Len, your right, I did post this on another site, and didn't get much feedback. That is one of the issues I was thinking of, if I got the vtrec, it would be like getting another xtec, with just a diferent riser. The ultratec has the longer limbs and it would feel like I was trying something different. Maybe not a significant difference, but some just the same.I have learned to value your opinions as you have been a good source of information to me as well as others. Your replies are always one that I really pay close attention to. In your experience, have you noticed the ultratec getting higher speeds than the vtec? Are their any issues with either of these bows that you know about? Thanks for all your replies.