Got to get out for awhile this morning... wanted to make thefinal check on the scope... got it sighted in @ 100, then spent some time picking off rocks on stumps...

Do not know what this proves, but one of my experiments was to place a 8/10 lb. rock on a stump @ a 100 yards then shoot it off the stump with a 200 grain XTP. I wanted to see if the 200 would split the rock or push it off the stump. Well it moved it off the stump and back about 2 feet - so I predict it will penetrate the hide of a deer @ a 100...

The last thing I did was move the target back to 120 yards - I wish I had gone to 150 - next time... but I shot six shots @ 120 and was really pleased. Again, I am sure the gun could do better with another shooter. I am quite sure with a more solid bench and bags, better breathing things would tighten up...

You guys waiting for your guns - I can not wait for you to get yours and get shooting...

Hey Sabotloader. Is this the gravel pile near Stricnine ridgepast Laird Park near Emida, ID? If so, we may not be that far apart.

Thanks for your advice on my 700Ml thread. It was really helpful.

Chris

Chris H.

That's the pile... I worked for the FS for 100 years or so and spend a lot of time in that area...

I am in Moscow

I have two of those Remington's and I really think they are great guns. The shoot great...

Those 200 grain XTP's I have a box coming any minute. I also need to order the sabots next week. They are legal in Wisconsin for deer hunting and I see no reason why a well placed shot of one of them would not dispatch a deer just fine. Granted they might be too small for larger then deer critters although I even question that with the kind of power they are displaying for you.

but they don't fit right!

UC

Whudoyameen "de doen't phit rite"

de phit phine & shoot grate

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cayugad

The real problem in my mind is time in flight, out here time in flight can make a huge difference when an animal is moving and you need to take a moving shot. The elk are very intelligent and terribly flighty after the very first shot of the season, a lot of the shots may be at moving going up between timber 1/4tering away from you. Whitetail are even worse.

As a veteran of the Navy I understand that a sixteen inch cannon carries one heck of tonage for a long ways... but then again as ground pounder I certainly am not going to carry around a cannon shell when I get lighter, faster, and flatter with velocity. Even the military has recognized the fact that lighter, faster, flatter is better. They have moved from 30 cal guns down to 22's - can not say that I like that but it is what is happening.

I really feel if I have 1000 or near a 1000ft lbs of energy at the given range (200 yards) I can take anything Iwant to shoot - except for dangerous game. Of course that goes along with bullet placement. Now the faster, flatter, I can get it there the better. I know the old saying in ML "bigger hole is better" and that came from mans run in with the grizzly, but I am not a believer in that statement. Dead is Dead. Heck the eskimos harvest Polar Bear with a 22 rimfireand yet if you were to offer them a cannon most would try and then go back to the 22.

I am sure you realize that an animal moving across your face at 100 yards could walk right out of the path of one of thosebig bullets before it got there. In the timber leading is a somewhat difficult thing also.

[align=left]Range Path Velocity Energy[/align][align=left]yrds in fps ft/lbs[/align] 300 grain Speer Gold Dot
(100 grains of T7-2f)
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[align=left]muzzle -1.5 1354 2015 -1.51750 2040[/align]

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[align=left]50 1.91274 1784 2.141616 1739[/align]

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[align=left]100 0.0 1202 1589 2.441493 1484 .18 of a sec[/align]

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[align=left]150 -8.0 1140 1427 -1.16 1380 1268[/align]

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[align=left]200 -22.6 1087 1299 -9.35 1276 1085 .4 of a Sec[/align][align=left][/align][align=left][/align][align=left]With this information and my belief that a copper clad bullet is a more efficientkilling machine than a lead bullet - I think I stay with the polymere.[/align][align=left][/align][align=left]I really need to up date this chart also. With the Omega and 110 grains of T7-2f the velocity steps up to 1826 thru my chrono - that will up those numbers a bit....[/align][align=left][/align][align=left][/align]

I just posted a link to this thread over at 24hr Campfire .......eventhough you are shootin' old milk jugs.

Truthfully, I may try to set one up to shoot the lighter stuff and leave the other set for conicals.The one with milk jugresidualscould then by my "varmint rifle".

As to your statement about copper clad being superior - how dead is dead? Can't say I agree but what does it really matter as long as good clean shots are made? You aren't really giving up much on the hole size, but if you've not seen the result of a good hit on a deer-sized animal with a ~500 grain conical - believe me, it's most impressive. The longest any deer has made it after being hit by one of mine is ~30 yards.... he didn't know his heart and lungs were destroyed. Had a buck hit with .270 Win make it nearly 200 yards with no heart.

An animal walking 5 mph at 200 yards is going to travel nearly 3 feet before the bullet (in your example) gets there. If I shoot at an animal at 200 yards - it's going to be stationary. But your hunting terrain is considerably different than these Ozarks so give 'em the gusto!

One thing I'm sure of, you've got an accurate load and a great rifle, so you may have to get real creative if you should happen to miss the big one. There is always the wind.

Sabotloader.. I never hunted in your neck of the woods so I do not know what it is like. Where I hunt 100 yards in the woods is for ever. Most times if you can see 50 yards it is a good place to watch from. Especially in the cedar and Balasm thickets. Maybe in the hardwoods a person might see 100 yards. I am not trying to say a conical is a better option because as Underclocked said, "how dead is dead?" It is just an option for other shooters to conisder. I am sure the sabots your shooting will do fine. Besides, everyone needs to be able to load their rifle down to shoot squirrels and rabbits...

I used to, but stopped shooting at moving animals unless absolutly necessary.