srwshooter,I got good groups with all the primers I tried, I use the regular win 209 and no longer have that problem, I have a friend that uses CCi 209 and he no longer has that problem; I believe the longer flash tunnel and touch hole require hotter primers. Neither one of us has "crudring" as such, are you? I believe the groups are a bit better with the hotter primer. I notice no one has had any lock up problems like some of the Encores, I considered a prohunter before I got my Triumph, I am glad I went the way I did. Lee