RE: 250 vs 300gr
 

sabotloader, if you research the rpm of a bullet I think you will find that it holds its rpm for longer than its normal usable trajectory. WhatI would suspect is a possability is in a loose bore the bullet might slip in the sabot.
I am wondering if some of these combinations people are using because of how easythey load are boederline in stability and will there for will be eratic at long range? Lee
I also have used 230-240-250-260and 270 gr bullets on deer with excellant results,the SW,the Gold dot the nosler usually pass through the lighter XTP a lot of times dont but when you get a bang flop you dont need a blood trail.I dont have any thing against 300gr I like them for Bear,Elk and Boar, but I have come to believe that the best all round is the 50/40 200 gr and they shoot excellant out to 200 for me in the Omega and the Triumph but the 1-38 twist System oneshoots the 230 and 240 best the 230 Gold Dot has been doing an excellant jog of bang flop out of that gun and it normally leaves a gaping exit hole to [load is 150gr RS and a musket cap] as they group in 3 inches at 150 I wouldtake a distance shot if I ever got one my records show longest actual shot was a buck at 84 yds bullet exited far side deer ran about 35 yds.Lee

RE: 250 vs 300gr
 

I have not had great luck with crushed rib sabots regarding tight groups. I went to these sabots due to the tight barrel omega issues that some people experience. While the crushed rib definitely makes loading easier I haven't been impressed with my groups at 50 yards with 250gr XTPs, 300gr XTPs, 300gr speer gold dots, or 250gr SST using this sabot (1-2 inch groups with a scope). In frustration I used some JB's on the barrel as recommended by some wiseman on this forum and tried some 245gr barnes spit fires which I could barely load when I got the gun. Since shooting a few pounds of powder and polishing the barrel the barnes bullets now load fine but definitely require more effort than the crushed rib combos. More importantly they make cloverleafs. I believe what others have said regarding tight load = tight groups and I intend on picking up some MMP sabots to try with the speer bullets.

I must admit that MMP has too many options for me to know which sabot or sabots to try first. Any suggestions for this situation? Also, where is the best place to get them? Direct from MMP or through a vendor?

RE: 250 vs 300gr
 

gopherfan

Thoughts...

MMP HPH-12 (.451/.452 - 50 cal) This is the thickest of the MMP sabots and the sabot i use in the White because of the size of the bore, but it will not go down the Omega, Remingtons, or the A&H

MMP HPH-24 (.451/.452 - 50 cal) this is the thinner sabot and the one that I use in my Omega - Remingtons - A&H - Green Mountain and TC Renegades or Hawkin...

MMP HPH-3p-EZ (.451/.452 - 50 cal) this the thinnest MMP 50 cal sabot - none of my rifles require me to use this sabot but for really tight 50 cals it is available. Several people have indicated that they need it for tight barreled Omega's and Encores...

I do buy them direct, the price from MMP includes shipping, buy 4 packs and get a discount,

If you call MMP you will likely get "Connie" on the other end of the phone and she will take care of business... every once in awhile you will even get Del Ramsey himself - quite a guy - he really knows sabots front and back, but Connie says he is not the best receptionist... He is the owner of MMP.

Hope this helps...

RE: 250 vs 300gr
 

Lee

Excellent point and probably the right answer also. The combination in the White - doe not seem to loose but it is certainly looser than the the any of the other combinations that I shot from the White. I am really confident it, the 200,will shoot correctly from the smaller bore rifles that I have even @ 200 yards. What lead me astray was how well it shot @ 100 and then spray @ 200. I also remember in some earlier testing from the Omega it had a great pattern @ 150 from the Omega.

Shooting the last two trips to Elk River is the first time I have ever shot a ML out to 200 for a group... I have shot them to 200 and beyond before but never at a paper target looking for a group.

RE: 250 vs 300gr
 

That saying needs to be repeated, repeated and repeated---tight load= tight groups. I also shoot the Crushed rib in my Omega and Knight Disc Origonal. I have a bag of every kind of MMP sabot to try with different guns but I like the crushed rib the best for overall loading pressure, I buy the Crushed rib from MidSouth Shooter's supply. I buy the MMPs direct from MMP,http://www.mmpsabots.com/. I believe finding he right sabot for a given bullet you want to shoot is as important as finding the right powder load.Bullet design is very important to accuracy also, for example the 300g TC SW and the 275g Parker Ballistic Extreme with supplied sabot shot great out of my Savage, but the Barnes TMZ did not for example. Over on Doug's Savage Forum, several guys rough up the Barnes TMZ by rolling them between two files, this makes them slight larger and grips the sabot better and they get excellent accuracy. I don't really want to mess with all that, so I take the "tight sabot approach" to increasing accuracy.

You would be wise to Print to PDF Sabotloaders MMP descriptions of each of the MMP Sabots, you can download a free PDFwriter here: http://www.cutepdf.com/

Bottom line would say this based on my experience:

tight sabot + right load= <1.5"groups at 100 yards.

Chap Gleason

RE: 250 vs 300gr
 

Your missing a few. ;)

http://www.mmpsabots.com/

He haseight 50 caliber sabots.

Standard Sabots:
MMP Black 45/50 .451-.452
MMP Green 44/50 .429-.430

HPH Sabots:
HPH Blue 50/40 .399-.400
Green HPH 50/44 .429-.430
HPH 3 Petal EZ Black 50/45 .451-.452
HPH 12 Black 50/45 .451-.452
HPH 24 Black 50/45 .451-.452
HPH Orange 50/45 .457-.458

RE: 250 vs 300gr
 

Wolfhound

Ya I know _ was just trying to make a little less confusing.... otherwise I could have posted this...

RE: 250 vs 300gr
 

gleason.chapmanI agree to a point, when it gets too tight and bullets or sabots are distorted or you can not load with out special equipment I think accuracy goes west.
It is interesting to mr that my new Triumph will shoot almost all the commen bullets and powder loads inside two inches and the best ones shoot clover leaves; it is just tight enough that I have to struggle a bit to load it,it also has a very smooth barrel.
Sabotloader,the thought behind what I said is that is exactally the way the to slow for the bullet length twists act and my Omega has held 5" groups at 250yd with the 50/40 200gr which I think is good for Mz I just hope the Triumph will do as well. Lee

RE: 250 vs 300gr
 

Lee

Yep! I agree - that is why i think i will be OK in all of me other rifles which have a much tighter bore than the White...

RE: 250 vs 300gr
 

Sabotloader, let us in on it when you try the other rifles. And if you have any ideas on why some rifles will shoot almost anything well and others are very touchy about having the right load to shoot good,I would be very interested in hearing them. Lee