Grumpy Tom, in this area we first lost the first week of November when they opened a shotgun season, we were not allowed to bowhunt during that week. I had no problem with that, then they extended the season and again I had no problem, with the longer shotgun season they allowed archery aswell. Now they close 2 weeks of the archery season for a special muzzleloader season in December (Brought about because of some strong lobbying by personal friends of the Minister of Natural Resources). So I have lost some hunting time, and I`m not selfish as I said I`ll allow guns to have all of September hell give them October too if their willing to leave the November woods to us stick and string guys. Seems everytime some group wants a longer season they want the peak of the rut etc. and always use the excuse " Well those bowhunters got a 3 month season so just let us have November" . Anyone who believes that the best part of the fall to deer hunt is the start of October is a bloody fool. And remember IT`S NOT EVERYONES SEASON, IT`S WHO EVER CAN WHINE THE LOUDEST AND THREATEN TO SHOOT DEER IN JUNES SEASON. Mark my word, the rifle season will be extended in Lanark County and then the muzzleloaders will want a season just for them and it will go on and on. Hell, I dared to suggest that maybe a youth season for turkeys so the 12 to 15 year old hunter apprentices could enjoy 2 days prior to the regular season and the older hunters had a fit. Comments like thats not fair letting the young kids get a head start on us etc. You want to talk selfish, remember these are the same kids who after a few bad hunts just say " thanks but no thanks, I stick with my Nintendo" If the last few years is any indication, in another 20 years there`ll be no young hunters because either the law makes it to hard or too many middle aged hunters are too caught up in the whole macho hunter attitude to take any young kids with them. I would feel far better if the above examples were rare but sadly they are far to common, to many find that they judge the success of their season by tags filled and not time spent in the outdoors with good friends.