The truth about muzzleloading!!!
 

The world is getting corrupt with very bad people. And it's all colors,religions, sex, etc. I see it on these forums, work, schools, malls. Parties etc. It absolutely shocks me how people will lie and say anything for attention.

And it really leads right back to Muzzleloading/Hunting. Super91, Underclock, and Randy Wakeman really helped me the most. And the most important thing I learned from them was they told it the way it was. White Rifles was a great example. The dirty white boys always thought they were the best, nothing's every wrong with a White. Well UnderClock and Super91 would tell you the truth. There were and are many issues with White rifles. Super91 used to and maybe still does custom out White Rifles. UnderClock loved them and probably still does but he new what was good and bad.

When it comes to muzzleoading rifles I went another direction. I don't think you gotta just own a White rifle for example. I think there are many really good options. If anyone asks me what they should buy I tell them what I like.

My number one choice today is a Knight Ultralite. It's my favorite and I helped design most of it. My second choice is a NULA. If this gun was stainless it would be number 1 but it's not. My third choice is a T/C Triumph. I absolutely love this gun. My 4th choice is a Knight Vision. This was a great, very accurate and cheap ML. Just recently the price has gone up and not sure why. I can do anything with all four of these Muzzleloaders I want.

I highly discourage anyone from CVA and Bergara barrels. There rifles have nothing but cheap parts and low quality materials. Bergara barrels are accurate but very weak in comparison to Green mountain and other barrel manufactures. But if you gotta own one, don't use over 110grns by volume of a bp substitute and a 250grn bullet.

Powders are very simple. BH209 is by far the best you can use with proper breech plug. When I factor time and materials BH209 is cheaper to me. But I can also use 777 and do everything I can with it I can with BH209 just more aggravation. I'm anti Pyrodex, and all the others on the market today.

Bullets are always a hot topic. I'll start with round balls. I've shot plenty of Deer with round balls to say 45 and 50cal round balls are not a great choice. I would highly suggest using at least 54cal if your in the market. I've also learned how much more effective saboted bullets are over round balls and prefer to use them. A couple Chronagraphs and some very east tests can show you that.

The number 1 saboted bullets are Bloodlines to me. If you research Ron Laughlins bullet testing it will also show you how well the Bloodlines are at all velocities compared to other bullets on the market. I also recommend the 275grn ballistic Extremes on Deer size game. I also reccomend the 260grn DeadCenters by Cecil Epps. They are fabulous bullets on all big game. The bullets I highly don't reccomend are powerbelts and big heavy conicals. I personally shot lots of Deer with powerbelts with horror stories even though I don't think I lost a Deer with them. At least I don't remember so anyway. I witnessed embarrassing results with big heavy conicals on hogs at least a couple years in a row. Even write ups in magazines about it. Not sure on Deer size game but I stay away from them myself.

People on these forums like to assume things and write things that are absolutely false. So my beliefs really haven't changed much over the last few years. But this is what I believe is the best and what I use.

I am testing some new bullets that I got mixed emotions on now but that's what I enjoy doing.

If people on this board wanna call me names or make assumptions on what I like so be it. But this is the facts of what I like and do. What you wanna believe I can't control.:s4:

In my opinion , for what its worth , the best bullets i have used are
Dead Centers
Bloodlines (lehigh)
Parker match hunters
Not necessarily in that order

Worst bullets i have used are Powerbelts
But i have no problem with and use heavy lead conicals

Best guns that i have besides my customs are
My Whites, ( Super 91) Knights ( original disc , elite , mountaineer) and Tc (Triumph or Omega ), for inlines anyway

P.s. And i dont need to lie for attention 😀

I don't need attention.

Obviously we are in that period of time where winter has set in...along with depression. Lol

Thors.
PowerShot Aerolights
Found balls

For me. And in no particular order.

Along with my weak barreled (brand bashing) CVA muzzies.

I guess someone might get something out of that. :confused2:

I think the Accura MR in SS/black is probably the best rifle on the market for the money.

So there!! ;)

Grouse...

I believe your username is fitting...

http://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/d...glish/grouse_2

BPS

Just validates what you said about people in this forum, thanks!!

Cecil's bullets may be good but he sure messed up his nef breach plug, then after telling him about it and giving correct measurement I have heard nothing back, nothing . This is fact not false .

for that reason alone I won't support his product. I have seen and heard good results from the bloodline bullets but I have enough 300 gr deep curls to last a long long time.

Sorry to hear that!! I've heard he's not to great of a guy but seems alright on the phone.

I belong to the group on the other end of the specturm. I own a couple inlines. A Knight and a CVA. But they are more or less just a novelty to me. I also own a bunch of centerfire rifles, mostly lever guns. But my two greatest loves are archery and muzzleloader hunting. And almost every time I hunt with my muzzleloaders I usually grab one of my 7 or 8 sidelocks. This year for example no CFs came out of my safe. I carried my .58 GM barreled Renegade all through bear and rifle season.
I have no problem with guys (or gals) wanting to use in-lines with BH209 and modern all copper or copper alloy bullet. I'll take a sidelock with good old BP and either a PRB or a saboted XTP depending on what rifle I'm shooting and be content. If it means getting closer to my quarry or passing on the shot that's fine. That's my idea of hunting.

I like some of his bullets too but some of his opinions are WAY off base. Such as a 45cal 1-20 or 1-22 cant shoot sabots well over 1700fps.

He also claims a 1-32 is ideal for a 50cal.

He won't get any more of my money.

As long as he keeps selling 260 gr 40/45 Dead Centers he will get plenty of my mine 😀

They are a great bullet for sure. They should be on sale pretty soon

He should use all the bullet money you guys are giving him and learn to make a correct nef breech plug, at the least respond to the people who told him about it.

i don't see that on these boards. i see lots of folks using what works for them, me included. Someone will start a thread about how well such and such bullet or powder worked for them; then another person will claim his bullet or powder is no good. Why not just let folks use what works for them. In the past i've used big conicals on wild hogs and never lost an animal. Ditto for patched round balls.

Go ahead and use what works for you; i'll continue to use what works for me.

BTW: There must surely be a reason that CVA sells more inline guns than all other makers combined.

Well said falcon.

Yes, very well said about bullets. You never lost an animal. That acceptable for most but not me.

As far as CVA, they are the cheapest to buy good or bad. Plus, they take the biggest loss of all the other companies combined as well. Cabelas and Walmart sell more CVA'S under cost then any other manufacture by far. This is public knowledge you can see for yourself.

It takes more than being cheap to sell a lot of guns. If they weren't accurate and reliable their reputation would get out fast, and they wouldn't sell no matter how cheap they were.

Cheap? No, they're the best bang for the buck. Big difference.

I've never shot any muzzleloader that I couldn't make accurate. With all the different sabots and bullet types it's so easy to get anything to shoot.

Try shooting conicals in some TC inlines.

Actually Pete, their reputation IS out there. At least for a LOT of MLer folks that actually know and have experienced the poor quality of CVA and the shoddy barrels. The reason they sell is because they are cheap and they function somewhat OKAY and with todays economy that is all the general public care about. They could care less that they are cheap knockoffs with poor quality barrels and absolutely NO inspections on the barrels for pressure.

I have shot many connies out of mine. My own casts don't give me the BEST accuracy at 1.5"@ 100 but they are well within reason and they put the hammer of Thor on a hog! BUT, and it makes me a little sick to type this, the best accuracy I ever got out of my TC PH was with 110gr T7 loose and a 295gr Powerbelt aero. 5 shot group under an inch at 150. Too bad their terminal performance doesn't meet up with their accuracy performance! At least it never has for me or several of the guys I know that has hit deer and hogs with them. So, at least my TC barrel shoots connies very well. I know quite a few folks that have TC inlines that shoot connies very well. But like any bullet/barrel you have to come up with a powder load/type that will make that combination shine.

Good grief! It's a known fact that a lot of TC muzzy's don't shoot conicals very accurately. Just because you don't have one doesn't change that fact. I had an Omega that shot conicals good too, but I still accept I was lucky.

As for Bergara being shoddy barrels? You're just spreading false rumors. They have a record of being accurate, and i've never witnessed one blowing up. Have you? Try to be honest.

You left out that tc nor knight do not test every barrel.

Ive shot enough through cvas to know that they are solid in quality reliability and accuracy.

As with every manf of a product, some imperfections can slip by and the customer then uses the provided warranty to fix or replace the part.

Shoot with that evaluation Power Belts should be the best bullet out there according to CVA they are the #1 selling ML bullet on the market.

Not sure #1 makes you/it the best - normally it is the least expensive and easiest to use that sells the most in America today.

Well its safe to say knight isn't number one in sales lol. Especially when it takes two years to sell 25 special run rifles.

If you want to be #1 or at least make people think you are then all you got to do is spend enough money advertising and marketing to brainwash everybody into thinking that . Neither CVA or Powerbelts are that good they just have convinced people they are , so that the masses sing their praises just like the people worshiped Hitler and followed him . You tell a lie long enough and loud enough and people will believe it . Heil CVA ✋

Powerbelts are hardly cheap, so that idea won't fly for the gun either.

The price only affects sales number to a certain point. CVA is way past that point. It sells, because it works.

Besides an Accura is not that cheap. Maybe compared to the overprice American guns it is, but that's a problem caused by greed. I know most will misunderstand that sentence, so think about it before posting.

I see more TC commercials than CVA.

Knight had their run in the old days, TC had their run in the newest and better modern muzzle loader designs, now CVA is taking over.

These days TC just buys out other designs and slaps their name on it.

They've just done run outta ideers.

While CVA just steals TC's ideas and puts their name on it .

More like two months you missed the time schedule completely. They were ordered in Jan and delivered to Knight late in September...

If they're so accurate, why are they not winning in-line competitions? Just asking........

Because they are in the field hunting and dropping monsters.

Hunting seasons are very short, what's wrong with the rest of the year?

Dropping monster piles of #%*t and creating bogus slogans.

Oh i dunno about that. My bro in law has taken a few dandies over the years. Not to mention the thosands of wild game hunters put in the freezer with those non winning inline shooting competition muzzies.

I agree 100% on that.

Knight for example doesn't wanna make cheap muzzloaders. They wanna make the best with quality materials. They easily achieved that in the Ultralite.

Now I here rumors they are substituting quality on some triggers and some other parts. If it's true or they continue to do that they will have junk just like CVA. If that happens I'll just buy T/C'S and NULA'S. So many good options and some new stuff on the market as well.

I love Knights, but if they go down hill I won't say there good that's for sure. We got enough of that with other manufactures lol