I have fried them with the collar when they got close. Have jumped off the horse and burried their nose in the ground were thething was and beat them with a flushing whip. All to try get the dog toblink or get the hell away from them. It works on some, certainly not on the hard headed dogs. For some reason thefight is worth the pain.
I am guilty too, I have been in the moment of glory formonths of pain.