sabotloader

It was partly sunny today here in Moscow, that is about the best thing I can say about the weather. Along with the partly sunny came the cool temp of about 50* and the very high winds that pushed the wind chill factor way down there. But I was detirmened to get some shooting in.

I really wanted to test the new Super Powder to see if there was any chance for my "What if" question... Although after seeing a couple of the latest reports I was less than thrilled but I need to see for myself.

But, before I start on the powder let me tell you a bit about this gun, a Knight Big Horn 52 cal... I know there are a lot of folks out there that consider the 52 a waisted caliber, I was one of those folks for several years. The 1:26 twist rate and the fact that I normally shoot .458 bullets anyway + the really great bullet that is available for the gun the Lehigh .458/275 grain DOA.

This gun is known good shooter PJ included a collection of his targets with the rifle and there is no doubt that it can shoot. I decided to start a-new with the bore so I did my standard cleaning routine, First it weent our in the shop and Barnes CR10 was liberally patched in the barrel and allowed to stand for 30 minutes. Then it came back in and I washed the bore out with Zep Citrus Cleaner/Degreaser and the hottest tap water I could get. I use a bore mop for this process. When the soapy bath was done then the bore was rinsed with boiling water to strip any oils that might be trapped in the pores and to loosen any plastic fouling that might be hanging on behind the lands. The nback to shop to dry the bore with compressed air while the bore was boiling hot. Then back to the gun cradle while the bore was way to hot to handle. Two dry patches were then run to make sure it was dry. Then a visual inspection to see if I could see any flakes of plastic fouling... none to be seen PJ had cleaned the gun very well prior to shipping it to me. The bore is now stripped to bare clean metal. I then, while the bore is still way to hot to handle, run 4 patches T17 blue patches both sides. The hot bore litterally sucks the T17 up into the pores. From there the barrel the barrel cools to the point it can be handled by hand - still really warm but at least you can grab it. Clean white patches are ran to clean out the loose T17. And at this point, and the barrel is still warm, I put the Montana Xtreme BC in the bore and let it stand till the barrel is room temp. The last step - dry patch again and get as much out as you can.

Once this is all done the outside of the barrel is cleaned and treated and the whole works is reassembled.

PJ use a scope on the gun but I installed a Williams FP sight and plan to keep the gun an open sight gun for Idaho's ML season. I then bore sighted it and waited for the powder to get and then the weather to clear up a bit... today it di and today was the day to shoot.

Headed to farm.... I had already decided to shoot the JSG-SP first. I only had 20 of the Lehigh .458/220's left and staying in the parameters set by APP, I shot 100 grains of loose powder by volume and a bullet less than 250 grains.

Shooting condition were not very good at all... the winds were blowing right across the target (left to right) and to even pour the powder you had to stand with your back in the wind and keep the powder and measure close to your chest to shield the powder from the wind.

I popped 3 #11 caps to clean the BP - ran a windex patch to clean that fouling and went about loading the first shot.
On the target you can see there were four groups shot today. After each group the FP sight was adjusted to get me closer to the 10 ring. Target was set at 50 yards.

I was really disappointed in the first group of 4 shots, but then after reading other posts... I just thought well it goes with the powder. The good thing! I remember thinking to myself these velocities are not like the older APP powders I have shot!!! They are not even close to as anemic as the old stuff. One other observation... in the house I had decided the powder to be fairly uniform but out in the daylight it was really obvious that it was not uniform but certainly not as big as the old APPs... Some feel that this powder might be resurected Pinnacle, but I do not remember Pinnacle having these velocities either.

OK so the second group did not do much for me either but the velocities held up. Group 3 began to show some promise and again very good velocities.

It was time to switch powders as I was running out of bullets. During the JSG-SP shooting no patches were ran and non were necessary, everything loaded just fine.

Basically I only shot one group of T7 and shot #17 was all me I felt it slip out but I wanted to get it shot and get packed up, I really wanted to shoot this last group to check velocities for the comparison. Also during this T7 shooting no patches were run - non were necessay and many more shots could have been had with out running a patch.

One windex patch was ran after shooting JSG-SP and one patch was ran after shooting T7.

Then I went back and found the BH velocities for the same bullet but these velocities are with 110 grains of BH and 209 ignition. When you throw those velocities in the mix, maybe APP has something when they say comparable velocities with BH???? That might be why they limit the powder to 250 grain bullets, because as you go up in weight the BH will get better.

Here are some general pics of todays outing....



And here is today's target....



For myself... I have made no real decisions about JSG-SP yet I am going to have to do more shooting with it to give it a fair chance. It still could hold some promise which is good - I really did not want to fertilize the flower bed again with left over JSG.

Semisane

EXCELLENT report Sabotloader. You `da man!

Nothing wrong with those SP groups. It appears the velocities got real consistent as the barrel fouled.

sabotloader

You know that was exactly what I thought at the time... But, I still am surprised at the velocities that this powder generated. It certainly to me is not the old stuff... It really surprised me when they were in the area of BH and T7.

The accuracy might even be there it just not what i wanted today. But then again the gun was new to me and there is a bit of learning curve anytime you shoot a new gun + I was dinging with the sight - so all the confidence in the world was certainly not there for this outing....

Gm54-120

It kinda looks like the JSG liked a fouled bore too..at least the fps leveled off a bit and it was higher. 8 9 and 10 looked like it was starting to show promise.

falcon

Thanks, Sabotloader.

Not sure what APP has come up with. Super Powder does not look like Pinnacle. There appears to be a lot of fine stuff. 3F Pinnacle is much more uniform in size.


Toby Bridges tested Pinnacle for Gun Week. Bridges got a velocity of 1,725 fps using 100 measured grains of Pinnacle and the 260 grain Winchester Platinum bullet.

http://www.gunweek.com/2006/feature0110.html

Gm54-120

I will have to dig up a test that showed a few powders but they used it in a 45colt cartridge. They used a revolver and a rifle with "cowboy loads".

In short the article said, even in a cartridge IIRC APP products fps were all over the place.

lemoyne

Has any one tried it with a 275 or 300gr bullet?

sabotloader

With the new Super Powder, comes restrictions... 100 grains powder max and 250 rain bullet max...

I am sure it is a liability thing and they are going to leave it up to the manufactures to change... Even today Hodgdon still says two pellets max. Everybody is trying to cover the older ML that might not hold the heavier charge.

cayugad

Well that is an excellent report. As for their restrictions... seems kind of strange to me. I am sure it is a liability issue like they say. I think they do that to cover themselves.

I am impressed with the velocities you got.

flounder33

I really think all those groups are very decent with open sights. I would think that Bighorn would shoot better with a little longer, heavier bullet. I think that 250 grain restriction is the main thing that would keep me from trying this powder.
Art