thanks guys for the help and any further advice is appreciated... im confident in the way these shoot out of my gun so its what im going to go with i guess....next season as our ML season is done.. and if they perform like they do for my family then i will be in business if not i guess i will be back on here asking about something else... still trying to decide if i want to change to the platinum series or not though..... i guess maybe ill buy some and try umm out .. who knows.