[quote]ORIGINAL: gleason.chapman

No, that is not well-known, that is the opinion of one man who has never shot this particular type of bullet into a deer. I respect your right to form your own opinions but if you are going to put it out there as well known I feel it's fair to point that out. As you mentioned we have a scorecard thread that is fair in that it simply states what happened from the person it happened to, and simply reading through it will show people have been having excellent reports with SWs and most of the "bad press" around them here comes from one who hasn't shot them. As I said I respect you and your right to form an opinion but I put a lot more weight with those who are reporting on actual experiences (which is why we have the Scorecard), and from someone who uses these bullets your opinions on their performance is not in line with what is shown to me and my fellow hunters in the field year after year.

I have shot dozens of deer with SWs, and the only type that EVER yielded anything resembling a "pencil-through" was the 300gr bonded version this year passing through the top of the lungs, ie only 4-5 inches of flesh with no bone. All those I personally hunt with have had similar luck.

I've shot many many deer with SWs, hit no bone, and seen plenty of evidence of expansion. IMHO I think this is an artifact of the fact that people with a bad experience tell 9 people on average and those with a good experience tell 2. If you have a bad experience with SWs you're a lot more likely to take the effort of logging onto Cabelas and complaining about it in their reviews than if you had a good one, that is a marketing FACT. Given the popularity of the bullet, you're going to see more about them than anything else. There are twice as many reports there on SWs combining the different offerings than a Barnes MZ for example,yet the rating is similar.

Those indicating shot placement have a valid point. I posted back during the season about this -- shots low through the heart or lower lungs are going to bleed well, because whether the lungs/heart or actively pumping blood out or the blood is just following gravity it is going to leave a trail. With a high lung shot, the only way you are going to get a good trail is a) you blow such a wide hole that you get good blood from the circulation through skin/muscles, b) the animal rolls over or does something to let gravity bring blood out those holes, or c) the lungs continue to function and aspirate blood out the holes.

Having cut my teeth on slug guns as well, you often can see Case A above where you simply blow such a large hole that you get blood from surrounding muscles. I've since shied away from needing to ruin so much meat as these slugs do if you hit a little forward and catch the shoulders. Bigger bullets are going to cause more peripheral bleeding around the wound, and until recently all 12-gauge slugs were 50cal or larger!

Case B depends on the animal lying down or rolling over. Often this does not happen.

Case C is IMHO fairly rare. Punch about any ML bullet through the lungs, and they quickly deflate and stop working. The heart continues to pump the blood into the chest cavity but it settles to the bottom where it is contained.

I've seen liver shots bleed better than high lungs. There is less open space for blood around the liver, it's forces out the holes. The chest is a big cavity to fill up once the lungs deflate.

I hunt a lot of open fields. I take a high lung when I can to avoid meat damage as they go down quicker than a heart shot in my experience. When I want the deer to drop for sure I shoot for the shoulder. 7 deer shot with Shockwaves over the previous two years, and 7 bang-flops.

Certainly, add it to the Shockwave Scorecard thread so we get a bigger sample.