falcon

My Grafs order just came in. Ordered theseHarvester hard cast bullets because they were cheap. About $6.50 for 20.The bullets are.44 caliber 280 grainwith big flat noses. They came withcrush rib sabots. Anyone here ever use them?

These may be just the thing for popping big old boar hogsthrough the shoulders. Will give them a try when i visit our place in Garvin county tomorrow.

hunting junkie

No,but for that price will be waiting for a range report, indeed

Screwbolts

Nope, the Mold I have is for the .451 dia. 330 gr. smooth sided LFN. Veral Smith of LBT Molds made the molds for Harvester. The ones I cast shoot under 2" at 175 yrds and less than 5" at 300 . That is from 2 ML10IIs . I use the short Black standarb sabot in the 10mlIIs and like the Knight black sabot in my T-Bolt.

John/MI

A little background; I am a new forum member and have just re-entered muzzle-loading, after being out of it for years. I stopped mostly because I got tired of cleaning the gun while using BP, Pyrodex and 777. I'm just now back into ML with a Savage 10ML-II. Living in Michigan I have to use BH209 during the hunting season. The few deer I bagged years ago were with Harvester hard-cast bullets and SST's. The SST's did OK at a distance, but up close they came apart without exiting, while the hard-cast bullets went in and out, even if the deer ran farther before going down. Less meat damage too. However, up close the Harvester's knocked them down faster than the SST's. I never understood why.

Now that I'm back into ML'ing some things have changed. I don't endure heavy recoil these days, and I don't see deer that far away anymore. Due to reducing my powder now, I expect my shots will be little more than 100 yards and mostly less.

I don't have a chronograph so my question is: what kind of velocities can be expected from a 22" barrel with 70 to 80 grains of BH209 under bullets of 280 grains (Harvester hard cast) and 250 grains (SST's)? I suppose with some hold-over, I can try for 150 yard shots (from shooting sticks) but need enough velocity at that range to still cleanly take a deer.

I know there are other bullets out there but I want to start with the ones I'm familiar with. And I know Savages says it's barrel is 24" but mine measures 22" from muzzle to breech plug.

Maybe there is someone here who is aging like me and is more into comfortable shooting than velocity and long range. Thanks ahead of time for any information or suggestions you guys might offer.

John in Michigan

falcon

i did shoot those bullets on a couple of my range trips. At 50 yards they made good groups when fired from my CVA Stag Horn. The powder was Goex Pinnacle 2F: Don't remember how much i used.

i allowed work to interfere with my recreational shooting and hog hunting this year. That will never happen again.

Screwbolts

BH209 will work fine with your ML10II In my Knight t-bolt 80grV of BH209 cronographs 1478 FPS out of a 22" barrel with my 330 gr. hard cast. this load will work on anything on this continent with real authority. Verel Smith of LBT recommends for max killing effect 1500 MV This load also shots very flat. sighted dead on at 75 yards is 1 inch high at 100 and about an inch low at 125 yards. 3" low at 150. Still well within the vitals of most game with a dead on hold out to 150.

I would try the .430 280s with the Green sabots but you may have much better accuracy with the .452/.451 330s in the short black or supplied long black sabot. As posted earlier I cast my own. We shoot this bullet in many Muzzle loaders, 3 savage ML10II, 1 ML10 and I have a my own custom built Remington Rolling Block with a 26" stainless 50 cal barrel that I built expressly for smokeless powder, the original substitute for Black powder.

Other friends and family shot them in all kinds of inlines. I recommend a load equivalent to 80 GrV of BH209 or Less. Even a 1200 FPS load will kill quickly and you will be able to eat right up to the Boolit hole.

I will be hunting this year with the Roller, and will be shooting a load that consists of a very light charge, 30Gr of SR4759, this gives me a muzzle Velocity measured 10' from the muzzle of just 1500 FPS. the recoil isn't real bad and it shoots just like the load of 80grV BH209. I say light load because the Ssavage manual list the recommended loads of 39gr to 44 gr I believe.

The barrel on your Savage is measured from the bolt face to the end, I don't think there is a single gun manufacturer that measures from the Breech plug to the muzzle. All center fire rifles are measured and listed from the bolt face to the end of the barrel.

90 grV of BH209 read 1650 out of my T-Bolt, 105 Gr clocks 1778 same gun, these are all with the 330 gr Hard cast and a HSB sabot.

The Metplat of the Hard cast is the secret, not really a secret in the world of Cast Boolitz, but is foreign and not understood by shooters of Condom wrapped bullets.

You will find that shooting 60 to 90 GrV of BH209 your Savage vent liner will last almost forever.

My advice, try the 280s but it is well know that the thinner the sabot the better the accuracy. I would shoot for at least 35 pounds of ramrod pressure to push the boolitz and sabot down the barrel. if your 280s are less roll them against a file to Knurl them up to a larger diameter to give you the needed load resistance.

Happy shooting, By the way if you were to spill; BH209 and SR 4759 on the same surface you would be hard pressed to tell the difference. just a thought.

Long live the Hand cast Boolitz!

Semisane

Hey Screwbolts, do you cast those with soft lead or a hardened alloy? Can you post a picture of the bullets?

EDIT: Oops! Just re-read everything and realized you're dealing with hard cast. I'm not a fan of hard cast bullets on deer, even WFNs. Had some bad experiences with hard cast WFNs out of my .41 mag. But I'd sure like to try some of those 330 LFNs in soft lead. If I send you ten pounds of lead, would you send back a pound of bullets?

Screwbolts

Sounds like a plan to me, If you use a flat rate box from the USPS shipping will be reasonable.

I also cut a mold for a cast boolit the same shape and size of the .452 250 gr XTP they come out 260 gr. small metplat like the xtp.

I remember your previous comments about your bad experience with the .41. I think I may have commented that I thought you were pushing them to fast. Verel wrote in his book, and told me that if I push the LFN fast, it will give diminishing returns. The WFN is even more sensitive because of that WIDE nose.

I will PM you my Address.

Ken

Semisane

Excellent!

Screwbolts

I will even send you some air cooler wheel weights of them also to let you try pure and a slightly harder. As you know air cooled WW isn't hard cast. My hard cast are dropped in water from the mold, with the alloy and mold hot enough to frost the boolitz.