target the rubber bands roll back up the back side of the blades and it looks like it didnt open at all......
Hunting with a bow brings about a different challenge on every hunt!!!
One thing i found about the game tracker mechanicals is that the rubber band tends to roll down the back of the blade instead of breaking, the blades do open but then when i pull them out of the target the rubber bands roll back up the back side of the blades and it looks like it didnt open at all......
Hunting with a bow brings about a different challenge on every hunt!!!
10-03-2002, 12:19 PM
#43
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ridgeland MS USA
Posts: 850
RE: Mechanical BH-75% failure rate!!!!!!!
Hey CG, thanks for the information on those heads, I understand your reasons for posting. It is unbelievable to me how all these mechanical guys get so worked up when someone has negative feedback. I just don't understand what sets them off, could it be they need to relieve there conscience because deep down they KNOW mechanicals can and will fail. I mean if someone was on here bashing Muzzy fixed blades, I wouldn't even respond because I would know they were full of sh!t. However, because of the history of mechanicals failing, these guys must get on here and religiously defend the heads they shoot, primarily due to the lack of their tuning skills.
Hunt the thickets
Hunt the thickets
10-03-2002, 12:49 PM
#44
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Charlotte NC USA
Posts: 23
RE: Mechanical BH-75% failure rate!!!!!!!
I am having trouble with this thread for a number of reasons.
The tip of the broadhead bending 90 deg's. I can understand one snapping because they are a high carbon steel which will snap but won't bend. Bending in the neck flesh of a yote, he must have had a neck like Mike Tyson. As for the tip snapping on a broadside shot of an Elk. Regardless that arrow shot have passed through with no head on at all, I could shoot a broom handle at 30 yards and if it hit the chest cavity I would gaurantee it would take out both lungs. Why did it fall over if it still had its lungs.
As for head and neck shots I am with Eightwgt and Trapperdave on this. Yes, Yote's are not a game animal but they eat a lot of Rats and Mice as well as Deer. They have just as much right as any animal to die the quickest way possible. You said you had a near miss soon after which shows you can't be sure of your shot. Rule #1. If you are not sure, don't take the shot. I shoot thousands of arrows in closed season and I can nail my 3D at 60yards but I wouldn't take a live shot at that distance but it makes my 30/40 yard shots seem real easy. Sorry for adding to the big line of Witch Hunters but if you put your self in the firing line people are gonna shoot at ya.
Just as an after thought to address the tuning issue. You can have a badly tuned bow with the cam timing off and different poundage on the limbs and it will still put an arrow down the same hole every time if you put it in a shooting machine because it shoots the same every time. What you don't know is how hard your fletchings are working to correct it. Shoot a bare shaft and get it to hit the target straight at 50 yards and you know your bow is tuned correctly.
X-Pat Brit Livin the good life in NC
Edited by - boris the bold on 10/03/2002 14:02:39
The tip of the broadhead bending 90 deg's. I can understand one snapping because they are a high carbon steel which will snap but won't bend. Bending in the neck flesh of a yote, he must have had a neck like Mike Tyson. As for the tip snapping on a broadside shot of an Elk. Regardless that arrow shot have passed through with no head on at all, I could shoot a broom handle at 30 yards and if it hit the chest cavity I would gaurantee it would take out both lungs. Why did it fall over if it still had its lungs.
As for head and neck shots I am with Eightwgt and Trapperdave on this. Yes, Yote's are not a game animal but they eat a lot of Rats and Mice as well as Deer. They have just as much right as any animal to die the quickest way possible. You said you had a near miss soon after which shows you can't be sure of your shot. Rule #1. If you are not sure, don't take the shot. I shoot thousands of arrows in closed season and I can nail my 3D at 60yards but I wouldn't take a live shot at that distance but it makes my 30/40 yard shots seem real easy. Sorry for adding to the big line of Witch Hunters but if you put your self in the firing line people are gonna shoot at ya.
Just as an after thought to address the tuning issue. You can have a badly tuned bow with the cam timing off and different poundage on the limbs and it will still put an arrow down the same hole every time if you put it in a shooting machine because it shoots the same every time. What you don't know is how hard your fletchings are working to correct it. Shoot a bare shaft and get it to hit the target straight at 50 yards and you know your bow is tuned correctly.
X-Pat Brit Livin the good life in NC
Edited by - boris the bold on 10/03/2002 14:02:39
10-03-2002, 01:12 PM
#46
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Oh USA
Posts: 1,584
RE: Mechanical BH-75% failure rate!!!!!!!
CG, it seems the damage to the Snyper in the neck has changed a little from the first post. My initial thoughts would be this: The coyote is a small light weight animal. The arrow hitting the neck would cause the animal to be moved as it was hit, thus absorbing a good bit of the energy, and diminsihing penetration. Is it possible the coyote spun or jumped, and hit the arrow on the ground? Maybe a rock or something else that caused the ferrel to bend? Not the impact?
Phil.
"Could you guys be quiet, my dad's trying to shoot."
Phil.
"Could you guys be quiet, my dad's trying to shoot."
10-03-2002, 01:22 PM
#47
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Lingle WY USA
Posts: 527
RE: Mechanical BH-75% failure rate!!!!!!!
whackmaster,
I will say it again...If Rocky Mountain figures out a way to reinforce or strengthen the tip on the Snyper I will give it another try.
Boris,
I will have to respectfully disagree with you on your broom handle theory. I've taken 5 elk with a bow now and seen twice that many taken by other people and have seen on several occassions an elk's rib limit penetration. And yes they were all recovered and yes they did get both lungs but in my friends case I would suspect that a lot of energy was absorbed to break the ferrule of that broadhead which would further limit penetration. As to why it fell over...I have no idea. Jumped a log fell into a deadfall and ran 50 yards and layed down and died. Heck for all I know the initial shot may have taken out both lungs. The issue is still the fact that the tip and ferrule of that broadhead broke.
Also judging by the sediment of your post, you are against trapping and other means of controlling predators that involve less than "quick" deaths. ("They have just as much right as any animal to die the quickest way possible."
. In my neck of the woods, these are about the only sure way of controling their #'s. Coyotes, in my view, need to be handled with a whole new set of rules. When game animals over-populate, they starve to death. When coyotes over-populate, they DON'T starve. That's the problem. They find something to eat and can be VERY destructive. I will continue to take coyotes by any means possible and that is one thing I will not back down from.
pdq,
Damaged changed???? How so? I'm pretty sure the head looks now just like it did then.....Like I said before, the arrow was inbedded in the vertebrea of the neck and had to be cut out....so I'm quite sure it didn't hit rock. The BH had not been shot before but I must say I did not inspect closely enough to see if there was a flaw in the metal, etc. that would have caused the bending. I'm not trying to "misguide" you, honestly. That is what happened, and that is what I typed here. If you want to find fault in me it is probably...Why the @#$$#$ am I masochistic enough to post something like this!!!!!
"What we do in this life echos an eternity"
Edited by - cg on 10/03/2002 14:34:34
I will say it again...If Rocky Mountain figures out a way to reinforce or strengthen the tip on the Snyper I will give it another try.
Boris,
I will have to respectfully disagree with you on your broom handle theory. I've taken 5 elk with a bow now and seen twice that many taken by other people and have seen on several occassions an elk's rib limit penetration. And yes they were all recovered and yes they did get both lungs but in my friends case I would suspect that a lot of energy was absorbed to break the ferrule of that broadhead which would further limit penetration. As to why it fell over...I have no idea. Jumped a log fell into a deadfall and ran 50 yards and layed down and died. Heck for all I know the initial shot may have taken out both lungs. The issue is still the fact that the tip and ferrule of that broadhead broke.
Also judging by the sediment of your post, you are against trapping and other means of controlling predators that involve less than "quick" deaths. ("They have just as much right as any animal to die the quickest way possible."
. In my neck of the woods, these are about the only sure way of controling their #'s. Coyotes, in my view, need to be handled with a whole new set of rules. When game animals over-populate, they starve to death. When coyotes over-populate, they DON'T starve. That's the problem. They find something to eat and can be VERY destructive. I will continue to take coyotes by any means possible and that is one thing I will not back down from.pdq,
Damaged changed???? How so? I'm pretty sure the head looks now just like it did then.....Like I said before, the arrow was inbedded in the vertebrea of the neck and had to be cut out....so I'm quite sure it didn't hit rock. The BH had not been shot before but I must say I did not inspect closely enough to see if there was a flaw in the metal, etc. that would have caused the bending. I'm not trying to "misguide" you, honestly. That is what happened, and that is what I typed here. If you want to find fault in me it is probably...Why the @#$$#$ am I masochistic enough to post something like this!!!!!
"What we do in this life echos an eternity"
Edited by - cg on 10/03/2002 14:34:34
10-03-2002, 01:57 PM
#49
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Phoenixville, PA USA
Posts: 5,541
RE: Mechanical BH-75% failure rate!!!!!!!
CG, I've got to agree with Boris. If I had the experiences you have had I would not be shooting those heads again at an animal. Heck, just from hearing your input I am considering changing.
Belle, you seem to be grossly misinformed. A lot of animals are lost for this reason or that. If someone gets bad penetration with a fixed blade people just say "Hmmm, must've hit a bone." However, as soon as someone gets some marginal penetration with a mech it is automatically the heads' fault and the archer is too lazy to tune their gear. I have shot mechs for years and would love to invite you to try to tune my bow better than it already is. I have my doubts as to whether you would be able to do so because I am meticulous with my setup. Maybe the reason guys that use mechanicals feel the need to defend them so vehemently is because there are guys like you that accuse them of being lazy. So, next time you feel like shooting your mouth off bring some facts to the table instead of just your BS.
Belle, you seem to be grossly misinformed. A lot of animals are lost for this reason or that. If someone gets bad penetration with a fixed blade people just say "Hmmm, must've hit a bone." However, as soon as someone gets some marginal penetration with a mech it is automatically the heads' fault and the archer is too lazy to tune their gear. I have shot mechs for years and would love to invite you to try to tune my bow better than it already is. I have my doubts as to whether you would be able to do so because I am meticulous with my setup. Maybe the reason guys that use mechanicals feel the need to defend them so vehemently is because there are guys like you that accuse them of being lazy. So, next time you feel like shooting your mouth off bring some facts to the table instead of just your BS.
10-03-2002, 02:28 PM
#50
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Scottsdale Arizona USA
Posts: 527
RE: Mechanical BH-75% failure rate!!!!!!!
Whacky-I don't get why an outfitter would say no to thunderheads for elk. I have a lot of elk with my bow over the last 15 years and all with TH. You are right on on shot placement being the top issue but whoever said you could shoot a broomstick through an elk at 20 yards hasn't shot many. They have a pretty solid bone structure and you don't always get passthrough on close side shots. And last to CG I think the same problem as always is happening here. Some of us hunt and kill and others shoot 3D and talk like they hunt and kill. Good shooting either way.