FG,

There used to circulate tales (perhaps they still circulate) that goats were put in armored personal carriers when testing the 30mm rounds from the A-10's Gatlin gun. The uranium tipped 30mm bullets pierced the carriers with small holes and exited with holes large enough, it was rumored, to SUCK the goats right out! I never witnessed it so I can not account for the tales reliability. There were also speculations at the time, (before any actual combat), that A10's wouldn't last longer than 5 minutes in combat but would detroy dozens of tanks in that span of time. It turns out that A10's weren't so easy to take down in combat, though the effectiveness of the A10 as anti-tank weapon was not underestimated.

Back to the concept of SUCKING. A bullet always has a vacuum behind it and pressured area in front of it. So I'm not surprised about a portion of the stomach being sucked out of the cavity. Anyone who has hunted rabbits and squirrels has found guts hanging out too when body shots were taken. Same principle.

As for PB's effectiveness in killing game, it depends solely on impact speed and shot placement. I can now also vouch that PB's are very effective projectiles when used like a sportsman should use them. The 405 did the job for me with just 70 grains of 3f Goex. With in 100 yards, I'd put it up against 100 grains of 777 and 250 shockwave. Now I would not maverick shots. I wouldn't shoot anus's, spines, or heads. But give me shot for a pass through the vital area, everything except where the bullet entry will strike with glancing impact a scapula (frontally quartered scapula shot are no-nos with any bullet and any rifle, bullets can ricochet on things as soft as water, so they can and in fact do on bone also) and I guarantee you that my deer will be just as dead as his and just as fast also.

A large all lead hollowpoint impacting at optimum velocity (less than 1300 fps) is more efficient at getting its energy and momentum into the vital cavity than a lighter faster moving bullet. A high velocity projectile MUST BE jacketed, or it can not get into a large game animal with sufficient integrity to exit. It will just mush into an inverted cup and fragment. So a jacket will control expansion and allow the bullet to enter the vitals. Even so, it will do this less efficiently than a slower, heavier bullet with the same impact energy.

There are two reasons for this. First higher speed at impact will result in a greater proportion of energy being dissipated at right angles to bullet flight. Second, the larger bullet has superior momentum and with retain a greater proportion of that momentum (and energy) allowing for a larger wound channel.

That said, given the limits of velocity one needs to impose on all lead projectiles, it is clear that to achieve higher impact energy one can only go with heavier projectiles. While with jacketed bullets, one just adds powder. Even so, there is diminishing returns and ultimately, opposite effects can be realized if the impact velocity exceeds the design of the jacketed bullet. Under enough velocity, they too will behave like powerbelts at 1400 fps. Too much velocity simply ruins any bullet's performance. The advantage of jacketed bullets is not terminal performance perse, RATHER, it is better terminal performance at the velocities required to achieve flatter trajectory.

All lead hollowpoints are not for everyone. They are for persons who want to use an relatively primitive technology. They would be persons who may enjoy the challenge of getting close to their quarry. Folks who should refrain from using them would be those who want to maverick shots like head shots, anus shots, and spine shots or to take shots over 120 yards. It would be far better to have a scoped rifle with a shockwave or gold-dot for that.

I think you are on the right track recommending the 80 grain limit for PB's.

Phil