RE: 2 or 3 777 pellets
 

I will pay you 10 grand for that muzzle loader right now, that is really awesome. you have a record setting rifle there.

With my best handloaded 308 win's, I feel lucky with with my .75 inch groups and thats with a 15 to 20 fps velocity spread through a chrony. thats means if your Muzzle loader is a 50 cal shooting a saboted 45 cal bullet and getting 1/2 MOA at 100 yards that means roughly your gun shoots through the same exact hole everytime, which would mean you have absolutely no velocity spread? are you sure the last 4 shots of your group didn't just miss the target altogether? because I could see one 45 cal bullet rip a .5 inch hole in a target but not 5 shots . Because with my muzzle loader shot with a 240 gr xtp and 2 pyrodex pellets (100 gr), my velocity spread is about 60 to 70 fps meaning my bullet doesnt leave the barrel at the exact same velocity everytime my best group at 100 yards with my muzzle loader is 4 inches open sights usually its 5 inches or more and 5 holes touching at about a 1.5 inch group with a scope and that was my absolute best most of the time its a 2 to 3 inch group with a scope.

you know if you wanted to blow smoke up our butts hoping we would believe you, you should have said a 1 inch group that I would have probably believed you, but 1/2 inch groups with a Muzzle loader I find very hard to believe because as long as I have been shooting a muzzle loader I have never ever seen that kind of consistancy even shot off a benchrest. maybe if you weighed every charge with a grain scale and trimmed and weighed your sabots so they were all identical and seated the sabot/bullet in the muzzle exactly the same everytime and completely cleaned your gun inside and out between shots, then maybe id beleive 1/2 MOA, but there are tomany variables in muzzle loading to get that kind of accuracy.

there I feel better I had to get that off my chest before my head exploded..........

RE: 2 or 3 777 pellets
 

My best group at 100 yards with my flint was about 4 inches. I consider that awesome and am very happy. That was shooting from a bench with lots of sandbags. if you let go of the gun it wouldn't move from it's aim. I had one flyer at that range though, about 7 inches from center of group. Maybe the guy meant that the shots were spread out with 1/2 inch separating some of the shots, which is pretty good to be sure.

RE: 2 or 3 777 pellets
 

I guess there is more than one "correct" way to measure group size, but usually you want the greatest distance between any two holes, center to center. To obtain that, its easiest to measure between the outside edges of the holes, then subtract one bullet diameter.

Therefore, a 1/2" group with 50 cal bullets would essentially look like one 1" diameter hole. A 1" group (discounting tearing of the target) would theoretically have 1/2" of space between the inside edges of the holes.

Minute of angle (MOA) is a term used to describe the measure of the actual angle you would get if you drew lines from two holes in the target, back to the muzzle. The lines would be pretty close to parallel, but would of course intersect at the muzzle. That's where you'd measure the angle. With a 1" group, that angle would measure about 1/60th of a degree, or one minute of one degree of angle.

I have no idea what 1/2" moa is.

RE: 2 or 3 777 pellets
 

For simplicity, when I measure my group, I measure from the center of the two farthest apart shots. If I have an obvious flyer I discount it. Simple.

RE: 2 or 3 777 pellets
 

I see a lot of people giving msk26ny a lot of flak about his group. I can consistantly shoot 3/4"-1" groups at 100 yards with my Encore 209x50. I shoot 3, 50 grain Pyrodex pellets pushing 200 grain T/C Shockwave sabots and use Winchester Shotgun primers. I clean between every shot with 2 wet patches and 2 dry patches and also wait 5-10 minutes between shots. Obviously I shoot from a solid rest with front and rear sandbags to achieve this. BTW, I measure my groups from the outer edge of one hole to the outer edge of the farthest hole. If you subtract the diameter of the bullet, then you can technically say some of my groups are 1/2" C2C. I think I will post a few pictures of my targets later tonight to avoid people calling me a liar but right now I am at work. I know, it is nice to play while being paid. :D

To talk about the original question, I use 3, 50 grain Pyrodex pellets because that is what gives me the best groupings. I
have used 2 pellets before and have tried different brands, styles and weights of sabot bullets. I do have more smoke belching out of the front of my barrel but what are we really concerned about here? I think it is consistancy, grouping and confidence. If I can consistantly achieve good groups, I will be confident in my setup, therefore a better shooter/hunter. And that's the bottom line.

Experiment with your ML and find which combination gives you the best accuracy so that you can be confident in your setup. Everyone will have their own opinion about what is best but that is based upon their own experiences. Use their experiences as information to build your own conclusion

Steve.

RE: 2 or 3 777 pellets
 

Steve, everybody gets 1/2" groups every once in a while. That doesn't mean its a .5MOA rifle. Where do you live. I would love to watch someone get this kinda groups from hunting loads. Maybe school me some.

RE: 2 or 3 777 pellets
 

Bigcountry, I live in Catonsville and my range is in Marriottsville. I would be happy to have you come out with me and shoot. As I said, I can get sub 1" groups at 100 yards off of a solid rest on a bench with my loads. I doubt if anyone can get that offhand in a real hunting situation but knowing that my ML is capable of it gives me more confidence. I trust it more than I trust my slug gun. Heck, it gets better groups than half of my rifles. Let me know if you want to take me up on my offer. I don't know how much I can "school" ya but I'd be happy to show you my range.

Steve

RE: 2 or 3 777 pellets
 

Deal. Just let me know when you will down there. I don't belong to there, but shoot at Hap Baker in Westminster. Can I shoot if I am with you?