Muzz30

If I was you and you owned a winchester muzz gun I would get rid of that POS. Mine blew up today at the range after only 60 to 70 rounds through it. Noone was hurt at all but scared the hell out of me and the other shooting next to me. I have no idea what happened, but i will never own another muzzleloader from winchester again.[:@]

cayugad

Well I am sure glad to hear that no one was injured. Although having a rifle blow up on me would not tend to cause me to have a lot of respect for the brand. Winchester is a BPI product which includes a lot more then just Winchester.

What kind of load were you shooting when the rifle blew? I sure hope that BPI will come forward and stand behind what the sell. This is a very serious incident....

Muzz30

I was shooting 110 grains of tripple 7 and a 275 grain power belt. Everything was seated firmly and nothing I did to cause this. I am at a loss of words as to what happened and a loss of one pair of shorts. All i can say is that they better handle this speedy and profesionally. I have a hunt that starts in 4.5 weeks. I honestly think I am screwed.

cayugad

Muzz30 good luck in your quest for justice on this. That load should not have caused any damage to the rifle in my opinion. I could see this happen if the barrel was stressed or something, or even if you loaded it wrong, but in normal operation that barrel should have held. I many times shoot loads which I am sure would produce greater barrel pressures then that.

I have a CVA Staghorn Magnum made by BPI. So this is a real eye opener. I still think my rifle is safe, but with this happening it sure makes you wonder the next time you load and shoot.

Please keep us posted on how BPI treats you over this matter. I am real glad you, or no one else was hurt, but your right. You need to get moving to make hunting season....

HighDesertWolf

Heh I have a cva hunterbolt. I know that even with a 150 grains pyrodex it only produce a chamber pressure of about 16,000 psi but any muzzle loader can withstand even higher pressures. A friend of mine told me about a test that was done on BPI muzzle loaders that they have tested them all the way up to pressures of twice of what a 150 grains of pyrodex produces that would be in the range of 32,000 psi. I beleive that too, since the same friend conducted his own test with a CVA staghorn he double charged it with 4 pyrodex pellets 200 grains of pyrodex he rigged the trigger so he could stand behind a wall when it was fired, it fired fine no signs of excessive pressure or stressing he loaded it again this time with 5 pyrodex pellets 250 grains of powder this time the it breeched but only cracking the barrel from the reciever up to about the last 8 inches of the barrel. in this case I know BPI makes a good rifle I would put my money on the idea that Muzz30 did something funny. I hope you know that with trip 7 if you use a traditional powder measure you are supposed to cut the charge back by 20 percent since it only takes about 80% in volume of trip 7 tp perform the same as pyrodex so basically if you measure 150 of trip seven in a blackpowder measure you should actually only measure out 120 grains to perform the same as pyrodex so in all actuallity your 110 grains of trip 7 could have really been 140 grains. I'm really hoping it was your error and not the quality of BPI gun that caused your incident. I'm sorry if that sounds heartless but its the truth I'm sure cayugad feels the same way. either way keep us posted on what turns out on your ordeal I would like to know if i should get rid of CVA or not.

Tomster

Sorry to hear about your ML. I can only say, when they send you a new barrell, I would turn around and sell the gun. Get another ML. I too have a CVA, the Firebolt, and I have shot 150 grains out of it with no problems, but I have lowered the load to under 100 grains.

The CVA Optima pro is a nice shooting ML. I have a friend that just picked one up and he is very happy with it.

I'm also glad no one was hurt.

Tom

Muzz30

Blaming me is pretty ballsy considering you know nothing about me! I did nothing wrong as the range master was standing there watching me shoot as were other guys. The winchester rep came to the store today and took the gun imedietly and told the salesman to upgrade me to the Apex and dont ask any questions and he left. That tells me there is a problem and he hauled ass. Well I got the new Apex stainless camo and traded it for a real muzzleloader ( Omega). I have been hunting with muzzleloaders for 10 years now and have not had a problem or accident yt till this jewel. I resent the blame being put on me. I am not an expert but i know what I was doing and there was nothing i did to cause this.

txhunter58

At 110 grains of 777, at 20% more powerfull than pyrodex, that would be the equivalent of 132 grains equivalent of pyrodex, well within the stated tolerances of the gun. Muz has been shooting muzzleloaders for over 10 years, so I feel confident that if he says it was not his fault, it wasn't.

Wonder if it could have anything to do with the fluted barrel?

cayugad

The load you were shooting should have been more then safe. I am also sure that someone who has been around muzzleloaders as long as you have did not make some stupid mistake. I am convinced this was not your fault. Perhaps some day you might actually know the reason the rifle failed.

Also as you said, the actions of the Winchester rep tends to make one think they might want this matter forgotten real fast. The big problem is there are others out there using and depending on BPI products which now may have that little hint of doubt in the back of their mind about the safety of their rifles. As I stated before, I have a CVA Staghorn Magnum and I think it is a great rifle. Do I trust it 100%? That is a good question.

The big questions that need to be answered are, was this a fluke barrel? Was this one that slipped past someone somewhere? With all the BPI rifles out there, these are very important questions. I think I might have demanded a formal explaination from the Winchester Rep after they discovered the reason the barrel failed. Another thing to watch for is a sudden recall of Winchester rifles for any reason.

As for them upgrading you to a Apex, that is the least they could have done. Actually he should have offered to trade you to any rifle in the store. The Omega is a great rifle. It will serve you well. Put 100 grains of your Triple Se7en with a 250 grain Shockwave in there. If it is anything like my Black Diamond XR the groups you will shoot will astound you.

Again, good luck and thank goodness no one was hurt......

Muzz30

Well I thought it was funny that i told the salesman i wa on my way down to talk with the rep and in the 10 minute drive he had hauled ass and the gun was with him. i dont know what they will come up with but he went around telling the guys in the store it was a short start problem. I call bull ****!! I did not put the bullet in the barrel and not push it down and seat it properly. I think he was making up some quick excuse and he split. I know there is lemons in everything and I just happened to get one. But I think he should have stayed there to talk to me and make things right, As far as just giving me a Apex is not making things right but it was a very good start as far as getting me back into a new gun. To bad it was another Winchester. I have a winchester super X 2 that i love. I will keep it. I have heard good things about the Omega and hope mine will shoot as well as the winchester did. I was getting some awsome groups out of it. I will shoot the power belts probobly in 348 grain because I dont care much for sabots. If anyone has a better flatter shooting cinicle please let me know.

Thanks and good luck to you all this fall. Muzz30