Look on the Primos website. They have several different outside the mouth reed calls that are really easy to use. They also sell a herd pak that has several calls that produce cow / calf sounds. The cow talk call that you are referring to that use the bands work excellent, but for me biting down on the cards irritates my teeth. I carry the cow talk call and two reed calls on a lanyard around my neck. With very little effort, I can be sounding like 5-6 different elk.