Testing Day at the Rock Pit
11-19-2005, 05:51 PM
#1
Boone & Crockett
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
Testing Day at the Rock Pit
Spent the morning in the rock pit shooting - and here is the report.
(1) I wanted to try the new Speer Gold Dot bullets that I have just purchased.
(2) I wanted to try the new Harvester Crush Rib sabots that I just got in the mail - 50/.451-.452 Black
Easy report first... I normally shoot .451 Nosler Partitions in Nosler Sabots. They are no problem loading into and down either of the Remingtons or the Austin & Halleck (which I have always considered as having tight barrels). I have also loaded .452 Hornady's down these three rifes also without a lot pressure or pain with the Nosler sabot.
My first load was anew Speer Gold Dot .452 300 grain hollow point in a Nosler black sabot. Really really tight to get down. Next load I decided to try the new Crush Rib sabots, because I did not want to fight thesabot down the barrel. TheCrush Rib went down without a problem - almost to easy.Next shot I tried a MMP HPH-24 sabot. I expected it to be as tight as the Nosler - but to my surprise it went down as I would want it. Not as easy as the crush rib but certainly easy enough that I can do it in the field with the guns ram rod and a palm saver.
I did pick up some of the sabots for inspection. One comment I had read somewhere was that t7 stressed the Harvester sabot. My visual inspection of the sabotscertainly does not verify that. Thispicture shows the recovered sabots.
Conclusion: of the three sabots tried the Crush Rib certainly goes done easy as Harvester claims. Those of you with those really tight TC barrels, these sabots might really work for you.
MMP HPH-24 sabots (top three) and Harvester Crush Rib sabots (bottom three) all of these are 50/.451-.452 sabots. The recovery does not show me that any one was stressed any more than the others.
One significant difference - according to the chronograph...
3 shots with Crush Ribs (300 grain bullets) 1710 - 1670 - 1644 fps
4 shots with HPH-24 (300 grain bullets) 1724 - 1729 - 1752 - 1685 fps
(remember the HPH was a tighter sabot)
http://www.hunt101.com/img/345640.gif
Accuracy of the Gold Dot? They certainly work for me! I would love to have recovered a bullet, but shooting in a rock pit with volcanic basalt rock as the back stop - there really is not much to recover.
First impression: Which are always supposed to be significant - when I opened the box - I was un-impressed... The bullets looked OLD I mean really old - they were not shiny at all. The 250 HP really intriqued me - it was really deep - reminded me of a Barnes. The 300 grain HP looked like it would really fly well because the HP was not as deep and was more semetrical.
The two hollow points are significantly different. The 300 grain .452 built for the 454 Casual has a shallow HP with fairily sharp serrated edges. The 250 grain built for the Colt 45 has a very deep HP with serrated edges. Both bullets shoot from my A&H extremly well. I probably should have taken a picture of the bullets and included that in this. If someone would like a picture look-see let me know.
Well here is the target - I will complete the deer hunting season with these bullets, right now I believe I will use the 250 grain to finish out the regular rifle season. Then use the 300 grain in a side hammer for MLseason.note: I never adjusted the scope from its original setting until the end of the day.
http://www.hunt101.com/img/345644.gif
Hope somebody finds this useful - it sure was fun shooting it.
Takes awhile for the photos to load-up be patient
(1) I wanted to try the new Speer Gold Dot bullets that I have just purchased.
(2) I wanted to try the new Harvester Crush Rib sabots that I just got in the mail - 50/.451-.452 Black
Easy report first... I normally shoot .451 Nosler Partitions in Nosler Sabots. They are no problem loading into and down either of the Remingtons or the Austin & Halleck (which I have always considered as having tight barrels). I have also loaded .452 Hornady's down these three rifes also without a lot pressure or pain with the Nosler sabot.
My first load was anew Speer Gold Dot .452 300 grain hollow point in a Nosler black sabot. Really really tight to get down. Next load I decided to try the new Crush Rib sabots, because I did not want to fight thesabot down the barrel. TheCrush Rib went down without a problem - almost to easy.Next shot I tried a MMP HPH-24 sabot. I expected it to be as tight as the Nosler - but to my surprise it went down as I would want it. Not as easy as the crush rib but certainly easy enough that I can do it in the field with the guns ram rod and a palm saver.
I did pick up some of the sabots for inspection. One comment I had read somewhere was that t7 stressed the Harvester sabot. My visual inspection of the sabotscertainly does not verify that. Thispicture shows the recovered sabots.
Conclusion: of the three sabots tried the Crush Rib certainly goes done easy as Harvester claims. Those of you with those really tight TC barrels, these sabots might really work for you.
MMP HPH-24 sabots (top three) and Harvester Crush Rib sabots (bottom three) all of these are 50/.451-.452 sabots. The recovery does not show me that any one was stressed any more than the others.
One significant difference - according to the chronograph...
3 shots with Crush Ribs (300 grain bullets) 1710 - 1670 - 1644 fps
4 shots with HPH-24 (300 grain bullets) 1724 - 1729 - 1752 - 1685 fps
(remember the HPH was a tighter sabot)
http://www.hunt101.com/img/345640.gif
Accuracy of the Gold Dot? They certainly work for me! I would love to have recovered a bullet, but shooting in a rock pit with volcanic basalt rock as the back stop - there really is not much to recover.
First impression: Which are always supposed to be significant - when I opened the box - I was un-impressed... The bullets looked OLD I mean really old - they were not shiny at all. The 250 HP really intriqued me - it was really deep - reminded me of a Barnes. The 300 grain HP looked like it would really fly well because the HP was not as deep and was more semetrical.
The two hollow points are significantly different. The 300 grain .452 built for the 454 Casual has a shallow HP with fairily sharp serrated edges. The 250 grain built for the Colt 45 has a very deep HP with serrated edges. Both bullets shoot from my A&H extremly well. I probably should have taken a picture of the bullets and included that in this. If someone would like a picture look-see let me know.
Well here is the target - I will complete the deer hunting season with these bullets, right now I believe I will use the 250 grain to finish out the regular rifle season. Then use the 300 grain in a side hammer for MLseason.note: I never adjusted the scope from its original setting until the end of the day.
http://www.hunt101.com/img/345644.gif
Hope somebody finds this useful - it sure was fun shooting it.
Takes awhile for the photos to load-up be patient
11-19-2005, 07:04 PM
#3
Boone & Crockett
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
RE: Testing Day at the Rock Pit
cayugad
No, as I understand it they are aregular lead bullet with a copper electroplated onto the lead. A special? alloy of some type harder than regular lead makes up the bottom portion of the bullet and regular lead the upper portion of the bullet. Theory being that the copper and the lead can not separate - therefore retaining weight and penetration - that is the part I really did not get to test... Shooting wise they shoot great.
After testing and adjusting the scope to the new load the last two shots I took were at a basalt boulder on the top edge of the rock pit. It lasered out at 151 yards. The grey splat mark that both the 300 grain and 250 grain bullets made on the the black rock were impressive.
I am really hoping to try them on a whitetail sometime before rifle season is over.
No, as I understand it they are aregular lead bullet with a copper electroplated onto the lead. A special? alloy of some type harder than regular lead makes up the bottom portion of the bullet and regular lead the upper portion of the bullet. Theory being that the copper and the lead can not separate - therefore retaining weight and penetration - that is the part I really did not get to test... Shooting wise they shoot great.
After testing and adjusting the scope to the new load the last two shots I took were at a basalt boulder on the top edge of the rock pit. It lasered out at 151 yards. The grey splat mark that both the 300 grain and 250 grain bullets made on the the black rock were impressive.
I am really hoping to try them on a whitetail sometime before rifle season is over.
11-19-2005, 07:46 PM
#5
Boone & Crockett
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
RE: Testing Day at the Rock Pit
cayugad
I purchased mine in Spokane - Sportsman Warehouse... the 250's and the 300s were around $12.00 per box... Gamaliel has them but when you add shipping on - ouch! Gamaliel lists them as .451 but Speer says and the box says .452
The Speer plant is just down the highway in Lewiston, ID - but anywhere you look around here they are right at $20 per box (50 count bullets)
http://www.gamaliel.com/cart/customer/product.php?productid=3284&cat=&page=1& ;XCARTSESSID=febe6f3c78c6f5d58ae1d2a14eaa59ab
http://www.gamaliel.com/cart/customer/product.php?productid=3283&cat=&page=1
Speer Bullet Products
http://www.speer-bullets.com/default.asp?s1=7&s2=27
Speer Gold Dot Story
http://www.speer-bullets.com/default.asp?s1=3&s2=7&s3=6
hope this information helps...
I purchased mine in Spokane - Sportsman Warehouse... the 250's and the 300s were around $12.00 per box... Gamaliel has them but when you add shipping on - ouch! Gamaliel lists them as .451 but Speer says and the box says .452
The Speer plant is just down the highway in Lewiston, ID - but anywhere you look around here they are right at $20 per box (50 count bullets)
http://www.gamaliel.com/cart/customer/product.php?productid=3284&cat=&page=1& ;XCARTSESSID=febe6f3c78c6f5d58ae1d2a14eaa59ab
http://www.gamaliel.com/cart/customer/product.php?productid=3283&cat=&page=1
Speer Bullet Products
http://www.speer-bullets.com/default.asp?s1=7&s2=27
Speer Gold Dot Story
http://www.speer-bullets.com/default.asp?s1=3&s2=7&s3=6
hope this information helps...
11-20-2005, 09:05 AM
#6
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 21,193
RE: Testing Day at the Rock Pit
thanks for the link.. I have some of the Gold Dot in .430 and they shoot 
lets say.. all right. When you get to 100 yards you tend to get some flyers and I mean they might miss by 10 inches some time. So I will have to order some of them and give them a try. I have been plinking the others off. Actually the 270 grain shoot pretty good out of my CVA Staghorn for some reason.
Plus I have a friend that is going to reload .44 magnum loads for my revolver and he can load them up. At close range what I intend to do with them they should shoot well.
lets say.. all right. When you get to 100 yards you tend to get some flyers and I mean they might miss by 10 inches some time. So I will have to order some of them and give them a try. I have been plinking the others off. Actually the 270 grain shoot pretty good out of my CVA Staghorn for some reason.Plus I have a friend that is going to reload .44 magnum loads for my revolver and he can load them up. At close range what I intend to do with them they should shoot well.
11-20-2005, 09:21 AM
#7
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,922
RE: Testing Day at the Rock Pit
ORIGINAL: cayugad
thanks for the link.. I have some of the Gold Dot in .430 and they shootlets say.. all right. When you get to 100 yards you tend to get some flyers and I mean they might miss by 10 inches some time. So I will have to order some of them and give them a try. I have been plinking the others off. Actually the 270 grain shoot pretty good out of my CVA Staghorn for some reason.
Plus I have a friend that is going to reload .44 magnum loads for my revolver and he can load them up. At close range what I intend to do with them they should shoot well.
thanks for the link.. I have some of the Gold Dot in .430 and they shoot
lets say.. all right. When you get to 100 yards you tend to get some flyers and I mean they might miss by 10 inches some time. So I will have to order some of them and give them a try. I have been plinking the others off. Actually the 270 grain shoot pretty good out of my CVA Staghorn for some reason.Plus I have a friend that is going to reload .44 magnum loads for my revolver and he can load them up. At close range what I intend to do with them they should shoot well.
That was a nice report by Sabotloader. I clicked on his links & before you know it -- I spent a few hours web-searching bullets for my grandson. I settled on a 100-pk of Speer Gold Dot .451s in 185 gr. Also found some revolver roundballs in .451. I will test those roundballs inside some45/50 Harvester sabots coming out of my 1-48" Deerhunter sidelock.
One of those twoloads should work for him out to 50 yards & be of light recoil. I hoping to tune them inusing a 60 grain 777 ballpark volume. With colder weather arriving, all this may have to wait until April thou.
11-20-2005, 09:24 AM
#8
Boone & Crockett
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
RE: Testing Day at the Rock Pit
cayugad
I really do not want to say that I have given up on .44's because of the exact reason you mentioned but I nowam really only shooting 45's or .458
There are still a lot of 44-300's in the gun cabinet and I will eventually shoot them all (i hope) but it will be for recreational plinking..
Maybe later in the year I will be able to do a little more testing at a long range but can not get it done right now, and your home range is probably starting to feel the effects of winter and filling with snow.
I really do not want to say that I have given up on .44's because of the exact reason you mentioned but I nowam really only shooting 45's or .458
There are still a lot of 44-300's in the gun cabinet and I will eventually shoot them all (i hope) but it will be for recreational plinking..
Maybe later in the year I will be able to do a little more testing at a long range but can not get it done right now, and your home range is probably starting to feel the effects of winter and filling with snow.
