Myself, i don't doubt you have fired many shots of Blackhorn without a delay. This doesn't mean your very next shot won't be a delay. What i wrote before was the plug will work just fine, but when you least want it to, it will provide a delay igniting Blackhorn powder. This is still a fact even though you haven't experienced it yet.

Your buddy wrote several times about how he enlarged the flash hole so the CVA plug would work with Blackhorn. He wrote how he shot thousands and thousands of shots through his modified breech plug. His success was with a modified plug, not the stock plug.

Think about it..............................if there was no reason for the CVA Blackhorn breech plug, it wouldn't exist, people wouldn't buy it. People are spending money on Blackhorn plugs for a reason. They buy Blackhorn plugs because they have experienced issues with the stock plug.

Just this morning, i received a pm telling me a fella was mailing me a check to modify his CVA plug so it will be reliable burning Blackhorn powder.

Mulely, Is he sending me money because he likes me? NO, of course not, he is sending me money so he can own a CVA breech plug that will work 100% reliably with Blackhorn powder.

Jon, I really do not remember that at all. I know I have always suggested that you need/should use new FPJ's especially in the hunting situations shooting BH.

And Tom's suggestion or comparison of the convex vs. the concave plug is also valid. The convex plug was designed to reduce blow back and the flash hole was reduced in size to help with this effort. That reduction of size hole in combination of the size of the flash channel in that plug would lead to problems. But as stated these plugs existed long before BH was thought of.

But with all of this what has that got to do with the CVA problem, which I really do believe is not going to be limited to this one ML. And one picture that really puzzles me is the one that chaded pointed out - why is the top of the receiver getting shipped...



This would kind of concern me in a new break open... Is closing the barrel causing this damage???

Some day i might just figure it out.

That is for sure... but you would be surprised how many of those little red things they sell. They are awful popular with a lot of folks - not really me right now but I still keep the option open if I wanted to use them...

I don't really know why this is all on a CVA thread but here is my opinion anyway....
I use to have a disc extreme and a disc elite with the standard fpj breechplug and I had 100% ignition. In my mind the reason to switch to the Lehigh plug was to minimize the blowback and keep the breech area so much cleaner. I would spend a fair ammount of time cleaning that area after a session of shooting bh209.
Unfortunately, and it may have been purely for legal reasons, I think the Lehigh plug took a giant step backwards when they brazed in the ventliner and made in non replacable unless you have Ron's capabilities to drill it out and make it like the old Lehighs.

Jon was modifying the plugs before discovering that a tight headspace was just as good. I never drilled out my plugs. I have no reason to think after 3-4 pounds of powder that i'd get a delay. As long as I did everything right.

As I said. Everybody can't always do everything right 100% of the time. That includes a simple thing like using the right primer.

It's much easier to use a BP that's designed for BH. Everything doesn't have to be perfect. You can use almost any primer except the ML primers, and it works fine. You can have the flash channel pretty clogged up before it won't work. Powder compression isn't as important.

It's a more forgiving BP, and cuts down almost 100% of the complaints CVA got. It also isn't something negative being said about CVA guns. It was a smart move for CVA and Western.

However, I stand by my statement that it's not absolutely needed.

What is it about the differnece between the bone collector and the regular model Triumph that makes it a equal model of the MR? I don't see it. I also don't see the Optima being in the same class as the Triumph either, regular model or not. The v2 would be a somewhat better comparison.

I drilled my plugs before the " head space" adjustment hit me. When i got my thumbhole optima i ran over 40 shots with BH209 with the head space adjusted tight on a factory plug and it was flawless. Now accuracy went down hill after 20 shots but still.

The BH209 plug is still the better plug, i dont get near the crud ring as i did with the flat faced plug when using pyrodex. It acts like my modded nipples for my sidelocks and just keeps it so darn much cleaner with the crud ring.

Sabotloader, the top of the receiver IMO gets chipped from putting the barrel back into place, now did that happen on the MR in question? No clue, mine doesnt have these issues at all so far anyway.

Let the poor guy get his gun fixed, i think this thread has gone on long enough. Let CVA take care of their customer and get him set up and on his way.

Because we're talking about price. So, you need to pick the model with all the frills if you're going to compare.

If that is what it will take to keep this gun I may do it. It is a great shooting gun and fits me very nicely.