What makes a Breechplug a Great BP?
01-06-2010, 04:02 PM
#1
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Northern Chautauqua Co. N.Y.
Posts: 2,976
What makes a Breechplug a Great BP?
It seems more MLer Manufactures today are focused on making the Breechplug better. Im not talking about a (Quick Release) BP as being better, Im talking about what makes a BP just plain better than the rest, and why? Why do some allow minimal fouling and others will blow the powder in your face.
I chose the name breechplug when I joined this Forum because I always thought the BP was one of the most Important parts of the ML. So why is it taking the Manufactures so long to develope a Great One? In your Opinion wich one do you think is the best and why?
(BP)
I chose the name breechplug when I joined this Forum because I always thought the BP was one of the most Important parts of the ML. So why is it taking the Manufactures so long to develope a Great One? In your Opinion wich one do you think is the best and why?(BP)
01-06-2010, 04:25 PM
#2
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Rapid City, South Dakota
Posts: 3,732
Not having years of experience with muzzle loaders behind me, i want to make it clear i don't want to come off as any kind of an expert here.
One thing i have noticed in the brief time i have been shooting these rifles, is the Omega seems to be more reliable than the Accura, when shooting BH209. I attribute this to the shape of the barrel end of the breech plug. Both plugs appear to be set up to use pellets, however the Omega breech plug has a larger concavity in the end. To me, it seems this makes for a more reliable BH209 ignition.
So, to answer your question, i think a breech plug with a significant concavity in the end is better than one without. There is very little data available to me, so this opinion is some weak.
As far as blow back goes, the Accura is some better than the Omega, but the Omega will continue igniting the powder after it gets carboned up, and starts 'blowing back', whereas the Accura will hang fire or misfire, if the breech plug carbons. Normally, i let the Omega tell me when it is time to drill out the fire channel, but i don't dare let the Accura tell me, because it will misfire, and cause me loss of food.
One thing i have noticed in the brief time i have been shooting these rifles, is the Omega seems to be more reliable than the Accura, when shooting BH209. I attribute this to the shape of the barrel end of the breech plug. Both plugs appear to be set up to use pellets, however the Omega breech plug has a larger concavity in the end. To me, it seems this makes for a more reliable BH209 ignition.
So, to answer your question, i think a breech plug with a significant concavity in the end is better than one without. There is very little data available to me, so this opinion is some weak.
As far as blow back goes, the Accura is some better than the Omega, but the Omega will continue igniting the powder after it gets carboned up, and starts 'blowing back', whereas the Accura will hang fire or misfire, if the breech plug carbons. Normally, i let the Omega tell me when it is time to drill out the fire channel, but i don't dare let the Accura tell me, because it will misfire, and cause me loss of food.
01-06-2010, 05:24 PM
#3
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Northern Chautauqua Co. N.Y.
Posts: 2,976
Not having years of experience with muzzle loaders behind me, i want to make it clear i don't want to come off as any kind of an expert here.
One thing i have noticed in the brief time i have been shooting these rifles, is the Omega seems to be more reliable than the Accura, when shooting BH209. I attribute this to the shape of the barrel end of the breech plug. Both plugs appear to be set up to use pellets, however the Omega breech plug has a larger concavity in the end. To me, it seems this makes for a more reliable BH209 ignition.
So, to answer your question, i think a breech plug with a significant concavity in the end is better than one without. There is very little data available to me, so this opinion is some weak.
As far as blow back goes, the Accura is some better than the Omega, but the Omega will continue igniting the powder after it gets carboned up, and starts 'blowing back', whereas the Accura will hang fire or misfire, if the breech plug carbons. Normally, i let the Omega tell me when it is time to drill out the fire channel, but i don't dare let the Accura tell me, because it will misfire, and cause me loss of food.
One thing i have noticed in the brief time i have been shooting these rifles, is the Omega seems to be more reliable than the Accura, when shooting BH209. I attribute this to the shape of the barrel end of the breech plug. Both plugs appear to be set up to use pellets, however the Omega breech plug has a larger concavity in the end. To me, it seems this makes for a more reliable BH209 ignition.
So, to answer your question, i think a breech plug with a significant concavity in the end is better than one without. There is very little data available to me, so this opinion is some weak.
As far as blow back goes, the Accura is some better than the Omega, but the Omega will continue igniting the powder after it gets carboned up, and starts 'blowing back', whereas the Accura will hang fire or misfire, if the breech plug carbons. Normally, i let the Omega tell me when it is time to drill out the fire channel, but i don't dare let the Accura tell me, because it will misfire, and cause me loss of food.
Since Sabotloader talked me into using Teflon Tape on my BP, the blowback on my ACCURA's have been cut in half.
(BP)
01-06-2010, 05:35 PM
#4
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: River Ridge, LA (Suburb of New Orleans)
Posts: 10,917
The variety of possible configurations is staggering.
Start with the face of the plug. What's best - flat, concave, or convex (how about a cone - never have seen one of those)?
Then there's the length of the flash hole channel flame channel - 1/4", 3/8", 1/2" ?
How about the diameter of the flash hole channel - .035, .030, .025 ?
And the diameter of the flame channel between the primer and the flash hole channel - 3/32", 1/8", 3/16" ?
If one selects a flat face, is a larger flash channel better than a smaller one? Would it be the same with a concave face?
Someone please - select the best of each and design the perfect plug for us.
Start with the face of the plug. What's best - flat, concave, or convex (how about a cone - never have seen one of those)?
Then there's the length of the flash hole channel flame channel - 1/4", 3/8", 1/2" ?
How about the diameter of the flash hole channel - .035, .030, .025 ?
And the diameter of the flame channel between the primer and the flash hole channel - 3/32", 1/8", 3/16" ?
If one selects a flat face, is a larger flash channel better than a smaller one? Would it be the same with a concave face?
Someone please - select the best of each and design the perfect plug for us.
Last edited by Semisane; 01-06-2010 at 05:46 PM.
01-06-2010, 05:36 PM
#5
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
Breechplug
I think one of the problems is the almighty $... It costs a bunch of money to do the research and development. Then it takes a company with a lot of guts to create something new and then try to sale it to you as an advancement because they are going to increase the price of the merchandise. In this competitive world price is everything. What is worse they can not protect their upgrade even with a patent, so it can copied by someone else that makes a small modification on the original and calls it theirs, but did none of the research and development. Pretty cheap that way.
The other thing I think advancements to the BP have occurred when regular people make a change and see that it works. One of those little discoveries was creating a larger flame channel (5/32nds or slightly larger) that really has a dramatic effect on blow back from the primer.
With the advent of BH and the necessity to use those very hot primers - I think that will call for another ugrade in the BP. A normal BP will carbon and will probably develope gas cutting much quicker than ever before. I guess what I am getting at is the old addage... "necessity is the mother of invention" or something like that... As we demand more more will be developed... shoot look at what cell phones can do today that is really amazing...
I think one of the problems is the almighty $... It costs a bunch of money to do the research and development. Then it takes a company with a lot of guts to create something new and then try to sale it to you as an advancement because they are going to increase the price of the merchandise. In this competitive world price is everything. What is worse they can not protect their upgrade even with a patent, so it can copied by someone else that makes a small modification on the original and calls it theirs, but did none of the research and development. Pretty cheap that way.
The other thing I think advancements to the BP have occurred when regular people make a change and see that it works. One of those little discoveries was creating a larger flame channel (5/32nds or slightly larger) that really has a dramatic effect on blow back from the primer.
With the advent of BH and the necessity to use those very hot primers - I think that will call for another ugrade in the BP. A normal BP will carbon and will probably develope gas cutting much quicker than ever before. I guess what I am getting at is the old addage... "necessity is the mother of invention" or something like that... As we demand more more will be developed... shoot look at what cell phones can do today that is really amazing...
01-06-2010, 05:46 PM
#6
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location:
Posts: 1,408
If you want to see the obscene extremes one could go to in an effort to design the perfect BP, take a look at what the smokeless guys are doing. There is additional pressure there as the vent itself wears VERY quickly due to increased temps/pressure. It started with a removeable/replaceable ventliner, and has now progressed to improved flame channel designs, carbide inserts, primer carriers to get rid of 209s, etc etc. All of this outside the realm of the companies who made the originals.
01-06-2010, 06:19 PM
#7
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Northern Chautauqua Co. N.Y.
Posts: 2,976
If you want to see the obscene extremes one could go to in an effort to design the perfect BP, take a look at what the smokeless guys are doing. There is additional pressure there as the vent itself wears VERY quickly due to increased temps/pressure. It started with a removeable/replaceable ventliner, and has now progressed to improved flame channel designs, carbide inserts, primer carriers to get rid of 209s, etc etc. All of this outside the realm of the companies who made the originals.
(BP)
01-06-2010, 06:28 PM
#8
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Northern Chautauqua Co. N.Y.
Posts: 2,976
Breechplug
I think one of the problems is the almighty $... It costs a bunch of money to do the research and development. Then it takes a company with a lot of guts to create something new and then try to sale it to you as an advancement because they are going to increase the price of the merchandise. In this competitive world price is everything. What is worse they can not protect their upgrade even with a patent, so it can copied by someone else that makes a small modification on the original and calls it theirs, but did none of the research and development. Pretty cheap that way.
The other thing I think advancements to the BP have occurred when regular people make a change and see that it works. One of those little discoveries was creating a larger flame channel (5/32nds or slightly larger) that really has a dramatic effect on blow back from the primer.
With the advent of BH and the necessity to use those very hot primers - I think that will call for another ugrade in the BP. A normal BP will carbon and will probably develope gas cutting much quicker than ever before. I guess what I am getting at is the old addage... "necessity is the mother of invention" or something like that... As we demand more more will be developed... shoot look at what cell phones can do today that is really amazing...
I think one of the problems is the almighty $... It costs a bunch of money to do the research and development. Then it takes a company with a lot of guts to create something new and then try to sale it to you as an advancement because they are going to increase the price of the merchandise. In this competitive world price is everything. What is worse they can not protect their upgrade even with a patent, so it can copied by someone else that makes a small modification on the original and calls it theirs, but did none of the research and development. Pretty cheap that way.
The other thing I think advancements to the BP have occurred when regular people make a change and see that it works. One of those little discoveries was creating a larger flame channel (5/32nds or slightly larger) that really has a dramatic effect on blow back from the primer.
With the advent of BH and the necessity to use those very hot primers - I think that will call for another ugrade in the BP. A normal BP will carbon and will probably develope gas cutting much quicker than ever before. I guess what I am getting at is the old addage... "necessity is the mother of invention" or something like that... As we demand more more will be developed... shoot look at what cell phones can do today that is really amazing...
If there was a sealed breech design would that be better, or would it be too hard to clean the inside of the barrel, or get the carbon off the end of the BP inside the barrel.
(BP)
01-06-2010, 07:27 PM
#9
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Camp Lejeune, NC
Posts: 3,869
For me a great breechplug has 4 things... reliable ignition, little to no blowback, ease of removal, and ease of cleaning. Having played with several BP's, I can honestly say that T/C has it figured out with their Speed Breech XT.
01-06-2010, 07:38 PM
#10
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Northern Chautauqua Co. N.Y.
Posts: 2,976
(BP)